Sohal no eating - Page 2

HumbleFish · 05/13/2019, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

How long should we rise the copper up to 1.75ppm? 48, 72 or 96 hours?

If starting at 1.0ppm, then 48 hours is fine.

Tanthaitrung · 05/13/2019, 03:47 PM

Thank you very much HumbleFish. You help me so much

aikenreefkeeper · 05/14/2019, 05:21 AM

Dear Humble Fish,

I have a few questions along the same line if you don't mind.

1: I have Cupramine on hand. It states on the bottle that .5 is the recommended dosage.
Can you run this all the way up to 1.75 ppm?
2: Can metronidazole be used in conjunction with Cupramine?
3: Is there species of fish that are sensitive to copper? If so what options are available for these.

Thanks,

Dean

Tanthaitrung · 05/14/2019, 06:32 AM

Hi Dean,

1) There are 2 kinds of copper, chelated and ionic. Coppersafe and Copper Power are chelated copper, that’s safer and HumbleFish like running at 1.75ppm. Cupramine is ionic copper and the direction of Seachem is 0.5ppm. If you want to treat with copper, must have a Hana HI702 checker to keep your level exactly.

2) Yes

3) Yes, I have a link from another forum, that talks about Fish and Treatment Guidelines (with chart), but can not share here. Give me your email, I will share it.

Good luck

HumbleFish · 05/14/2019, 10:21 AM

^^ Agree

Fish that are sensitive to copper (e.g. dragonets, lionfish, puffers, eels, sharks, rays, etc.) are usually good candidates for Chloroquine phosphate instead.

Tanthaitrung · 05/14/2019, 03:55 PM

Hi HumbleFish

I have some more questions:

- Can I buy the metronidazole 250mg medicine from pharmacy? If so, the 250 mg tablets have an equivalence of 150 mg metronidazole base?

- CP can be susceptible to biodegradation by nitrate?

- Copper, CP and metronidazole are harmful to biofilter?

- I have a Marine Betta. Could you please tell me, copper or CP is safer for him?

- Seachem told me, when using Cupramine no need to turn off skimmer. Is that right?

Regards
Khanh

HumbleFish · 05/14/2019, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

Can I buy the metronidazole 250mg medicine from pharmacy? If so, the 250 mg tablets have an equivalence of 150 mg metronidazole base?

Yes; dose according to the base.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

CP can be susceptible to biodegradation by nitrate?

No; by bacteria in the tank and especially any biofilm.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

Copper, CP and metronidazole are harmful to biofilter?

Somewhat, but if bacteria levels are strong they will quickly propagate and bounce back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

I have a Marine Betta. Could you please tell me, copper or CP is safer for him?

Both are fine. CP is probably a little safer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

Seachem told me, when using Cupramine no need to turn off skimmer. Is that right?

Yes, but your copper level will drop slightly every time you empty the skimmer cup.

Tanthaitrung · 05/14/2019, 11:14 PM

Big thanks HumbleFish, you’re always here to help reefers

Tanthaitrung · 05/14/2019, 11:15 PM

Big thanks HumbleFish, you’re always here to help reefers

Tanthaitrung · 05/17/2019, 07:55 PM

Hi HumbleFish

I’ve got a pair of Black Storm Clown fish. I want to quarantine them with CP, but they’re so small (1 inch long). Do you think they can pass the treatment?

Thanks
Khanh

HumbleFish · 05/17/2019, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

Hi HumbleFish

I’ve got a pair of Black Storm Clown fish. I want to quarantine them with CP, but they’re so small (1 inch long). Do you think they can pass the treatment?

Thanks
Khanh

They should be fine in either CP or copper.

Tanthaitrung · 05/17/2019, 09:24 PM

Thanks again HumbleFish ��

Have a nice day.
Khanh

Tanthaitrung · 05/25/2019, 06:27 PM

Hi HumbleFish,

For quarantine tank, I’m dosing 3ml of vodka daily to control NO3, PO4

Can CP be susceptible to biodegradation by vodka?

Best regards
Khanh

HumbleFish · 05/25/2019, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

Hi HumbleFish,

For quarantine tank, I’m dosing 3ml of vodka daily to control NO3, PO4

Can CP be susceptible to biodegradation by vodka?

Best regards
Khanh

You definitely don't want to mix carbon dosing with CP.

1. Increased bacteria load increases the chances of biodegradation.

2. Mixing CP with ethyl alcohol increases the chances of a bacterial bloom (cloudy water) occurring, which can use up available oxygen and your fish die due to asphyxiation.

In short, don't worry about NO3 + PO4 in QT. Only worry about ammonia and to a lesser extent pH.

Tanthaitrung · 05/25/2019, 07:01 PM

Thanks so much HumbleFish

HumbleFish · 05/25/2019, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

Thanks so much HumbleFish

You're very welcome

Tanthaitrung · 05/27/2019, 08:06 PM

Hi HumbleFish,

I saw the information from your site, that we can fallow 76 days to treat ich, 6 weeks to treat velvet ...

But my friend tells me it can be shortener if keeping the temperature around 30-32C. Is that truth?

Best regards
Khanh

HumbleFish · 05/28/2019, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

Hi HumbleFish,

I saw the information from your site, that we can fallow 76 days to treat ich, 6 weeks to treat velvet ...

But my friend tells me it can be shortener if keeping the temperature around 30-32C. Is that truth?

Best regards
Khanh

It's most likely correct, because the opposite (colder temps) has been proven to slow down most parasite's life cycle. However, I haven't seen any scientific studies which conclusively support that assertion.

P.S. 30-32C could harm any corals/inverts you have, and possibly even nitrifying bacteria. Running your tank @ 28C during the fallow period would be safer.

Tanthaitrung · 05/28/2019, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HumbleFish

It's most likely correct, because the opposite (colder temps) has been proven to slow down most parasite's life cycle. However, I haven't seen any scientific studies which conclusively support that assertion.

P.S. 30-32C could harm any corals/inverts you have, and possibly even nitrifying bacteria. Running your tank @ 28C during the fallow period would be safer.

Thanks again HumbleFish

Tanthaitrung · 05/30/2019, 07:57 PM

Dear HumbleFish,

I read this information from aquariumstoredepot:

If you have an infected fish and you need treatment now we highly recommended going to your LFS and obtaining Copper. Most of the diseases Chloroquine phosphate treats are extremely deadly and can kill a fish overnight.

https://aquariumstoredepot.com/colle...uine-phosphate

- That means we use CP for quarantine only, can not use CP for treatment. Am I right?
- CP is heat & light sensitive. So when treating with CP, can we turn on the light?
- In Vietnam, the temperature is around 29-30C. Does it impact CP?

2 weeks treatment with CP is the information from here:
https://humble.fish/quarantine/

10 days treatment with CP is the information from here:
https://humble.fish/chloroquine-phosphate/

- Which one is correct?

Best regards
Khanh

HumbleFish · 05/31/2019, 11:35 AM

CP treats the following parasites: Ich, velvet, brook, uronema.

Brook & uronema both have a direct lifecycle; meaning those parasites live, feed & reproduce right on the fish (no encysted stage). Therefore, CP at therapeutic strength should kill those in a matter of days.

Velvet trophonts can only remain on a fish for a maximum of 4 days, for ich it's 7 days. (This is according to all published studies.) Once the trophonts all drop off, the presence of therapeutic strength CP in the water shields the fish from reinfection. Since it will kill (or mortally damage) any free swimmers before they can attach to a fish.

So, technically on Day 8 you can transfer the fish into another QT. 10 days provides a little more buffer, 14 days is even better.

^^ Note: The above only applies if you are working with two QTs, 10 feet apart, and nothing gets transferred between them other than the fish. If you only have 1 QT, best to treat for 30 days and then do water changes/run carbon to remove the medication from the water.

Tanthaitrung · 05/31/2019, 07:16 PM

Sorry about my English. But the information from aquariumstoredepot that still confuses me:

If you have an infected fish and you need treatment now we highly recommended going to your LFS and obtaining Copper. Most of the diseases Chloroquine phosphate treats are extremely deadly and can kill a fish overnight

- That means we use CP for prophylactic treatment only. Because CP will kill the infected fish?

- CP is heat & light sensitive. So when treating with CP, can we turn on the light? 29-30C can impact CP?

Thanks
Khanh

HumbleFish · 05/31/2019, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

That means we use CP for prophylactic treatment only. Because CP will kill the infected fish?

IME; CP is safer to use on most fish than copper. The three exceptions are Flasher Wrasses, Anthias and Hippo Tangs. These all appear to be intolerant of CP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanthaitrung

CP is heat & light sensitive. So when treating with CP, can we turn on the light? 29-30C can impact CP?

Only the powder itself is heat & light sensitive, you can run a light once it has been dosed in water.

29-30C is a bit on the warm side for treating fish, as there is less oxygen in water at higher temps and any medications you dose will also reduce available oxygen. Quarantining at 26-27C would probably be safer.

Tanthaitrung · 05/31/2019, 08:49 PM

Thanks so much HumbleFish

Tanthaitrung · 06/14/2019, 04:02 AM

Dear HumbleFish,

Could you please tell me where to buy pure chloroquine phosphate?

Can I buy from ebay?

Thanks
Khanh

05/14/2019, 06:32 AM	#29
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Hi Dean, 1) There are 2 kinds of copper, chelated and ionic. Coppersafe and Copper Power are chelated copper, that’s safer and HumbleFish like running at 1.75ppm. Cupramine is ionic copper and the direction of Seachem is 0.5ppm. If you want to treat with copper, must have a Hana HI702 checker to keep your level exactly. 2) Yes 3) Yes, I have a link from another forum, that talks about Fish and Treatment Guidelines (with chart), but can not share here. Give me your email, I will share it. Good luck Last edited by Tanthaitrung; 05/14/2019 at 06:39 AM.

05/13/2019, 03:47 PM	#27
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Thank you very much HumbleFish. You help me so much

05/14/2019, 05:21 AM	#28
aikenreefkeeper Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 121	Dear Humble Fish, I have a few questions along the same line if you don't mind. 1: I have Cupramine on hand. It states on the bottle that .5 is the recommended dosage. Can you run this all the way up to 1.75 ppm? 2: Can metronidazole be used in conjunction with Cupramine? 3: Is there species of fish that are sensitive to copper? If so what options are available for these. Thanks, Dean

05/14/2019, 10:21 AM	#30
HumbleFish Moved On Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 4,757	^^ Agree Fish that are sensitive to copper (e.g. dragonets, lionfish, puffers, eels, sharks, rays, etc.) are usually good candidates for Chloroquine phosphate instead.

05/14/2019, 03:55 PM	#31
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Hi HumbleFish I have some more questions: - Can I buy the metronidazole 250mg medicine from pharmacy? If so, the 250 mg tablets have an equivalence of 150 mg metronidazole base? - CP can be susceptible to biodegradation by nitrate? - Copper, CP and metronidazole are harmful to biofilter? - I have a Marine Betta. Could you please tell me, copper or CP is safer for him? - Seachem told me, when using Cupramine no need to turn off skimmer. Is that right? Regards Khanh

05/14/2019, 11:14 PM	#33
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Big thanks HumbleFish, you’re always here to help reefers

05/14/2019, 11:15 PM	#34
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Big thanks HumbleFish, you’re always here to help reefers

05/17/2019, 07:55 PM	#35
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Hi HumbleFish I’ve got a pair of Black Storm Clown fish. I want to quarantine them with CP, but they’re so small (1 inch long). Do you think they can pass the treatment? Thanks Khanh

05/17/2019, 09:24 PM	#37
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Thanks again HumbleFish �� Have a nice day. Khanh

05/25/2019, 06:27 PM	#38
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Hi HumbleFish, For quarantine tank, I’m dosing 3ml of vodka daily to control NO3, PO4 Can CP be susceptible to biodegradation by vodka? Best regards Khanh

05/25/2019, 07:01 PM	#40
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Thanks so much HumbleFish

05/27/2019, 08:06 PM	#42
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Hi HumbleFish, I saw the information from your site, that we can fallow 76 days to treat ich, 6 weeks to treat velvet ... But my friend tells me it can be shortener if keeping the temperature around 30-32C. Is that truth? Best regards Khanh

05/30/2019, 07:57 PM	#45
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Dear HumbleFish, I read this information from aquariumstoredepot: If you have an infected fish and you need treatment now we highly recommended going to your LFS and obtaining Copper. Most of the diseases Chloroquine phosphate treats are extremely deadly and can kill a fish overnight. https://aquariumstoredepot.com/colle...uine-phosphate - That means we use CP for quarantine only, can not use CP for treatment. Am I right? - CP is heat & light sensitive. So when treating with CP, can we turn on the light? - In Vietnam, the temperature is around 29-30C. Does it impact CP? 2 weeks treatment with CP is the information from here: https://humble.fish/quarantine/ 10 days treatment with CP is the information from here: https://humble.fish/chloroquine-phosphate/ - Which one is correct? Best regards Khanh

05/31/2019, 11:35 AM	#46
HumbleFish Moved On Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 4,757	CP treats the following parasites: Ich, velvet, brook, uronema. Brook & uronema both have a direct lifecycle; meaning those parasites live, feed & reproduce right on the fish (no encysted stage). Therefore, CP at therapeutic strength should kill those in a matter of days. Velvet trophonts can only remain on a fish for a maximum of 4 days, for ich it's 7 days. (This is according to all published studies.) Once the trophonts all drop off, the presence of therapeutic strength CP in the water shields the fish from reinfection. Since it will kill (or mortally damage) any free swimmers before they can attach to a fish. So, technically on Day 8 you can transfer the fish into another QT. 10 days provides a little more buffer, 14 days is even better. ^^ Note: The above only applies if you are working with two QTs, 10 feet apart, and nothing gets transferred between them other than the fish. If you only have 1 QT, best to treat for 30 days and then do water changes/run carbon to remove the medication from the water.

05/31/2019, 07:16 PM	#47
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Sorry about my English. But the information from aquariumstoredepot that still confuses me: If you have an infected fish and you need treatment now we highly recommended going to your LFS and obtaining Copper. Most of the diseases Chloroquine phosphate treats are extremely deadly and can kill a fish overnight - That means we use CP for prophylactic treatment only. Because CP will kill the infected fish? - CP is heat & light sensitive. So when treating with CP, can we turn on the light? 29-30C can impact CP? Thanks Khanh

05/31/2019, 08:49 PM	#49
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Thanks so much HumbleFish

06/14/2019, 04:02 AM	#50
Tanthaitrung Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 565	Dear HumbleFish, Could you please tell me where to buy pure chloroquine phosphate? Can I buy from ebay? Thanks Khanh