Base Rock/Dry Rock Curing

[SereneAquatic]

1. What temperature does Dry Rock need to be cured at?

We have no 'live' rock going into our tank, we are starting with dry rock and adding the bacteria with Red Sea startup kit.

2. Do you HAVE to use some actual live rock to start the tank or will the Red Sea bacteria be enough?

3. If the rock you chose for your display tank is more dense and not as porous, will a bag of bio balls in the sump be enough to promote good bacteria growth? How do you know if you have enough available surface area?

[billdogg]

If it is truly clean, dry rock, it doesn't need to be "cured" The term "curing" refers to shipped in live rock that undoubtedly has some die-off. Whatever temperature you keep your tank at is fine. For me, that's 77 or so degrees.

Many people (myself included) start tanks using 100% dry rock. I have never added bacteria in a bottle either. That being said, using a piece or two of live rock from a trusted source can certainly speed up the process.

Nothing will beat good, porous rock for providing a great place for denitrifying bacteria to grow. Bioballs are not the best choice for adding surface area - there are several brands of artificial "rock" that would better serve your purpose (Marinepure is the first to spring to mind), but once again, real, porous reef rock cannot be beaten.

You will know you have enough when your tank is cycled and you add fish. If the Ammonia and Nitrate remain at 0, you have enough. It is entirely dependent on the bioload of your system

[SereneAquatic]

Originally Posted by billdogg

If it is truly clean, dry rock, it doesn't need to be "cured" The term "curing" refers to shipped in live rock that undoubtedly has some die-off. Whatever temperature you keep your tank at is fine. For me, that's 77 or so degrees.

The rock is dry, for sure, but it isn't clean. We are able to see twigs or some kind of dried up plant, dirt and possibly some kind of dried larvae on the rocks themselves in some places. We figured it would be best to try to get rid of that as much as possible, so we washed it off as best we could and stuck it into the trash can with the heater and power head. As soon as we got it wet, it smelled a little and some debris started floating up out of the holes and crevices. Perhaps it won't take as long to clean up as live rock?

[sirclintler]

I started with used dry rock and didn't follow the 6 p's. It is best to clean off all of the old junk as best you can some folks use acid and a scrub brush. Or pressure washer. If you leave the dead in the rock. Once it get wet it will start to rot (Hence the smell) all that rot turns into Po4 which took me a year to get it all out of the rock. But I was using pukanni. I wouldn't use bio balls I would store some good rock in your sump or get some ceramic media. Or just buy some good rock

[JUNBUG361]

Agree to what said ^^

[oldhead]

Originally Posted by SereneAquatic

The rock is dry, for sure, but it isn't clean. We are able to see twigs or some kind of dried up plant, dirt and possibly some kind of dried larvae on the rocks themselves in some places. We figured it would be best to try to get rid of that as much as possible, so we washed it off as best we could and stuck it into the trash can with the heater and power head. As soon as we got it wet, it smelled a little and some debris started floating up out of the holes and crevices. Perhaps it won't take as long to clean up as live rock?

Does this rock happen to be pukani? I just started curing 40lbs for my tank upgrade. I had to get my aquascape figured out first.

[SereneAquatic]

Originally Posted by oldhead

Does this rock happen to be pukani? I just started curing 40lbs for my tank upgrade. I had to get my aquascape figured out first.

I can't remember the name, but most of it was not. We picked a variety of types. Maybe you can help identify?

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[billdogg]

As I thought, Holey Rock. Dense, not as porous as might be desired, but plenty of little holes for critters to hide in. My 120DT is about 1/2 Holey, 1/2 other reef rock.

[SereneAquatic]

Originally Posted by billdogg

As I thought, Holey Rock. Dense, not as porous as might be desired, but plenty of little holes for critters to hide in. My 120DT is about 1/2 Holey, 1/2 other reef rock.

Nice call, you nailed it back then on description alone lol.

The rocks have been in heated, salty (presumably... Had to buy it from the LFS and a kid who glazed over when I asked about the water) RODI and circulating in the garbage can for about a week now. We just got our chemical test kits in the mail last night so I am going to see if there is any sign of organics dying off tonight or tomorrow morning. So far though, each time I check it, it just smells like dirt. That doesn't sound like the smelly cess pool that many describe when curing rock.

I know dry rock has much less to break down, but is it possible that this will never do that?

Did I miss a step?

We plan to build the aqua scape and get all the rock in the tank and then use the red sea bacteria starter kit to get things going once we know there isn't anything gross in all the rock tunnels.

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[mcgyvr]

No need to cure that rock..
Its clean enough from the looks of it..

[billdogg]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

No need to cure that rock..
Its clean enough from the looks of it..

^^^This^^^

Build your aquascape and get water in your tank. The only thing you might find in your testing at this point is Phosphate, and even that's iffy.

[SereneAquatic]

We are not quite ready to put the rock in the tank yet... but I think I have a small diatom bloom in the trash can?? Right now you can see it best on the powerhead, but it was more evident on the rocks yesterday than it is today for these pictures.

We got our test kits in the mail so I tried my first go at it...

Ammonia - .3
Nitrite - .5
Nitrate - 7?
Ph 8.1... This was hard to read... Color doesn't seem much like any on the card.

Since it has to stay in the can... Do I do a water change or leave it alone?

Will it go through that cycle again when we get it in the tank?

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[crawlerman]

Since it is in the can and already starting to cycle, I'd just let it finish the cycle in the can before any water changes. You should test the phosphate level after the cycle. If phosphate level is high, it's easier to take care of in the garbage can via water changes, GFO, lanthanum chloride, or whatever your phosphate remover of choice is. Once you get the phosphates down then add them to the tank. Not removing the phosphates will guarantee a green hair algae problem in the near future.

[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by SereneAquatic

Will it go through that cycle again when we get it in the tank?

A cycle is when sufficient colonies of bacteria begin to grow/populate on the surfaces of rock/sand,etc... in an aquarium..
That bacteria is what makes rock "live"..
As you are "curing" rock that bacterial population is also starting to increase just like it would with a "cycle"..

Most bacteria is not free floating in the water and instead is sticking to any surface..
As long as you don't do something to kill the bacteria thats growing on the rock now then NO you will not have another cycle as you will bring that bacteria along with the rock when you transfer it into your tank..

And as long as that bacterial population is "strong" enough to handle any ammonia load added to the tank then all is good and that toxic ammonia will quickly be converted to less toxic forms (nitrites then to nitrates)

[SereneAquatic]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

A cycle is when sufficient colonies of bacteria begin to grow/populate on the surfaces of rock/sand,etc... in an aquarium..
That bacteria is what makes rock "live"..
As you are "curing" rock that bacterial population is also starting to increase just like it would with a "cycle"..

Most bacteria is not free floating in the water and instead is sticking to any surface..
As long as you don't do something to kill the bacteria thats growing on the rock now then NO you will not have another cycle as you will bring that bacteria along with the rock when you transfer it into your tank..

And as long as that bacterial population is "strong" enough to handle any ammonia load added to the tank then all is good and that toxic ammonia will quickly be converted to less toxic forms (nitrites then to nitrates)

Thank you. How long can the rock be out of water and not be impacted? We need to epoxy a couple of pieces and get the structure ready to go in the tank. Is say, an hour or two going to do any harm?

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[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by SereneAquatic

Thank you. How long can the rock be out of water and not be impacted? We need to epoxy a couple of pieces and get the structure ready to go in the tank. Is say, an hour or two going to do any harm?

A few hours (1 or 2) should not cause much if any die off of bacteria..
Some but it won't be a big problem..

[DreadCapn]

Some people have had success with Redsea, and I've become a big fan of their test kits, but the $60 or so I spent on the 2 Mature Reef Startup kits is $60 I wish I had back.

To work properly, you are supposed to start with live rock and add fish fairly quickly. I did neither of those, which may have been my problem in not being able to get the kit to work satisfactorily, but the kits didn't work well for me.

Week 1 everything was fine, I had an ammonia and nitrate spike before everything went back to 0. Everything went to hell in week 2, though, where my ammonia spiked again and stayed that way for several weeks. After trying several different solutions, the Biospira product that everyone always says always works is what worked for me.

I'm still not sure what happened, but I think it was the Noxpox outcompeting the nitrifying bacteria (in researching I read that this is a thing that can apparently happen), essentially eliminating the later.

YMMV, but I've yet to see anyone say that the Biospira didn't work.

[SereneAquatic]

Originally Posted by DreadCapn

Some people have had success with Redsea, and I've become a big fan of their test kits, but the $60 or so I spent on the 2 Mature Reef Startup kits is $60 I wish I had back.

To work properly, you are supposed to start with live rock and add fish fairly quickly. I did neither of those, which may have been my problem in not being able to get the kit to work satisfactorily, but the kits didn't work well for me.

Week 1 everything was fine, I had an ammonia and nitrate spike before everything went back to 0. Everything went to hell in week 2, though, where my ammonia spiked again and stayed that way for several weeks. After trying several different solutions, the Biospira product that everyone always says always works is what worked for me.

I'm still not sure what happened, but I think it was the Noxpox outcompeting the nitrifying bacteria (in researching I read that this is a thing that can apparently happen), essentially eliminating the later.

YMMV, but I've yet to see anyone say that the Biospira didn't work.

I bought the red sea starter and the biospira... Not sure why I got both except BLACK FRIDAY! Maybe I will just go with the latter...

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[SereneAquatic]

Hrm. The guy at the local fish store kind of laughed when I told him that the rock seemed to be cycling in the trash can. He said "It can't cycle until there are fish with it in the tank" I thought he was wrong so I got out the test kits and on 12/3 I got

Ammonia at .3
Nitrite at .5
Nitrate at 7

Then on 12/7 I got

Ammonia at 0
Nitrite at .9
Nitrate at 10
Alk at 8

Doesn't this mean the rock is indeed cycling?? He thought I was crazy.

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[crawlerman]

Yes it is cycling, you do not need a fish to cycle. That was the old/cruel way.

[lapin]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

A cycle is when sufficient colonies of bacteria begin to grow/populate on the surfaces of rock/sand,etc... in an aquarium..
That bacteria is what makes rock "live"..
As you are "curing" rock that bacterial population is also starting to increase just like it would with a "cycle"..

Most bacteria is not free floating in the water and instead is sticking to any surface..
As long as you don't do something to kill the bacteria thats growing on the rock now then NO you will not have another cycle as you will bring that bacteria along with the rock when you transfer it into your tank..

And as long as that bacterial population is "strong" enough to handle any ammonia load added to the tank then all is good and that toxic ammonia will quickly be converted to less toxic forms (nitrites then to nitrates)

Yes your rock is cycling in the trash can. Bacteria will grow as along there is water present. If it is saltwater you have in the can, those bacteria will still be alive when you place the rock into your saltwater tank. You will need to feed the bacteria in the can. A bit of flake food will work. As you add fish to your tank after it cycled,you will see little spikes as more and more bacteria grow and consume the left over food and poo.

[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by SereneAquatic

Hrm. The guy at the local fish store kind of laughed when I told him that the rock seemed to be cycling in the trash can. He said "It can't cycle until there are fish with it in the tank" I thought he was wrong so I got out the test kits and on 12/3 I got


Doesn't this mean the rock is indeed cycling?? He thought I was crazy.

Another lesson learned for you.. The people are the LFS don't always know what they are talking about sadly..

Its always best to know what you are doing/want,etc.. before you go in..