Algae Scrubber Basics

[Wally.B]

Originally Posted by SantaMonica

Algae absorbs free (non-complexed) copper, making it unavailable to other organisms.

Is that the kind of copper I have in my system by introducing a corroded/leached Copper metal film into my tank VS a liquid livestock disease treatment like Cupramine??.

[Wally.B]

BTW.

If need be (ie Sensitive Test Corals don't do well in the tank after Copper Cleanup).

I found a interesting product from Triton (A treatment called "Triton Detox" that will bind to Copper and other Toxic Metals) and the simply add Carbon and they are removed.
Removes metals down to single digits in ppb, vs Carbon/GFO which will remove only down to ppm.

http://uniquecorals.com/dry-goods/tr...tox-100ml.html

[sensei]

Originally Posted by Floyd R Turbo

It kind of looks like you have a flow issue, but at the same time that yellow growth would indicate low nutrients + too much light...hmmmm.....

Well there is this thought process too: the yellow algae occurs (generally) when you have too much light compared to delivered nutrients. So the answer is usually, deliver more nutrients (increase flow or feed more, I prefer the former) or reduce light.

However, if you get decent overall growth at a given level (50%) then you can run that level for a longer period of time and you should be OK as this maintains the same rate of intensity (to get all techy, photons per unit time) so you have the same adsorption rate, just for a longer time. This would tend to cause an overall nutrient level drop but it's over a longer period of time, instead of being more instantaneous. If that makes sense. If you were running 14 hrs/day and then 18 hrs/day and growth maintained, this is why. So in theory you can run 24/7 at that intensity and you shouldn't get yellow. Then you can increase intensity in smaller increments and see where your "yellowing" point is, and stay below that.

What's you N in that 600?

N and P in that 150?

Floyd,
you were right it was a flow issue. I increased flow and I got no yellow, so I increased 4 more hours of led in ATS per day and after one week there was no yellow. Then I increased led intensity to 75% and I checked 3 days later and there was no yellow.
I had to harvest after those 3 days because algae had already 14 days in screen so I am in a new cycle now and I have ATS running 18hrs at 75% intensity.

This is my situation:
I have a 2 cube ATS installed in a 600g system. I have 13 fish in the system 8 of them are tangs 4 to 8 inches in size. I am feeding 3 cubes x day. I will add 5 fairry wrasses next week to my system so fish load will be 18 fish. I need to upgrade the scrubber to a 4 cube ATS, my questions are:

1.- I am planning to install the new 4 cube ATS and leave the 2 cube ATS running in same tank at same time, will having the 2 cube ATS installed give any problem for the maturing of the screen in the 4 cube new ATS?

2.- in my DT I have 4 Metal Halide 400W lamps so there is plenty of light in dt. I do not have GHA in dt because tangs pick on any algae they see in dt.
My problem is that a film algae grows in the glass and rocks very quickly. I can see the algae in glass the same day I clean the glass in the morning.
It seems that the 2 cube ATS is not so strong to avoid the algae in the glass.
If I add the 4 ATS cube on top of the 2 cube ATS are the 2 ATS together likelly to erradicate algae in the glass??

any advices?

Thanks

[Floyd R Turbo]

1.- I am planning to install the new 4 cube ATS and leave the 2 cube ATS running in same tank at same time, will having the 2 cube ATS installed give any problem for the maturing of the screen in the 4 cube new ATS?

Not if there is enough nutrients for both - they shouldn't end up competing with each other, generally. Eventually you would want to try and "match" them up as far as flow (per inch) and photoperiod/intensity, but I think only if you started to notice that one was doing markedly better than the other.

If I add the 4 ATS cube on top of the 2 cube ATS are the 2 ATS together likelly to erradicate algae in the glass??

Honestly your guess is as good as mine. I've seen systems where you don't have to clean the glass ever, and others where you have to clean daily with no rhyme or reason to it, scrubber or not. All you can do is try and observe

[jason2459]

I have to clean my glass at least every other day.

[Wally.B]

HOW DO YOU PROPERLY SANITIZE/STERILIZE a SCRUBBER before Transfer to another tank?

So with my new In-Sump Scrubber, I wish to move over my old Algae Scrubber into another tank. That tank is Nuisance Algae spotless, (even with High Nitrates 25-50ppm). Corals Zoa's, Acans, LPS seem to like the conditions.

But since I feed this tank a lot (Corals and Fish), I know it's a ticking time bomb for a algae bloom eventually. (Even though I have a ton of live rock, and good skimmer)

I recently noticed a patch of Turf Algae growing (a bit stronger) where it has grown before. I dare not touch it since it must be controlling things.



I would consider this Algae patch as a Early warning.
I could do more water changes to bring down NO3. Or consider things like NPX pellets (which I am weary about).

So I wish to move that extra scrubber over to this tank.
BUT I don't want anything transferred between tanks (ANYTHING, ie Possible Cyano, Hitchhikers, or Any Hair Algae etc)

How can I clean the scrubber, screens, to 100% sanitized?

Vinegar? Hydrogen Peroxide? Boil in hot water? Then dry for a while?

[Floyd R Turbo]

Scrub screen with stiff brush under hot water

Bleach & water, let sit overnight, then rinse thoroughly & let soak in RODI for a day just as a precaution. Concentration is not really a big deal, maybe a "glug" of bleach for every 2 gallons, should be plenty.

[karimwassef]

Why do you need to sanitize a scrubber at all?

[Saltwatercoral2]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B014Z...led+grow+bulbs

How about that light for a 6 x 5 screen?

[2smokes]

Originally Posted by Saltwatercoral2

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B014Z...led+grow+bulbs

How about that light for a 6 x 5 screen?

Its good,but you have to keep it cloose to the screen like 1 and a half inch distance.

[sensei]

is it possible for a ATS to outcompete bryopsis and bubble algae??
if yes, can you explain how please?

Thanks

[Wally.B]

Originally Posted by karimwassef

Why do you need to sanitize a scrubber at all?

I mentioned my reasons two posts above.
I have two tanks that I like to keep isolated from each other. From any type of cross-contamination.
One tank with Scurbber had some spots of Cyano, GHA, the other tank has been Cyano free for two years. Thus when moving a ATS from one tank to another, I want it contaminant free from Cyano, GHA, etc
I just moved it after Turbo's recommendation. That bit of bleach really worked. Looks like new (I also soaked it in vinegar before bleach to remove the coralline/calcification).
Always rinsed well since Bleach and Acids (Vinegar) or Ammonia's should never be mixed!! Toxic poisonous gases are created.

[Floyd R Turbo]

Originally Posted by Saltwatercoral2

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B014Z...led+grow+bulbs

How about that light for a 6 x 5 screen?

Looks like the 2W version, which would have more punch

Originally Posted by 2smokes

Its good,but you have to keep it cloose to the screen like 1 and a half inch distance.

I don't know if I would do that, unless you remove the front bezel and lenses, and with it that close, you would have to protect it will from salt spray.

I would try this one and monkey with the distance, start at 4"-6" away with the bezel on and see how well the colors blend and spread out (maybe test on a white piece of paper on the table). You have to find a "sweet spot" where it's not too far away to lose intensity but not too close to cause photosaturation - which is a bigger problem when getting the screen started, so start relatively far away (akin to dimming).

Once you get growth kicking in (give it at least 10 days) then you can move it closer one inch at a time (then wait a week or two)...ease into it.

[jason2459]

Going to try running my scrubber LEDs 24/7. I had it up to 18hours on.

Should I bump it straight to 24 hours or stage it to 20- 22 hours for a couple weeks first?

Production has been awesome so far.

[Apotack]

Originally Posted by Wally.B

I mentioned my reasons two posts above.
I have two tanks that I like to keep isolated from each other. From any type of cross-contamination.
One tank with Scurbber had some spots of Cyano, GHA, the other tank has been Cyano free for two years. Thus when moving a ATS from one tank to another, I want it contaminant free from Cyano, GHA, etc
I just moved it after Turbo's recommendation. That bit of bleach really worked. Looks like new (I also soaked it in vinegar before bleach to remove the coralline/calcification).
Always rinsed well since Bleach and Acids (Vinegar) or Ammonia's should never be mixed!! Toxic poisonous gases are created.

Um, make another scrubber.

[Floyd R Turbo]

Originally Posted by jason2459

Going to try running my scrubber LEDs 24/7. I had it up to 18hours on.

Should I bump it straight to 24 hours or stage it to 20- 22 hours for a couple weeks first?

Production has been awesome so far.

There's no harm in easing into it. If you have a sufficient bioload (lots of fish, lots of feeding) then generally speaking, it's hard to over-drive a scrubber, at least quickly. It might happen over time but IME it's usually a system that is moderately stocked and fed where running a scrubber full bore can lead to "hitting the wall" quickly.

Originally Posted by Apotack

Um, make another scrubber.

Kinda late, but I don't necessarily disagree!!

[SantaMonica]

is it possible for a ATS to outcompete bryopsis and bubble algae

Yes, a scrubber can out-compete any nuisance algae, if strong enough and if run enough months. Bryopsis is hard because it has roots which get nutrients from inside the rock, so it can last long after nutrients in the water are low. And Bubble stores nutrients inside the bubble, so it can last longer too. So you have to keep nutrients low for a long time.

Going to try running my scrubber LEDs 24/7. I had it up to 18hours on.
Should I bump it straight to 24 hours

Can go right away to 24.

[iced98lx]

Here is what happens when you don't clean your scrubber soon enough and it grows algae up the sides of hte enclosure killing the screen:

Side A


Side B


Detachment:


Clean:

[Floyd R Turbo]

What does it look like after you rinse it off? How long did you let it grow?

I let mine go for ~16 days and while the growth comes off easily, there is still plenty left to re-grow from. But, I don't have that gooey/slime layer that I can see in yours, that gelatinous stuff blocks light...so in your case, yeah you would want to at least take the screen out and swipe your hand across it to remove that slime/goo and pass it under the faucet, then if the mat was all GHA after that, you could actually put it back in use.

[sensei]

Originally Posted by SantaMonica

Yes, a scrubber can out-compete any nuisance algae, if strong enough and if run enough months. Bryopsis is hard because it has roots which get nutrients from inside the rock, so it can last long after nutrients in the water are low. And Bubble stores nutrients inside the bubble, so it can last longer too. So you have to keep nutrients low for a long time.

Santa Monica,
How low do you need to keep nutrients for these to go away?
I ask becuase even with the scrubber you have detectable levels of N and P, so these 2 kinds of algae may never go away even with a strong scrubber??

Thanks again

[iced98lx]

Originally Posted by Floyd R Turbo

What does it look like after you rinse it off? How long did you let it grow?

I let mine go for ~16 days and while the growth comes off easily, there is still plenty left to re-grow from. But, I don't have that gooey/slime layer that I can see in yours, that gelatinous stuff blocks light...so in your case, yeah you would want to at least take the screen out and swipe your hand across it to remove that slime/goo and pass it under the faucet, then if the mat was all GHA after that, you could actually put it back in use.

The "clean" picture is rinsed. I shouldn't have said "kill" it just was so blocked by algae growing up the acrylic in the growth chamber it started yellowing out and melting

This was roughly 30 days.

I have no doubt it will spring right back.

Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk

[SantaMonica]

Here is what happens when you don't clean your scrubber

This is where upflows really help out, since they don't die when you let them go to long. I've not cleaned an upflow for months, and it just gets to a certain thickness and stays there.

How low do you need to keep nutrients for these to go away? I ask becuase even with the scrubber you have detectable levels of N and P, so these 2 kinds of algae may never go away even with a strong scrubber??

You need to keep it low enough to get rid of them long term. There is no number, but you'll see the effects over months.

[iced98lx]

Originally Posted by SantaMonica

This is where upflows really help out, since they don't die when you let them go to long. I've not cleaned an upflow for months, and it just gets to a certain thickness and stays there.

Could be true, my UAS never grew any algae so I never got to harvest it or not harvest it.

[Floyd R Turbo]

Originally Posted by iced98lx

This was roughly 30 days.

Ah. Yes, that's a bit too long. I go 14, maybe 16 days. Never have gone over 18.

[sensei]

[QUOTE=SantaMonica;
You need to keep it low enough to get rid of them long term. There is no number, but you'll see the effects over months.[/QUOTE]

can you please define what you mean by "low enough"?
What numbers of P and N are low?
Thanks