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02/17/2014, 11:26 PM | #1 |
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QUARANTINE YOUR FIRST FISH! Why?>>>
It's not about the fish's health or welfare---though it's certainly easier to treat and save him if you have him in a bare glass tank that can be treated.
No. It's about that tank you just sweated bullets and nursed to life. If you put a parasite-infested fish into that new tank, the only way to get the parasites out is to have that tank fishless for 12 weeks. Otherwise you will have endless grief and sick fish. There are parasites, like ich and flukes, that can hide in gills. Ich lives in the sandbed and in fish. It's terribly common. There are diseases and viruses that produce films on the fish's skin or affect the fish in other ways, and most of these can prove fatal if not treated appropriately. Treating a 'well' fish 'just in case' is not such a good idea. Parasites take one kind of treatment; bacterial infections require something else---and if you picked the wrong one, you're going to have put the fish through two stressful treatments, when sometimes the fish's window for good recovery is hours, not weeks. If you are forced to treat---do not use carbon; it absorbs meds; do not use a filter that has a black (carbon) side; and do not have rock or sand in the qt. Rock and sand harbor ich parasite, and the bio load if your treatment kills the bacterial sand and rock --- as it well may--- is not going to help the fish at all.
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Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%. |
02/18/2014, 10:57 AM | #2 |
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Thanks so much for the info!
I plan to QT all fish that go into my DT, that's a given. However, I'm wondering if it's necessary to QT hardier tank-bred fish for as long a time as a more susceptible ocean-caught fish? Specifically, I'm curious about captive-bred occellaris clownfish (which seem to have their own special tank at all of the LFS) and orchid dottybacks (which might be handled more like ocean-caught fish?). Would 2 weeks be a reasonable time to QT a pair of clownfish that have never been around other species of fish? I'm certainly not looking to cut corners, just trying to figure out if the risk of infecting a tank with a parasite varies in a meaningful way depending on the type of fish and how they were raised. |
02/18/2014, 11:14 AM | #3 | |
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02/18/2014, 12:47 PM | #4 |
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You're taking a chance---not with the fish, but with the sandbed. They're LESS likely. But if disease DOES get started in a batch of all-same-species it spreads so easily. All it takes is an LFS employee to use the same net on the captive-bred tank he used on the rest of the tanks. And look behind the store tanks. They very likely are piped to the same sump as the rest.
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Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%. |
02/18/2014, 12:53 PM | #5 |
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Don't take chances. That 12 weeks seems soooooooo long when you have to do it. It's just much easier to do it right from the start!
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200g DD Marineland. Acro and monti heavy with some birdsnest, LPS, and zoas. 125g FOWLR |
02/18/2014, 01:01 PM | #6 |
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How do you cycle a Qt tank without using rock or sand? How about using a sponge that was in the sump for a few weeks? Any other ways?
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02/18/2014, 01:17 PM | #7 | ||
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02/18/2014, 01:17 PM | #8 | |
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Adrienne The only thing to fear is fear itself....and spiders. |
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02/21/2014, 08:15 AM | #9 |
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Qt
I have heard of and had success not QT ing a fish is it really always necessary?
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02/21/2014, 11:22 AM | #10 |
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Yes. Some dealers take their own precautions---but can slip up. It's like gambling at a casino. You win the first time--and the second and third. And you've piled up a lot of money. You gamble just once too often---and lose the whole pile.
A lot of people lose it on the first fish and have to leave their tank fishless for 12 weeks to cure it. The really unlucky people finally lose it on the 9th, and lose 500.00 worth of fish and also have to leave their tank fishless for 12 weeks. It's a question of playing the odds. All those of us who've been at this for decades can tell you is that beginners have the most mistakes with water quality, fish selection, water stability, and all such things as give advantage to the parasite...so beginners have uncommonly bad luck in the first place. If you're going to gamble, you're likeliest to lose the bet when you're new to the hobby. As an advisor on this forum, I usually have a number of cases a week where somebody's writing in saying, "What's wrong with my fish?" and it turns out, yes, the fish is in the display tank...
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Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%. |
02/22/2014, 02:41 PM | #11 |
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how long should you leave them in the qt
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02/22/2014, 07:11 PM | #12 |
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I lost on the 8th fish. Nothing is dead though. I got them all into QT today. 12 weeks is soooo long.
Just QT. I wish i did |
02/23/2014, 09:02 AM | #13 |
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How do you feel about uv sterilizers, I'm new to the hobby but heard once the parasite is free floating that the uv sterilizer would neutralize/or kill it . Any thoughts.
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02/23/2014, 03:28 PM | #14 |
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It's 4 weeks for qt.
I don't trust uv---I had some units in my pond, and 3 in succession caught fire, one nearly taking out the skimmer. I'm sure the marine ones are better-engineered, but I don't want another. It's expensive. Qt is cheap. And I'm dubious it would much slow ich down at all. There are thousands, all invisible. The chance of stopping all ich parasites before 1 got to your fish is very small, if it even affects these creatures.
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Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%. |
02/24/2014, 10:55 AM | #15 |
New King of Quarantine
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i was including leaving my DT fallow in the 12 weeks
if its less lemme know lol |
12/22/2014, 09:50 PM | #16 |
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What should I be looking for in my QT tank during those 4 weeks?
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12/23/2014, 01:10 AM | #17 |
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Ich is easy sauce, things like Brook will make you want to pull your out within 24 hours.
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375g DT 125g sump acrylic, Mixed SPS/LPS tank with anemones and fish. Current Tank Info: 375g Build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2608197 |
01/26/2015, 10:14 AM | #18 | ||
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40b bean animal+20gal sump mixed reef jeabao dc9000 return-swc160 skimmer 250w halide+2x39watt t5ho 5gal fuge-50watt led flood. chaeto,caulaerpa APEX+ Skimz cm122 CaRx |
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01/26/2015, 10:57 AM | #19 |
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Not sure I entirely agree with you Sk8r. Yes, absolutely QT the first, and all subsequent, fish, but if ich can hide in a fish's gills, thus not manifesting symptoms, not treating seems questionable. At least do TTM. Some years ago I had some anthias, with no symptoms, infect my display even after 12 weeks in QT. Spitting tacks I was. As I have built up a larger population of fish, I'm more inclined to treat prophylactically (though, I do understand this thread was about the first fish )
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Simon Got back into the hobby ..... planned to keep it simple ..... yeah, right ..... clearly I need a new plan! Pet peeve: anemones host clowns; clowns do not host anemones! Current Tank Info: 450 Reef; 120 refugium; 60 Frag Tank, 30 Introduction tank; multiple QTs Last edited by ca1ore; 01/26/2015 at 11:08 AM. |
01/26/2015, 11:13 AM | #20 |
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So.. I've been doing saltwater fish since 1997.. I've never had a fish with disease. Always bought from LFS, never online, they both had really clean/nice displays, ran UV.. They guaranteed their fish and would only sell them if they were eating well and looked healthy.
I'm curious, are most of you getting diseased fish from online retailers? I ask because there aren't any good options here so I'll likely be ordering all of my livestock online.. limited selection at the local pet store (I've never seen them carry any fish I wanted, although they could probably order them, their tanks don't look that clean/nice, they aren't running anything but a skimmer on each tank) or Petco.. which.. is where I think i'd be most likely to get a diseased fish... although they occasionally get some neat fish in and they have low prices. Now, I've had freshwater fish with disease, mostly ich... just never had an issue with saltwater. |
01/26/2015, 11:19 AM | #21 |
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I dont understand why so many people are so stubborn with QT-ING NEW FISH.
Its NOT the end of the world! it's a choice of keep ONE fish in QT for a couple weeks or have NO FISH in your MAIN TANK for 3 months... and possible most die... take your pick... i feel like stepping on someones tonsil when they keep saying "Well I Keep ich at bay with XYZ" Or " I haven't seen Ich in a while so I dont have to do anything". I once compared it to a child. If the kid is sick but is showing no signs do you just let the kid rot from the inside or take him to the doc to make sure it is nothing major is happening not visible? You want to know what one response was? the guy said, well I was once sick as a child, my mom didnt take me to the doc, and i grew up tough as nails, I am still alive today... That explained a lot. Treat your fish as you would treat your children, or for some of you a sick child. Care for your animals.
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“For most of history, man has had to fight nature to survive; in this century he is beginning to realize that, in order to survive, he must protect it.”― Jacques-Yves Cousteau MarineBio.org Current Tank Info: 40 Gallon Breeder w/ Bean Animal Overflow 20G Sump, Mixed Reef. |
01/26/2015, 11:30 AM | #22 | |
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and i totally agree with you. it's especially frustrating when an employee of an LFS says it!!!
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of all the things i've lost, i miss my gary the most. Never hold your farts in. They travel up your spine into your brain, and that is where crappy ideas come from. Current Tank Info: i gave my reef away and i feel like a bird out of a cage!! |
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01/26/2015, 11:34 AM | #23 | |
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BTW I thought Louisiana only had 4 floors HAHAH
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“For most of history, man has had to fight nature to survive; in this century he is beginning to realize that, in order to survive, he must protect it.”― Jacques-Yves Cousteau MarineBio.org Current Tank Info: 40 Gallon Breeder w/ Bean Animal Overflow 20G Sump, Mixed Reef. |
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01/26/2015, 11:36 AM | #24 |
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I don't know if it is someones way of gambling or they just think they know everything. But the vast majority of people that do not QT end up in the fish disease forum eventually. Even then some are still resistant to QT. SMH
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Tony Current Tank Info: 180gal DT, BM NAC77 skimmer,3 Maxspect razors, Maxspect Gyre 150, 30g QT |
01/26/2015, 11:39 AM | #25 | |
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people somehow rely solely on spending money and buying gadgets to try to overcome the simple fine art of being patient.
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“For most of history, man has had to fight nature to survive; in this century he is beginning to realize that, in order to survive, he must protect it.”― Jacques-Yves Cousteau MarineBio.org Current Tank Info: 40 Gallon Breeder w/ Bean Animal Overflow 20G Sump, Mixed Reef. |
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