Treating with Vitamin C

[Pufferpunk]

I sent a note to Kent, asking them to have their chemists look at this thread. Here is what they wrote back:

"Very interesting. I haven’t heard of any research on zoanthid benefits. I would be careful to monitor the ORP levels. Adding that much vitamin C can drop pH and ORP. Remember that it is an acid with a pH of 4.0.

There is quite a bit of research on the benefits of Vitamin C additions for fish. There was an article in TFH on it about 2 years ago if I recall where they had some really impressive data on fish growth with the addition of Vitamin C in one group of subjects and the removal in another. It was amazing the rate of growth and color in the fish with Vitamin C addition to the diet."

[dileggi]

I had checked my PH when only 3 days into dosing and noticed no change at all in it. I have not tested it since, which was about 3 days ago. I'll double check tonight.

[Jeff]

I have not noticed a change in my ph either after a couple weeks of dosing.
HIYA PUFFY!

[Pufferpunk]

Hey there Jeffy! I just sent out an email to the head chemist at the Shedd Aquarium & am trying to contact Eric Borneman & Seachem on this too.

[Jeff]

Well Jeni, I think you have all the proof you need that vitamin C works in this thread. A lot of people owe you a big thanks...

[customanimalart]

I was wondering if the aptaisia "stop" that I have isn't bothering my zoas by trying to kill the aiptasia encroaching on them.

I have reduced my feedingds, and even the amounts (they are even in my refugium) and don't seem to want to die or stop spreading. Is this Vit C going to make it worse?

[reggiepe]

The product that I spoke of regarding the injection of aptaisias is Tropic Marin's Elimi-Aiptas.

[Pufferpunk]

LOL, as far a I can see, Vit C is making everything in my tank healthier--didn't even consider the animals I really just wanted to die.

[chris0942]

all sounds good will try

[dileggi]

Per the above, I double checked the PH again to make sure. Still no change at all.

[jjmcat]

Originally posted by customanimalart
I was wondering if the aptaisia "stop" that I have isn't bothering my zoas by trying to kill the aiptasia encroaching on them.

I have reduced my feedingds, and even the amounts (they are even in my refugium) and don't seem to want to die or stop spreading. Is this Vit C going to make it worse?

Now if they would just stay in your sump you would be set.Great for filtration IMO.

[customanimalart]

oh...I also have a little spawning activity of mysids happening in my ref. (they are everywhere) Will the aiptasia eat them if they get close enough> Those are for the fish, not them =)

[madadi]

ooooooo i have some good news. i did a little research on vitamin C and it turns out there is a form of vitamin C that wont mess with pH. its called sodium Ascorbate and its a buffered form of the regular vitamin C which is ascorbic acid.

some studies suggest that mega doses of vitamin C prevents some gastric cancers and can help in elimination of wastes from the liver. i read about people that take 6000 to even 16000mg of vitamin C per day! at such quantities it can upset the stomach due to its acidity and will cause stomach cramps. therefore the buffered form of vitamin C (sodium Ascorbate) was created which does not cause stomach upset because its not an acid. anyway, i found nutritional websites that carry it and its on its way. cant wait to see if this will stop messing with my alk and ORP.

follow this website, this is vitamin C in its purest form and the none acidic kind. thank you very much

http://www.iherb.com/productdetails.aspx?c=1&pid=795

[madadi]

im sure it will still drop my ORP because its still an antioxidant. but a buffered one so I'm exited to see what happens. i was worried for my sps since i did see an alk drop. even though Jeni didn't, i think the alk drop is more noticeable in systems that use a calcium reactor.

[Pufferpunk]

Hmmm... I haven't noticed a drop in alk or pH here. What is the buffering compound? Will that in itself cause a problem? I like the idea of folks being able to buy cheap, generic C & just drop in a pill 1-2x/day. There are a lot of lazy people (myself included), that just may not search out this specialty item & dose the way you do.

[chris0942]

gnc sells the buffered vit. c.

[Pufferpunk]

That's good to know!

[chris0942]

i wish this thread was around about 2 years a go when my ppe's and my bright red started to wilt away. hopfully i can find them again someday.

[geoxman]

I would like some updates! There have been quite a few people that have started. Please be particulate in your observations, plus or minus. All info will help and the more detail the better.

Puffer is going to start an excell spread sheet on tank size, amount dosed, time frame, time dosed, inhabitants, type of c used, chemistry fluctuations-with type of C, tank age and end results.
She has never told me this but I know she will start as soon as enough of us nag her to do so.

You have my permission to PM her on the spreadsheet and in return I will mail out my publisher clearing house sweepstakes. It is in your best interest and if Ed knocks at my door I will buy vitamin C for everyone!!!!!

[Pufferpunk]

It looks like Eric Bornman is willing to give me his imput on this & help me with the info I'm giving him. I guess I'll have to load
Excell into my computer now... . I wish I had prethought on this to start documenting thisa before this late date. I'm not sure what to do at this point, since everything already looks so good. I think I'd have to buy something not doing well & start with a new coral. I don't have a single extra tank though, to try this w/o any other influences in the tank.

[madadi]

Jeni, the buffer is sodium bicarbonate, baking soda. so that explains why you didn't experience a drop. you use sodium bicarbonate when you use the pill. i use a calcium reactor and the watter is buffered differently.

i took a pill and dissolved it in some RO watter. the pH of the water dropped to about 4 but it could have been lower since my pH probe was only calibrated between 4 and 7 to read low. i added sodium bicarbonate to the water and the water started to fizz like crazy. i would think its CO2 being released. it would explain why the pH is dropped in the water. its a double edge sword. it reduces alkalinity by reacting with bicarbonates and releases CO2 which in water its slightly acidic. after adding enough baking soda the water, it stabilized at 8 and it wasn't so acidic like before when it was a pH of 4.

if your using baking soda with your vitamin C pill, you are already using the buffered form of vitamin C but it has to go trough the chemical reaction first to releasing the CO2. i would suggest dissolving the pill in a glass of water first and adding baking soda till the fizz stops. i don't like adding more CO2 to the tank since my calcium reactor is already doing that too much. but if your not using a calcium reactor then just adding to your sump with a bit of baking soda.

[madadi]

hey Jeni you can frag all your zoa and ill keep them in my tank till they don't look so good. then ill frag them again for you and you can start documenting from there. see you tomorrow

[dileggi]

In response to geoxman, I have been dosing for about a week now. I have been dosing 125 2x's/day. I dose 1 in the am...around 7:30 and the other at night, around 8 or 9. My tank size, stocking and mechanicals are all listed below.

I have not noticed a huge difference in my zoa's so far. I had a colony of multi-colored centers that were all completely closed after I burnt them...accidentally of course. After 3 days into dosing the vit c, I had one and only one head open.

I had also burned a purple button and my gsp. Again, no change at all to my button, except a feather duster started growing from it's base...again, around day 3 or 4. My gsp on the other hand was has went from completely closed to "buds" on almost every head. Again, around the 3 or 4 day mark. None of my water parameters have changed or been affected by the vit c thus far. My calcium just recently dropped to about 380 from 420 last night, which is just about when it normally happens...about 2 days before my bi-weekly water change.

I'm using the GNC brand, 500mg with rose hips. I've been cutting them in fourths. I intend on raising the dose from 125 2x's/day to 250 2x's/day on Sunday, which will be one week from when I started dosing.

I do have some before pictures, but since the change has not been so great, the after pictures will still look the same. The only difference would be the buds on the gsp and they're so slight, I have not been able to get them to show up on a picture.

My other peach button, ricordia and candy cane were not affected at all by the "burn" I caused, nor have they been affected by the dosing.

I did accidentally drop 125mg directly into the tank behind some lr as stated somewhere earlier in the thread. I noticed two hermits at the pill while it was disolving. I could not get it out of the tank where it fell, so I left it. I couldn't tell if the hermits actually ate any, but they did hang around that spot for a bit. This was 3 days ago and they're still alive.

[madadi]

do you guys turn off your skimmer when you put the pill in? my skimmer goes crazy but its a crazy skimmer. i found worms skimmed out and sand lol

actually it goes crazy when i dissolve it in a glass first. if i put the pill in the sump then it wont skim extra so much.

[Pufferpunk]

I do find myself emptying my skimmer more but I don't mind. Actually, it's finally skimming the way I wanted it too--always full of bubbles.

(Oh & thanks for reminding me of one MORE thing I have to do tonight...)