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Old 04/25/2015, 03:35 PM   #26
BigJohnny
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IMO wild caught is wrong. Just leave em be.


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Old 04/25/2015, 03:49 PM   #27
Dkuhlmann
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IMO wild caught is wrong. Just leave em be.
If that were the case you would not now nor ever have had the brood stock to start the tank raised fish to begin with.

SOOOOO, with your way of thinking none of us should have any fish so therefore this hobby wouldn't exist.


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Previous tanks: 200 gal fowlr 9" Emperor Angel and many different butterfly fish 4" maroon clown and several other fish, 50 gal sump, 40 gal mixed reef/fish mostly softies and LPS.

Current Tank Info: 40b 750 gph 45 lbs lr, 2"-3" sand, 165w full spectrum dimable LED, 20 gal sump/refugium 30 lbs lr, Bak Pak 2 skimmer, 4" sock temp 79-80, sg 1.026, NH3 0, NO2 0, NO3 <10, ph 8.2, calc 400, mag 1300
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Old 04/25/2015, 04:19 PM   #28
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Clowns are doing great. They ate very aggressively earlier. Both ate frozen and the smaller of the two is eating pellets. He's a quick learner. I did a 30% water change and re-dosed quick-ich X per manufacturer's directions.


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Old 04/25/2015, 04:23 PM   #29
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IMO wild caught is wrong. Just leave em be.
Thanks for your opinion.


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Old 04/25/2015, 04:24 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Dkuhlmann View Post
If that were the case you would not now nor ever have had the brood stock to start the tank raised fish to begin with.

SOOOOO, with your way of thinking none of us should have any fish so therefore this hobby wouldn't exist.
Agree.


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Old 04/25/2015, 04:29 PM   #31
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If that were the case you would not now nor ever have had the brood stock to start the tank raised fish to begin with.

SOOOOO, with your way of thinking none of us should have any fish so therefore this hobby wouldn't exist.
No, because stock already exists. "My thinking" is that wild caught is wrong now. I wasn't speaking in past tense. There's plenty of tank raised fish. that's like saying hunting when you have no other option for food is the same as hunting when it's already dead at the store down the street. There's no reason to disrupt nature further.


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Old 04/25/2015, 04:35 PM   #32
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But I'm not trying to hijack the thread. The fish are no longer wild so good luck and continue the discussion!


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Old 04/25/2015, 06:03 PM   #33
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Video from today taken towards the end of their second feeding. So far they are eating brine shrimp very well.
http://youtu.be/udYm3zBPg_Q


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Old 04/25/2015, 09:02 PM   #34
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No, because stock already exists. "My thinking" is that wild caught is wrong now. I wasn't speaking in past tense. There's plenty of tank raised fish. that's like saying hunting when you have no other option for food is the same as hunting when it's already dead at the store down the street. There's no reason to disrupt nature further.
The problem is that most tank raised clowns these days are outright garbage (deformities wise) and the last thing I would want is to create more of those. ORA is IMO one of the biggest offenders, I have not seen a single decent looking clownfish from them around here in the stores. Though others seem to be not much better
Add to that the designer clown castoffs that are often sold as "true percula", if not by the breeder then by uneducated or outright dishonest store personal.

If you want to breed fish that can be used as a reservoir or next generation broodstook you need fish of high quality and that haven't been tinkered with.
That pretty much only leaves wild caught of known origin.

I also don't think there is too much wild harvesting going on anymore as most clowns sold today are designer clowns and locally bred ones by hobbyists.
It is actually quite hard to find any wild clowns in stores (at least around here).

And in the wild they are by no means better of - see here: http://www.cathychurch.com/index.php/kissing-crowls

So I really don't get your point.


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Current Tank Info: 200 gal 4 tank system (40x28x24 + 40B + 40B sump tank + 20g refugium) + 30x18x18 mixed reef + 20g East Pacific biotop + 20g FW +...
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Old 04/25/2015, 11:25 PM   #35
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Are you breeding them?


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Old 04/26/2015, 12:02 AM   #36
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looks great, congrats!


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Old 04/26/2015, 12:04 AM   #37
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Video from today taken towards the end of their second feeding. So far they are eating brine shrimp very well.
http://youtu.be/udYm3zBPg_Q


These guys are looking really good; you need to breed these guys and give me some offspring


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Old 04/26/2015, 12:15 AM   #38
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Are you breeding them?
In the ideal world, yes I would like for them to become a mated pair and raise their babies. Not for commercial purposes (too little money) but just to improve the breed standard as many of the tank raised clowns nowadays are ugly and deformed. Sort of like high quality dog breeders dedicated to improving dog breeds as opposed to puppy mills. Most today's hatcheries (at least locally here) seem to operate like puppy mills.


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Old 04/26/2015, 12:16 AM   #39
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looks great, congrats!
Thanks man


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Old 04/26/2015, 12:16 AM   #40
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These guys are looking really good; you need to breed these guys and give me some offspring
Hey man, you got it LOL


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Old 04/26/2015, 12:42 AM   #41
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The problem is that most tank raised clowns these days are outright garbage (deformities wise) and the last thing I would want is to create more of those. ORA is IMO one of the biggest offenders, I have not seen a single decent looking clownfish from them around here in the stores. Though others seem to be not much better
Add to that the designer clown castoffs that are often sold as "true percula", if not by the breeder then by uneducated or outright dishonest store personal.

If you want to breed fish that can be used as a reservoir or next generation broodstook you need fish of high quality and that haven't been tinkered with.
That pretty much only leaves wild caught of known origin.

I also don't think there is too much wild harvesting going on anymore as most clowns sold today are designer clowns and locally bred ones by hobbyists.
It is actually quite hard to find any wild clowns in stores (at least around here).

And in the wild they are by no means better of - see here: http://www.cathychurch.com/index.php/kissing-crowls

So I really don't get your point.
What you just said in no way addressed my point. I said your disrupting nature unnecessarily, you said wild are better for your purpose. 2 completely different discussions. Let's leave this one alone eh? Like I said before don't want us to hijack the thread.


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Old 04/26/2015, 05:13 AM   #42
joshky
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I love your pair, hope you can keep their black.


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Old 04/26/2015, 08:05 AM   #43
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I love your pair, hope you can keep their black.
Thanks. Hope so too


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Old 04/26/2015, 10:04 AM   #44
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The light had just turned on and I snapped a quick pic with my phone.



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Old 04/26/2015, 01:53 PM   #45
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Really nice!
How big are they?


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Pairs: 4 percula, 3 P. kauderni, 3 D. excisus, 1 ea of P. diacanthus, S. splendidus, C. altivelis O. rosenblatti, D. janssi, S. yasha & a Gramma loreto trio
3 P. diacanthus. 2 C. starcki

Current Tank Info: 200 gal 4 tank system (40x28x24 + 40B + 40B sump tank + 20g refugium) + 30x18x18 mixed reef + 20g East Pacific biotop + 20g FW +...
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Old 04/26/2015, 02:02 PM   #46
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Really nice!
How big are they?
Thanks. The little dude with a spot on his left cheek is about 1 and 3/4 inch. The other one is 2 inches.


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Old 04/26/2015, 05:23 PM   #47
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Absolutely beautiful pair.


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Previous tanks: 200 gal fowlr 9" Emperor Angel and many different butterfly fish 4" maroon clown and several other fish, 50 gal sump, 40 gal mixed reef/fish mostly softies and LPS.

Current Tank Info: 40b 750 gph 45 lbs lr, 2"-3" sand, 165w full spectrum dimable LED, 20 gal sump/refugium 30 lbs lr, Bak Pak 2 skimmer, 4" sock temp 79-80, sg 1.026, NH3 0, NO2 0, NO3 <10, ph 8.2, calc 400, mag 1300
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Old 04/26/2015, 05:31 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by CoralsAddiction View Post
In the ideal world, yes I would like for them to become a mated pair and raise their babies. Not for commercial purposes (too little money) but just to improve the breed standard as many of the tank raised clowns nowadays are ugly and deformed. Sort of like high quality dog breeders dedicated to improving dog breeds as opposed to puppy mills. Most today's hatcheries (at least locally here) seem to operate like puppy mills.
I can handle buying wild if the idea is to improve the captive gene pool. Otherwise, kind of a waste. Goodluck with the pairing, I'm currently in the process of doing it and breeding for a fun project with my daughters. Tank bred though, not sure how "good" my clowns really are. Let's see if it actually happens.


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Old 04/26/2015, 06:11 PM   #49
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I can handle buying wild if the idea is to improve the captive gene pool. Otherwise, kind of a waste. Goodluck with the pairing, I'm currently in the process of doing it and breeding for a fun project with my daughters. Tank bred though, not sure how "good" my clowns really are. Let's see if it actually happens.
Ha. Thanks. Have fun breeding nemos with your daughters
Also, next time you get a chance to visit Los Angeles check out some of our fish stores. When it comes down to clowns the ratio of captive bred to wild caught is 90% tank raised and 10% wild caught if not less. That's why I don't worry about it too much.


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Old 04/26/2015, 08:03 PM   #50
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Not very good news. The smaller clown is starting to exhibit early signs of brooklynella. It has the "skin peeling off" thing near his tail. I might give him a quick-ich X bath for an hour with increased dose to see if it helps. I might also consider separating the two clowns to at least save the larger clown that appears to be healthy.


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