Shimmer Poll

Emma1234 · 01/16/2018, 06:16 PM

Just wanted to see what people think. Some lights provide more shimmer than others. What do you think?

Is shimmer to distracting (say the tank is in you living room with your TV and the show/game is on)

Or, IYO, is the shimmer so cool, to you, that distraction isn't a thing for you. (Again assume the tank is in you living room with the TV and the show/game is on).

For the purposes of this survey please do not assume the tank is in a spot where distraction isn't an issue. THE TANK IS IN YOUR LR

Thanks! This is not a test. No correct answers. Just for fun

Tripod1404 · 01/16/2018, 06:31 PM

If you have a "single-point" light source like a LED and to a lower extend MH, it will cause shimmering. If the light source is large like T5HO bulbs, it wont cause shimmering.

About the distraction part. That is a very subjective preference. For me the tank itself is always a distraction. Whenever I look I always see something that can be improved or not at its best. Like; some a**hole fish bullying others, is there a white patch on my coral or am I just imagining stuff, hmm polyp extension seemed to be better a day ago, could that coral be dying. This hobby supposed to be relaxing, but more you are drawn into more stressful and distracting it gets

.

Emma1234 · 01/16/2018, 06:58 PM

Definitely know what you mean. The tank consumes soooooo much time and thought

But that is true whether it is in or out of the Living Room/TV area.

I'm trying to zero in on a more specific distraction, specifically: shimmer vs. TV. Does the shimmer (only the shimmer) bug you when your trying to watch or show/game? Or, not really, you don't even really notice the shimmer.

No pressure. This is not a test. This is a fun quiz.

Thanks for playing!

Cheapreef · 01/16/2018, 07:08 PM

Shimmer from Halides is nice, shimmer from point source LED like Kessil is way too much and really distracting IMO.

You can get a med amount of shimmer from regular LEDs as well, my Hybrid T5/hydra 26 fixture gives off a nice shimmer, not as much as a Halide by any stretch but still nice.

Tripod1404 · 01/16/2018, 07:10 PM

Nope it doesn't. But in my living room the tank is next to the couch that i sit and tv is in front. So I cannot look at both the tv and the tank at the same time. But I dont know if it would bother me if tank was next to the tv.

Hydrus · 01/16/2018, 07:58 PM

My tank is very close to my tv and I LOVE the shimmer effect. I do not find it distracting at all. I live in a tiny house so there isn't much choice in where to put things. But yea, I don't find it distracting, even with the lights off in the room. I love to be able to watch tv then watch my tank during commercials lol. That pic has T5s on my tank because my LEDs fried (my new Photons arrive friday), but I normally have LEDs that produce a nice shimmer.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

GQuinn · 01/16/2018, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheapreef

Shimmer from Halides is nice, shimmer from point source LED like Kessil is way too much and really distracting

Agreed.

Emma1234 · 01/16/2018, 08:21 PM

Hydrus - Love the tank!

DesertReefT4r · 01/16/2018, 08:25 PM

To my eyes MH has the best skimmer and the most shimmer of any light. LED is really close to MH and has better color not only the coral color but the lighting color. My last 2 tanks where right next to my TV 1st was a 40B with a 250w MH 2nd was 75g with 2 250w MH and the was not distracting. The beauty of the reef inside the tank wws distracting but not the ligjting itself. Oh and I had no canopy, open top with pendants.

HBtank · 01/16/2018, 09:13 PM

I think shimmer is my lowest priority, and then, only so much. Seems like hybrids get you there though.

Hydrus · 01/16/2018, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emma1234

Hydrus - Love the tank!

Thanks!

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

JUNBUG361 · 01/17/2018, 12:10 AM

No distraction will be present

Emma1234 · 01/17/2018, 06:45 PM

Hey Everyone. Thanks for the input. Here is a summary of the extremely unscientific poll about whether shimmer is a distraction.

These folks weren't crazy about the shimmer from LEDs. And commented about the difference between the shimmer in LEDs versus metal halides
1. Cheepreef said. Shimmer from Halides is nice, shimmer from point source LED like Kessil is way too much and really distracting IMO. You can get a med amount of shimmer from regular LEDs as well, my Hybrid T5/hydra 26 fixture gives off a nice shimmer, not as much as a Halide by any stretch but still nice.

2. GQuinn agree with Cheepreef. Shimmer from Halides is nice, shimmer from point source LED like Kessil is way too much and really distracting IMO.

3. DesertreefTR4: To my eyes MH has the best skimmer and the most shimmer of any light. LED is really close to MH and has better color not only the coral color but the lighting color. My last 2 tanks where right next to my TV 1st was a 40B with a 250w MH 2nd was 75g with 2 250w MH and the was not distracting. The beauty of the reef inside the tank wws distracting but not the ligjting itself. Oh and I had no canopy, open top with pendants.

Middle of the road responses.
Cheepreef: You can get a med amount of shimmer from regular LEDs..... my Hybrid T5/hydra 26 fixture gives off a nice shimmer, not as much as a Halide by any stretch but still nice

HBtank: I think shimmer is my lowest priority, and then, only so much. Seems like hybrids get you there though.

These folks thought shimmer wasn't a distraction

Tripod1404: Nope it doesn't. But in my living room the tank is next to the couch that i sit and tv is in front. So I cannot look at both the tv and the tank at the same time. But I dont know if it would bother me if tank was next to the tv.

Hydrus: My tank is very close to my tv and I LOVE the shimmer effect. I do not find it distracting at all.

Junbug361: No distraction will be present

slief · 01/17/2018, 10:07 PM

I love the shimmer myself and run 8 Kessil 360WE’s in addition to my 6 Mitras LX7206’s over my tank. As a scuba diver, the shimmer makes a reef look much more natural looking to me than a tank without the shimmer and I don’t find it to be distracting at all. Having run halides for a couple decades before switching to LED’s back in 2011, I missed the shimmer when I first made the transition to LED’s. Having run Kessils for a few years, I love having them over my tank even if they are now just supplemental to my Mitras. I love the shimmer. If anything is distracting in my tank, it’s the fish!

ca1ore · 01/17/2018, 10:54 PM

As somebody noted, shimmer is a function of the amount of surface agitation and the degree to which the light is a point source. If you use any of the point source kessil spots but have no surface agitation then no shimmer. If you use a line source light but have high surface agitation then you will still get shimmer. Whether one is too much, or too little is a mostly aesthetic choice. Mostly the animals won't care.

Also, keep in mind that shimmer is a shallow water phenomenon on natural reefs.

oceanfan913 · 03/09/2018, 10:12 AM

I thought it might be distracting but once my tank was up and running I liked the effect. I didn't do anything to enhance or reduce it, it was just there based on the setup and I grew to like it.

Salty Waffles · 03/09/2018, 12:29 PM

I don't care for the shimmer from my black box LEDs with what I call a lot of surface agitation. With my fixtures, I get a big Christmas tree effect once I hit a certain amount of agitation.

OTOH, on my previous freshwater tanks that had high power CF retrofits over them and as much or more surface agitation than I run on my salt tank, the shimmer was quite nice.

smatter · 03/09/2018, 02:54 PM

The shimmer from my Kessil isn't a distraction... at all, and it's right next to my recliner in the living room. I find T5s and halides much more distracting as there is so much light spill. I couldn't believe how dark my living room got when I replaced the halide.

hersheyb · 03/09/2018, 05:15 PM

Kessils by far have the most shimmer. It was too much in shimmer for my taste, specially if your pumps are creating a lot of ripples on the surface of the water. Moderate shimmer is much less distracting, so I run an LED/T5 hybrid system, best of both worlds.

d0ughb0y · 03/09/2018, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ca1ore

As somebody noted, shimmer is a function of the amount of surface agitation and the degree to which the light is a point source. If you use any of the point source kessil spots but have no surface agitation then no shimmer. If you use a line source light but have high surface agitation then you will still get shimmer. Whether one is too much, or too little is a mostly aesthetic choice. Mostly the animals won't care.

Also, keep in mind that shimmer is a shallow water phenomenon on natural reefs.

I find it funny when people attribute shimmer to kessil as if the light itself is generating the shimmer. like, you gotta get kessil in order to get shimmer lol.

ca1ore · 03/10/2018, 09:44 AM

S'truth. On my recommendation, a buddy of mine bought a pair of A360 Tuna Sun for his planted tank. Calls me up .... conversations goes as follows:

Mark: Not sure I really like these new lights .... there's too much shimmer.
Me: Does it appear to be bothering your fish?
Mark: No, but it's bothering me
Me: OK, try aiming your locline outlets slightly lower in the tank to reduce surface agitation
Mark: OK, hang on .... cool shimmer is gone. Except I want some shimmer.
Me: Then adjust the locline to your preference.
Mark: Thanks.

It's not rocket science.

Sorcha2 · 03/10/2018, 10:29 AM

The shimmer really doesn't bother me but then again I have strip LEDs, low surface agitation, and a huge living room with the tank off to the side so I don't get a lot of shimmer and it's not in a location where it would be an issue. I'm wanting to up the amount of flow in my tank so it will be interesting to see if I get much more shimmer with that.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

d0ughb0y · 03/10/2018, 11:13 AM

for a light as expensive as kessil, it can't even be ramped down to 0, it shuts off at like 20% or a little lower (can't remember the exact percentage it shuts down). I know it is not a technology issue, as other lights, even DIY can ramp down to 0. Its more like their (lack of) engineering skill issue. That was the deal breaker for me when I was researching for a new light to buy. It's a wonder how it became popular.

smatter · 03/12/2018, 04:00 PM

Lack of engineering skill issue Iol? Why do you need your lights to dim down to less than 10%?

tdurden · 03/12/2018, 05:00 PM

I always aim for what is closest to nature (whatever mimics the sun the closest). Therefore, I like shimmer.

The kessils are great led options if you want a lot of shimmer. They are not the only leds that shimmer, they just have more shimmer than pretty much every other led out there.

01/16/2018, 06:16 PM	#1
Emma1234 Registered Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: New Jersey Posts: 167	Shimmer Poll Just wanted to see what people think. Some lights provide more shimmer than others. What do you think? Is shimmer to distracting (say the tank is in you living room with your TV and the show/game is on) Or, IYO, is the shimmer so cool, to you, that distraction isn't a thing for you. (Again assume the tank is in you living room with the TV and the show/game is on). For the purposes of this survey please do not assume the tank is in a spot where distraction isn't an issue. THE TANK IS IN YOUR LR Thanks! This is not a test. No correct answers. Just for fun

01/16/2018, 08:25 PM	#9
DesertReefT4r Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Mesa Az Posts: 771	To my eyes MH has the best skimmer and the most shimmer of any light. LED is really close to MH and has better color not only the coral color but the lighting color. My last 2 tanks where right next to my TV 1st was a 40B with a 250w MH 2nd was 75g with 2 250w MH and the was not distracting. The beauty of the reef inside the tank wws distracting but not the ligjting itself. Oh and I had no canopy, open top with pendants. __________________ Tank history 29g tropical ,55g cichlid tank, 20H softy reef, 29g mixed reef, 20H brackish goby & puffer tank, 55g mixed reef, 6g Nanocube softy lps reef, 40B sps reef, 75g sps reef, 75g sps reef in bu Current Tank Info: 75g sps reef build in the works.

01/16/2018, 09:13 PM	#10
HBtank Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Huntington Beach, CA Posts: 2,957	I think shimmer is my lowest priority, and then, only so much. Seems like hybrids get you there though. __________________ 80g Aiptasia dominated reef tank.. with fish and now a bunch of berghia! Current Tank Info: 80g tank, re-starting a reef after a zoanthid nudibranch plauge, followed by months of steady and unstoppable STN/RTN, crashed; stayed FOWLR for a couple years, currently an aiptasia dominated reef tank with fishies and BERGHIA

01/17/2018, 12:10 AM	#12
JUNBUG361 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Antioch,CALIFORNIA Posts: 1,091	No distraction will be present Last edited by JUNBUG361; 01/17/2018 at 12:26 AM.

01/17/2018, 10:07 PM	#14
slief RC Sponsor Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 14,173	I love the shimmer myself and run 8 Kessil 360WE’s in addition to my 6 Mitras LX7206’s over my tank. As a scuba diver, the shimmer makes a reef look much more natural looking to me than a tank without the shimmer and I don’t find it to be distracting at all. Having run halides for a couple decades before switching to LED’s back in 2011, I missed the shimmer when I first made the transition to LED’s. Having run Kessils for a few years, I love having them over my tank even if they are now just supplemental to my Mitras. I love the shimmer. If anything is distracting in my tank, it’s the fish! __________________ Director Customer Support Royal Exclusiv USA For All Royal Exclusiv & Bubble King questions please refer to our Sponsor forum: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/fo...play.php?f=745 Current Tank Info: 480G display mixed reef, 90G sump, 90G refugium, 60G display refugium. Check out my build thread: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1783476 Last edited by slief; 01/17/2018 at 10:16 PM.

01/16/2018, 06:31 PM	#2
Tripod1404 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 1,821	If you have a "single-point" light source like a LED and to a lower extend MH, it will cause shimmering. If the light source is large like T5HO bulbs, it wont cause shimmering. About the distraction part. That is a very subjective preference. For me the tank itself is always a distraction. Whenever I look I always see something that can be improved or not at its best. Like; some a**hole fish bullying others, is there a white patch on my coral or am I just imagining stuff, hmm polyp extension seemed to be better a day ago, could that coral be dying. This hobby supposed to be relaxing, but more you are drawn into more stressful and distracting it gets .

01/16/2018, 06:58 PM	#3
Emma1234 Registered Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: New Jersey Posts: 167	Definitely know what you mean. The tank consumes soooooo much time and thought But that is true whether it is in or out of the Living Room/TV area. I'm trying to zero in on a more specific distraction, specifically: shimmer vs. TV. Does the shimmer (only the shimmer) bug you when your trying to watch or show/game? Or, not really, you don't even really notice the shimmer. No pressure. This is not a test. This is a fun quiz. Thanks for playing!

01/16/2018, 07:08 PM	#4
Cheapreef Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 1,076	Shimmer from Halides is nice, shimmer from point source LED like Kessil is way too much and really distracting IMO. You can get a med amount of shimmer from regular LEDs as well, my Hybrid T5/hydra 26 fixture gives off a nice shimmer, not as much as a Halide by any stretch but still nice.

01/16/2018, 07:10 PM	#5
Tripod1404 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 1,821	Nope it doesn't. But in my living room the tank is next to the couch that i sit and tv is in front. So I cannot look at both the tv and the tank at the same time. But I dont know if it would bother me if tank was next to the tv.

01/16/2018, 07:58 PM	#6
Hydrus Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Minnesota Posts: 98	My tank is very close to my tv and I LOVE the shimmer effect. I do not find it distracting at all. I live in a tiny house so there isn't much choice in where to put things. But yea, I don't find it distracting, even with the lights off in the room. I love to be able to watch tv then watch my tank during commercials lol. That pic has T5s on my tank because my LEDs fried (my new Photons arrive friday), but I normally have LEDs that produce a nice shimmer. Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

01/16/2018, 08:21 PM	#8
Emma1234 Registered Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: New Jersey Posts: 167	Hydrus - Love the tank!

01/17/2018, 06:45 PM	#13
Emma1234 Registered Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: New Jersey Posts: 167	Hey Everyone. Thanks for the input. Here is a summary of the extremely unscientific poll about whether shimmer is a distraction. These folks weren't crazy about the shimmer from LEDs. And commented about the difference between the shimmer in LEDs versus metal halides 1. Cheepreef said. Shimmer from Halides is nice, shimmer from point source LED like Kessil is way too much and really distracting IMO. You can get a med amount of shimmer from regular LEDs as well, my Hybrid T5/hydra 26 fixture gives off a nice shimmer, not as much as a Halide by any stretch but still nice. 2. GQuinn agree with Cheepreef. Shimmer from Halides is nice, shimmer from point source LED like Kessil is way too much and really distracting IMO. 3. DesertreefTR4: To my eyes MH has the best skimmer and the most shimmer of any light. LED is really close to MH and has better color not only the coral color but the lighting color. My last 2 tanks where right next to my TV 1st was a 40B with a 250w MH 2nd was 75g with 2 250w MH and the was not distracting. The beauty of the reef inside the tank wws distracting but not the ligjting itself. Oh and I had no canopy, open top with pendants. Middle of the road responses. Cheepreef: You can get a med amount of shimmer from regular LEDs..... my Hybrid T5/hydra 26 fixture gives off a nice shimmer, not as much as a Halide by any stretch but still nice HBtank: I think shimmer is my lowest priority, and then, only so much. Seems like hybrids get you there though. These folks thought shimmer wasn't a distraction Tripod1404: Nope it doesn't. But in my living room the tank is next to the couch that i sit and tv is in front. So I cannot look at both the tv and the tank at the same time. But I dont know if it would bother me if tank was next to the tv. Hydrus: My tank is very close to my tv and I LOVE the shimmer effect. I do not find it distracting at all. Junbug361: No distraction will be present

01/17/2018, 10:54 PM	#15
ca1ore Grizzled & Cynical Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Stamford, CT Posts: 17,319	As somebody noted, shimmer is a function of the amount of surface agitation and the degree to which the light is a point source. If you use any of the point source kessil spots but have no surface agitation then no shimmer. If you use a line source light but have high surface agitation then you will still get shimmer. Whether one is too much, or too little is a mostly aesthetic choice. Mostly the animals won't care. Also, keep in mind that shimmer is a shallow water phenomenon on natural reefs. __________________ Simon Got back into the hobby ..... planned to keep it simple ..... yeah, right ..... clearly I need a new plan! Pet peeve: anemones host clowns; clowns do not host anemones! Current Tank Info: 450 Reef; 120 refugium; 60 Frag Tank, 30 Introduction tank; multiple QTs

03/09/2018, 10:12 AM	#16
oceanfan913 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 55	I thought it might be distracting but once my tank was up and running I liked the effect. I didn't do anything to enhance or reduce it, it was just there based on the setup and I grew to like it.

03/09/2018, 12:29 PM	#17
Salty Waffles Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Idaho Posts: 92	I don't care for the shimmer from my black box LEDs with what I call a lot of surface agitation. With my fixtures, I get a big Christmas tree effect once I hit a certain amount of agitation. OTOH, on my previous freshwater tanks that had high power CF retrofits over them and as much or more surface agitation than I run on my salt tank, the shimmer was quite nice.

03/09/2018, 02:54 PM	#18
smatter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,055	The shimmer from my Kessil isn't a distraction... at all, and it's right next to my recliner in the living room. I find T5s and halides much more distracting as there is so much light spill. I couldn't believe how dark my living room got when I replaced the halide.

03/09/2018, 05:15 PM	#19
hersheyb Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: Covina Posts: 1,626	Kessils by far have the most shimmer. It was too much in shimmer for my taste, specially if your pumps are creating a lot of ripples on the surface of the water. Moderate shimmer is much less distracting, so I run an LED/T5 hybrid system, best of both worlds.

03/10/2018, 09:44 AM	#21
ca1ore Grizzled & Cynical Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Stamford, CT Posts: 17,319	S'truth. On my recommendation, a buddy of mine bought a pair of A360 Tuna Sun for his planted tank. Calls me up .... conversations goes as follows: Mark: Not sure I really like these new lights .... there's too much shimmer. Me: Does it appear to be bothering your fish? Mark: No, but it's bothering me Me: OK, try aiming your locline outlets slightly lower in the tank to reduce surface agitation Mark: OK, hang on .... cool shimmer is gone. Except I want some shimmer. Me: Then adjust the locline to your preference. Mark: Thanks. It's not rocket science. __________________ Simon Got back into the hobby ..... planned to keep it simple ..... yeah, right ..... clearly I need a new plan! Pet peeve: anemones host clowns; clowns do not host anemones! Current Tank Info: 450 Reef; 120 refugium; 60 Frag Tank, 30 Introduction tank; multiple QTs

03/10/2018, 10:29 AM	#22
Sorcha2 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 69	The shimmer really doesn't bother me but then again I have strip LEDs, low surface agitation, and a huge living room with the tank off to the side so I don't get a lot of shimmer and it's not in a location where it would be an issue. I'm wanting to up the amount of flow in my tank so it will be interesting to see if I get much more shimmer with that. Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

03/10/2018, 11:13 AM	#23
d0ughb0y Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: sf bay area Posts: 5,165	for a light as expensive as kessil, it can't even be ramped down to 0, it shuts off at like 20% or a little lower (can't remember the exact percentage it shuts down). I know it is not a technology issue, as other lights, even DIY can ramp down to 0. Its more like their (lack of) engineering skill issue. That was the deal breaker for me when I was researching for a new light to buy. It's a wonder how it became popular.

03/12/2018, 04:00 PM	#24
smatter Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Madison, WI Posts: 2,055	Lack of engineering skill issue Iol? Why do you need your lights to dim down to less than 10%?

03/12/2018, 05:00 PM	#25
tdurden Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2018 Posts: 8	I always aim for what is closest to nature (whatever mimics the sun the closest). Therefore, I like shimmer. The kessils are great led options if you want a lot of shimmer. They are not the only leds that shimmer, they just have more shimmer than pretty much every other led out there.