Donovan's Nitrate Destroyer

[djbon]

Mine is an inch nipple. Drill a hole at the exact same height on both chamber at the lowest part, preferably after you glued the flat end cap. Put on the nipple, and screw in matching jam nut internally. The nipple will act as a bridge. I would prefer a 4" pipe as i can fit my hand in there to fix the jam nut. But 3" is fine, you just need to find a way to fix the fittings.

[stormrider27]

Originally Posted by djbon

Mine is an inch nipple. Drill a hole at the exact same height on both chamber at the lowest part, preferably after you glued the flat end cap. Put on the nipple, and screw in matching jam nut internally. The nipple will act as a bridge. I would prefer a 4" pipe as i can fit my hand in there to fix the jam nut. But 3" is fine, you just need to find a way to fix the fittings.

With some creative placement of the sump and plumbing I discovered I can fit a 3" U shaped destroyer. Are you still recommending twin 30" tall towers or can the unit be shorter as long as the total length of pipe equals 60" including the two 90 degree elbows and connecting pipe? Also, how much of each type media will I need to purchase?

Thanks!

[djbon]

Originally Posted by stormrider27

With some creative placement of the sump and plumbing I discovered I can fit a 3" U shaped destroyer. Are you still recommending twin 30" tall towers or can the unit be shorter as long as the total length of pipe equals 60" including the two 90 degree elbows and connecting pipe? Also, how much of each type media will I need to purchase?

Thanks!

U shaped reactor doesn't need connecting pipe, only self standing twin tower like mine need one. As this is a successful experiment without any scientific backup, i am not sure what is the minimum length required to achieve denitrification. The logic with extended contact time (hence the length) is mainly to deplete oxygen in the water during nitrification so that some portion of the chambers (at exit point) will become anaerobic, forcing bacteria to consume the nitrate releasing nitrogen gases as byproducts.

You need biomedia (various sizes) to fill the entire reactor, leaving some space for inlet and outlet hose to breath.

[nematode]

I have been changing my philosophy about how to run this reactor.
( I am running my reactor faster an not trying to get output to zero; just to measureably below input) I am doing this to make control of flow easier. Faster flow, easier to control in my experience.

Details.
I have been running my revamped reactor since 4/8 (post 533).
I haven't tested until today. I am currently running the following :
2ml of NOPOX per hr
400 ml/ per hr ( this his high).

I have settled on this from looking at the growth of clear white slime in my reactor over the two weeks I since I revamped it.

In about 4 days I notice extensive white junk on the input side and lots of bubbles at the top of the reactor (This reactor is made of clear acrylic).

For the first week or so flow was very nice and no modifications were needed from day to day.

Then white slimy stuff started appearing on the output side, and I started having to adjust flow every day.

So I have just increase flow substantially to 400 ml per minute.

So far this seems to be stable.

Today I did a test.
Nitrates are at 15 for the whole tank. That is down from about 30 when I revamped.
I am doing 2 ml per hr of NOPOX. I tested at 15 and 45 minutes after dosage.
Guestimating from color, the 15 min was about 7 ppm and 45 min was about 5ppm. Both were clearly less colored than tank, but not zero.

I actually think this might be the best setting for the reactor.

Higher flow reduces clogging, and while I am not going to zero, I am clearly reducing nitrates. I haven't done formal calculation, but if one goes from 15>5 at 400 ml/ minutes, that is equivelant to going from 15>0 for 266 ml/ minute (assuming the same efficiency)

All together, my nitrates are going down. Last Wed, I tossed in a few montipora frags into the tank. Before at 100 ppm any frags I introduced were dead as a doornail by 4 days, and these are still going strong. So I see this as substantial improvement.

[djbon]

Yup, don't have to be zero for sure. I am aiming for 3 - 5ppm no3 and so far so good. One of my denitrator user have almost zero no3 & po4 in his DT and now his reduced vodka dosing to 1ml vodka daily. He don't have much fish with very minimal daily feeding, that could be the reason.

[gregkn73]

Interesting again your observations nematode. In my case I never notice a clogging in my reactor. I don't know if this , happened because I didn't have such high nitrates or didn't dose a lot of carbon. During the last 7 months I am running the reactor, my nitrates were 2,5-25 and I dosed max diy nopox 14ml. My reactor has 7lt volume. Currently I am dosing 9*1ml every 2.5-3 hours with Doser, and after 45-60min after the dosing, I am reading 0 no3. I am sure that the reactor will be more efficiently ,if no3 at reactor output never reach 0ppm. So a constant dripping of carbon source and higher flow , so the readings will never be 0 at reactor output ,will probably be the most efficient way to use Dons reactor. But how efficient do we want it to be? 0 ppm of no3/at DT ,I think is worser than high no3.....

[djbon]

Zero NO3 in water column is not advisable for extended amount of time. A day of two maybe not that critical, but some corals will become unhappy. My DT NO3 doesn't fluctuate that much in a day or two, unless I overfeed my fish.

[stormrider27]

I've cut and dried fit my "U" tube which is made out of 3" PVC. The aerobic leg is 27" long, the base of the "U" is 6-1/2" long and the Anaerobic leg is 26" long for a total run of 59.5". Now I am ready to order the media but I could use some advice on how much of each type I need to purchase. Here is my shopping list:

CaribSea Aquatics Coral Rubble, 6 lb/1 gallon
CerMedia MarinePure 1.5-Inch Sphere Bio-Filter Media (available in 1 gallon and 2 Qt boxes)
Fluval Pre-Filter Media - 750 grams/26.45 ounces ea
Fluval Biomax Bio Rings - 500 grams/17.63 ounces ea
Matrix, (available in 67.6 oz and 1 gal. containers)
EHEIM Substrat Pro Biological Filter Media pearl shaped 2-Liters ea


Thanks!
Mark

P.S. I can make the base of the "U" longer but the Anaerobic and Aerobic can't be made taller and still fit in my sump area.

[djbon]

I think you can go ahead with marine pure 1.5" for the aerobic zone, fluval bio rings (if large enough) for the U shape area and seachem matrix for the anaerobic zone.

[stormrider27]

Originally Posted by djbon

I think you can go ahead with marine pure 1.5" for the aerobic zone, fluval bio rings (if large enough) for the U shape area and seachem matrix for the anaerobic zone.

Thank you! Based on your experience can you advise me on how much of each product I should order?

[djbon]

I can't estimate as I never land an eye on those. Do you have nearby LFS that carries bio medias?. I have tried a few off the shelf medias and they all works as intended. You just need a porous balls or rings, reef safe and doesn't leach any unwanted elements.

[djbon]

Bigger pipe with bigger media balls seems to be more effective. I am registering close to zero NO3 (almost 1ppm on NYOS kit) even at 3ml carbon source daily dosing. I might try lower dosing (1ml) if i can't raise my nitrate in few days time.

[stormrider27]

Originally Posted by djbon

Bigger pipe with bigger media balls seems to be more effective. I am registering close to zero NO3 (almost 1ppm on NYOS kit) even at 3ml carbon source daily dosing. I might try lower dosing (1ml) if i can't raise my nitrate in few days time.

Interesting, are you now recommending instead of sandwiching your media with coral rubble, smaller sized bio balls and smaller sized bio rings that only using large bio balls in the first tower, large bio rings in the "U" and Matrix in the second tower produces better results?

[djbon]

Not exactly. The only difference is my aerobic zone is using a bigger size bio rings (1" rings) compared to previous design, but still sandwiched by ceramic rings and larger coral rubbles from my previous matured reactor. I believe the efficiency has increased as larger rings does have extra denitrifying bacteria in it (deeper/thicker). We need bigger surface area to maximized O2 uptake in the first chamber so that when the water travels to the next chamber, oxygen levels has dropped forcing bacteria to use nitrogen from NO3. That was the theory

[stormrider27]

Thank you for the clarification! The largest rings I could find are approx. 3/4" x 5/8" so I went ahead and order 3 17.63 oz boxes along with a gallon of Matrix. Tonight I will order 4 liters of 1-1/2" bio balls, 6 lbs of coral rubble and 6 vials of Prodibio Bio Digest. Please let me know if I am missing anything.

[djbon]

You are good to go stormrider27. Just make sure the sandwiching (coral rubble and matrix) doesn't exceed 2" to avoid clogging as they form a tighter arrangement when packed. Use your creativity how to fill the reactor. There is no single instruction to tell you what to do, it just need unrestricted water flow to work hassle free. Don't forget about the carbon source, get a good vodka for yourself as well .

[stormrider27]

Originally Posted by djbon

You are good to go stormrider27. Just make sure the sandwiching (coral rubble and matrix) doesn't exceed 2" to avoid clogging as they form a tighter arrangement when packed. Use your creativity how to fill the reactor. There is no single instruction to tell you what to do, it just need unrestricted water flow to work hassle free. Don't forget about the carbon source, get a good vodka for yourself as well .

Thank you dbjon. As far as vodka goes, we have the good stuff and I will pick up some rotgut vodka for carbon dosing once I get the tank up and running which hopefully will be in about two weeks (I am cycling in another tank will transfer when my build is done). I am thinking since my bio load will be so low I am going to start out with just dozing 1-2 mil per day and ramp up over time. What are your thoughts?

[djbon]

Should be fine. Nothing much to consume during cycling. I would recommend seeding your DT as well to speed up the process. Would love to hear your feedback on how the reactor responds to a cycling tank. Diatoms, cyano and algae are common in a new tank, if none popped up than it will be a new benchmark that I would love to add into my records.

[stormrider27]

Originally Posted by djbon

Should be fine. Nothing much to consume during cycling. I would recommend seeding your DT as well to speed up the process. Would love to hear your feedback on how the reactor responds to a cycling tank. Diatoms, cyano and algae are common in a new tank, if none popped up than it will be a new benchmark that I would love to add into my records.

I will definitely post my results and pictures once I get everything up and running. My aquascape was put together with dry rock so I purchased a box of bio balls to use in my sump that are cycling in a 10 gallon tank along with one of the rocks that will be going into the main tank. I've learned the hard way to take it slow.

[djbon]

All the best stormrider27!.

[Borealis]

Hi djbon, I’m really interested in your Nitrate destroyer, but I have a few questions about which media I should use.

I have a 200 gallon setup, and I bought the materials for a reactor with a width of 11cm (about 4 1/3 inch) and a height of 65cm (about 25,5 inch).

- Can I substitute the ceramic bioballs for plastic ones? I can’t find the ceramic ones here in the Netherlands.
- Should I use only the bigger balls, or also the smaller ones?
- What is the difference between bio rings and ceramic rings?
- Can Seachem Matrix and Seachem denitrate be substituted by something else?

Btw I don’t have extremely high nitrates (Nitrate is 9 and phosphates are 0.05), but the reactor interests me because of the higher efficiency and directly dosing carbon to where it will be used.

[djbon]

Hi borealis. Thank you for the interest. The first chamber might be okay for plastic bio balls as long as the diameter is less than 1.5". We need a huge surface area in the first chamber to speed up nitrification process, and quickly depletes oxygen along the reactor. The second chambers requires deeper pores for denitrification, you can use crushed coral of various sizes in here. Just make sure the media is loosely packed otherwise it will clogged. The sandwiching method is simply to avoid clogging. Ceramic rings are less porous (very condensed pores) whilst bio rings are very porous and light, you can clearly see the pores and feels rough.

[Borealis]

Thanks a lot! I will try out your suggestions

[djbon]

Sure borealis. No problem. Make sure you seed the reactor and go slow with the vodka. Start with small amount (1ml or less) for a couple of weeks as your nitrate is quite low. Zero nitrate/phosphates are bad for corals.

[Borealis]

Originally Posted by djbon

Sure borealis. No problem. Make sure you seed the reactor and go slow with the vodka. Start with small amount (1ml or less) for a couple of weeks as your nitrate is quite low. Zero nitrate/phosphates are bad for corals.

I'm aware of that, but thanks for the heads up!