High Nitrates

carnold5 · 05/22/2019, 02:19 PM

Hello all! I have been fighting this diatom/brown algae for about a year now. I have adjusted the light schedule to 10 hrs. Cleaned every stinking part/hose, overfill, i vacuum the substrate weekly, do 10 gallon change every week. I just scrapped the glass yesterday and today, it is filled with brown algae! I'm at a lose on this one. IT's a 90 gallon with 8 fish (2 tang, 3 chromis, anthisis, 1 goby, 1 clownfish). 3 LPS coral. 2 powerhead, a HOB reef octopus skimmer. The filtration is, from what i hear, a trickle tower. I am thinking i must have a filtration problem! The trickle tower is like 10 gallons or less. My last (about 2 weeks ago) water readings were:
Salinity: 1.025
pH: 7.9
Calcium: 340
KH: 6
Nitrate: 30
phosphate: .25

I need some advice on how to get rid of this diatom/brown algae. Also, diatom is starting to accumulate on the substrate

mcgyvr · 05/22/2019, 07:20 PM

Cal/alk is too low..
Nitrate is higher but decent...phosphate is high.

You are likely overfeeding the tank and lack sufficient bacteria needed to reduce levels naturally. .
Carbon dosing is what I would recommend.. Just vinegar is fine.
Id also cut back on feeding.

gaby_scan · 05/22/2019, 08:14 PM

Try feeding every other day, also your alk/magnesium are low, calcium should be around 420 and alk around 8-9dkh. Your phosphates are also high, that is why you are getting that algae problem. Hit for .03,.07 and your algae problem will improve. Had the same problem with phosphates and algae a while back, my problem turn out to be a bad test kit, it was reading .05 but in reality I was around the same phosphates as you are.

carnold5 · 05/23/2019, 06:08 AM

My local fish store told me to scrap off the coraline that was on the back glass due to the brown algae that had stuck to it. Also, they suspected that was the reason the calcium was low (coraline was absorbing the calcium). Also, last water changes = 1 week 20 gallon, next week 20 gallon, following week 20 gallons, the next week 10 gallon, next week 10 gallon and last saturday i did another 20 gallon. So 100 gallons in 6 weeks. I thought this would defeat the brown algae but it persists! My feeding pattern is once a day. 1 cube of usually misys shrimp and phytofeast about 2 times a week.

I have heard of dosing with vinegar but have not due to other factors like how that messes with other water elements. So i found this:

http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index....arine-aquarium

Will i need to dose anything else when doing with vinegar? I suck at chemistry...

Uncle99 · 05/23/2019, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnold5

My local fish store told me to scrap off the coraline that was on the back glass due to the brown algae that had stuck to it. Also, they suspected that was the reason the calcium was low (coraline was absorbing the calcium). Also, last water changes = 1 week 20 gallon, next week 20 gallon, following week 20 gallons, the next week 10 gallon, next week 10 gallon and last saturday i did another 20 gallon. So 100 gallons in 6 weeks. I thought this would defeat the brown algae but it persists! My feeding pattern is once a day. 1 cube of usually misys shrimp and phytofeast about 2 times a week.

I have heard of dosing with vinegar but have not due to other factors like how that messes with other water elements. So i found this:

http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index....arine-aquarium

Will i need to dose anything else when doing with vinegar? I suck at chemistry...

I suck at chemistry too...so I use NoPox to manage nitrate, but like mcgyvr said not so bad at 30ppm, I like 2-5ppm myself and a max of 10 ppm for mixed.

But the problem, as mcgyvr corrects points to is more likley phosphate...too high....carbon dosing (vinegar, NoPox, vodka) does little to reduce phosphate....you need GFO to reduce this nutrient.

mcgyvr · 05/24/2019, 06:53 AM

While you can certainly use gfo to reduce the phosphate I would start by reducing feeding first to see if it will trend down on its own.. If not then carbon dosing and some gfo would be fine..

carnold5 · 05/24/2019, 06:52 PM

Yeah, i google searched and saw that GFO was the way to go. So i went to my LFS and picked up some phosban. Put it in the overflow area and it has been in there about 24 hrs now.

AlexR · 05/24/2019, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnold5

Yeah, i google searched and saw that GFO was the way to go. So i went to my LFS and picked up some phosban. Put it in the overflow area and it has been in there about 24 hrs now.

Using GFO in a phosban reactor is your best bet. Like a two little fishes one, that’s what I use.
Just be sure to add the GFO slowly. Too quick will remove phosphates from the water column fast but algae will continue to consume your sand a live rock.
A slow process of removing phosphates yields better results. Add 1/4 of the recommended value and slowly - over several weeks - raise it to a full dosage.

carnold5 · 06/04/2019, 06:13 AM

Water parameters as of last saturday:
phosphate 0
nitrate 0
calcium 350

I have been using phosban and vinegar dosing (day 7 of vinegar doing). I also did a 10 gallon water change and i still see brown algae forming on the substrate and it forms on the glass now every other day instead of every day. I just don't understand what in the world is causing the continual brown algae in the water. As far as i can see, the only 2 things left are my skimmer and filtration system. The skimmer is a HOB reef octopus 2000. I have had to manually start the skimmer by pulling air through the air hose to get it making bubbles. I'm fairly certain the skimmer is working as the collection cup gets dirty and has dirty water in it. Maybe its not running efficiently... Maybe my bioload is more than that skimmer can handle...
I have plans to make a custom sump out of a 30 gallon tank in hopes that will help out. How do i determine the size of the baffles in the sump?

reefgeezer · 06/04/2019, 07:24 AM

I think a refugium in a small sump isn't very effective for nutrient control. I just build mine with a skimmer and return bay. I use baffles that are 1" apart with the center one 1" off the bottom. A better skimmer is a great idea.

What kind of brown algae are you seeing... Is it like a fine brown dust that wipes off easily, a fuzzy tan coating that is hard to get off of glass or rocks, a reddish-brown mat that comes off easily, or something else? Does it increase with light and disappear when the light are off?

carnold5 · 06/04/2019, 01:39 PM

I agree but this 30 gallon is all i have and can't find one to fit under my tank. So i thought i would also put mangroves, maybe some songes and macro algae in the refugium. To answer about what brown algae i have attached some pictures for your perusal. Its kinda hard to see but maybe your trained eye can spot it. Some i can just brush off and some it's like brushing off a layer but its still there. The glass stuff is kinda fuzzy and comes off easy. The appears green algae on my rocks now too...

reefgeezer · 06/04/2019, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnold5

...So i thought i would also put mangroves, maybe some songes and macro algae in the refugium.

If you decide on using a fuge, skip the Mangroves. They do very little for nutrient reduction.

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnold5

To answer about what brown algae i have attached some pictures for your perusal. Its kinda hard to see but maybe your trained eye can spot it. Some i can just brush off and some it's like brushing off a layer but its still there. The glass stuff is kinda fuzzy and comes off easy. The appears green algae on my rocks now too...

The pictures are hard to see, but it doesn't look like you have a big problem.
The tank looks rather new. You should be seeing a little ugly stuff about now. Don't overreact. Your goal should be to keep it from getting out of hand without disturbing the system too much. I'd just stay with the GFO and vinegar. Wipe the glass and vacuum/blast the rock during water changes. It will take a while, but the uglies should start to go away. Maybe add some clean-up crew members to help. Your GFO might get expended really fast at first so check it often.

bshow24 · 06/04/2019, 04:27 PM

How much live rock/sand is in the tank? What's the lighting you're using? Do you have a CUC helping control the algae?

A sump is always beneficial because it adds more water volume and allows you to have better equipment. I'd skip out on the live rock rubble, make that your skimmer section instead. Rubble, unless cleaned well, can trap detritus and cause more problems, plus having a skimmer in the same section as a return pump is going to mean micro bubbles galore in your display. As for baffles, you can buy custom kits and it's really up to you where you put them. Depends what kind of equipment/size. When I made a custom sump, I typically had a very large skimmer section (usually 12-15 inches), then a small section for chaeto, and finally the return section which was only about 5 inches wide. I'd run my reactors off a manifold from the return pump and have them drain back into the refugium.

05/22/2019, 02:19 PM	#1
carnold5 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 13	High Nitrates Hello all! I have been fighting this diatom/brown algae for about a year now. I have adjusted the light schedule to 10 hrs. Cleaned every stinking part/hose, overfill, i vacuum the substrate weekly, do 10 gallon change every week. I just scrapped the glass yesterday and today, it is filled with brown algae! I'm at a lose on this one. IT's a 90 gallon with 8 fish (2 tang, 3 chromis, anthisis, 1 goby, 1 clownfish). 3 LPS coral. 2 powerhead, a HOB reef octopus skimmer. The filtration is, from what i hear, a trickle tower. I am thinking i must have a filtration problem! The trickle tower is like 10 gallons or less. My last (about 2 weeks ago) water readings were: Salinity: 1.025 pH: 7.9 Calcium: 340 KH: 6 Nitrate: 30 phosphate: .25 I need some advice on how to get rid of this diatom/brown algae. Also, diatom is starting to accumulate on the substrate

05/22/2019, 07:20 PM	#2
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	Cal/alk is too low.. Nitrate is higher but decent...phosphate is high. You are likely overfeeding the tank and lack sufficient bacteria needed to reduce levels naturally. . Carbon dosing is what I would recommend.. Just vinegar is fine. Id also cut back on feeding. __________________ Who me?

05/24/2019, 06:53 AM	#6
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	While you can certainly use gfo to reduce the phosphate I would start by reducing feeding first to see if it will trend down on its own.. If not then carbon dosing and some gfo would be fine.. __________________ Who me?

06/04/2019, 07:24 AM	#10
reefgeezer Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Wichita KS Posts: 2,621	I think a refugium in a small sump isn't very effective for nutrient control. I just build mine with a skimmer and return bay. I use baffles that are 1" apart with the center one 1" off the bottom. A better skimmer is a great idea. What kind of brown algae are you seeing... Is it like a fine brown dust that wipes off easily, a fuzzy tan coating that is hard to get off of glass or rocks, a reddish-brown mat that comes off easily, or something else? Does it increase with light and disappear when the light are off? __________________ John, Current Tank Info: In-process, 90 Gallon SPS Reef

06/04/2019, 04:27 PM	#13
bshow24 Registered Member Join Date: May 2012 Location: Thousand Oaks, CA Posts: 584	How much live rock/sand is in the tank? What's the lighting you're using? Do you have a CUC helping control the algae? A sump is always beneficial because it adds more water volume and allows you to have better equipment. I'd skip out on the live rock rubble, make that your skimmer section instead. Rubble, unless cleaned well, can trap detritus and cause more problems, plus having a skimmer in the same section as a return pump is going to mean micro bubbles galore in your display. As for baffles, you can buy custom kits and it's really up to you where you put them. Depends what kind of equipment/size. When I made a custom sump, I typically had a very large skimmer section (usually 12-15 inches), then a small section for chaeto, and finally the return section which was only about 5 inches wide. I'd run my reactors off a manifold from the return pump and have them drain back into the refugium. __________________ Tank: Reefer XL 525 Reef Tank Equipment: 2x Radion XR15 Pro, Radion XR30 Pro, Vectra M1 Return, 2x MP40 Powerhead

05/22/2019, 08:14 PM	#3
gaby_scan Registered Member Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 150	Try feeding every other day, also your alk/magnesium are low, calcium should be around 420 and alk around 8-9dkh. Your phosphates are also high, that is why you are getting that algae problem. Hit for .03,.07 and your algae problem will improve. Had the same problem with phosphates and algae a while back, my problem turn out to be a bad test kit, it was reading .05 but in reality I was around the same phosphates as you are.

05/23/2019, 06:08 AM	#4
carnold5 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 13	My local fish store told me to scrap off the coraline that was on the back glass due to the brown algae that had stuck to it. Also, they suspected that was the reason the calcium was low (coraline was absorbing the calcium). Also, last water changes = 1 week 20 gallon, next week 20 gallon, following week 20 gallons, the next week 10 gallon, next week 10 gallon and last saturday i did another 20 gallon. So 100 gallons in 6 weeks. I thought this would defeat the brown algae but it persists! My feeding pattern is once a day. 1 cube of usually misys shrimp and phytofeast about 2 times a week. I have heard of dosing with vinegar but have not due to other factors like how that messes with other water elements. So i found this: http://reefkeeping.com/joomla/index....arine-aquarium Will i need to dose anything else when doing with vinegar? I suck at chemistry...

05/24/2019, 06:52 PM	#7
carnold5 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 13	Yeah, i google searched and saw that GFO was the way to go. So i went to my LFS and picked up some phosban. Put it in the overflow area and it has been in there about 24 hrs now.