What order should I add these fish to my aquarium?

Chris918 · 03/19/2018, 12:19 AM

Hello,

I have a Red Sea Reefer 350. (73 gallon; 91 with sump)

These are the fish I have selected:
Ocellaris Clownfish (2)
Scopas Tang
Foxface Rabbitfish/Flame Angelfish
Ignitus Anthias (3)

Can I add anymore fish in addition to this list? Regardless if I can add more, what order would you add these fish in? I am a bit torn on the Rabbitfish and Angel bc I've heard stories of them being reef safe coming down to the particular fish. Please share your experience and thank you in advance if you can provide a list of which fish should be added first and also if there are any husbandry issues.

Thank you!

umairz01 · 03/19/2018, 01:04 AM

Well i'm no expert however would suggest following order:

Ocellaris Clownfish (2)
Ignitus Anthias (3)
Foxface Rabbitfish/Flame Angelfish
Scopas Tang

Believe for Tang and foxface there should be more space, but best of luck with your choice.

Chris918 · 03/19/2018, 01:07 AM

Yes the space was something I was trying to be careful on. Liveaquaria lists 70 gallons for a Foxface and 120 for a Scopas. However, I hear the opposite from some and differing size recommendations from others. Husbandry is my number 1 goal here. It becomes one heck of an argument when tank size and fish selection come into play haha. I just want what's best for the fish.

Chris918 · 03/19/2018, 01:08 AM

If anyone has any experience with either the foxface or flame angel in a reef tank please let me know. Also I'm happy to hear more opinions on the size of this tank compared to the fish.

thegrun · 03/19/2018, 09:06 AM

I would advise against both fish in a 73 gallon tank. Both the Foxface and the Angel are very likely to get overly aggressive when confined to a tank under 120 gallons, and even at 120 gallons I had to remove a Flame Angel as it started killing it's tank mates. The Flame Angel also poses a substantial risk of nipping or even destroying corals. They are one of my favorite fish but nearly all will at least nip at corals, many eventually start full on eating corals.
I think you would be a lot safer with either a Kole Tang or a Bristletooth Tang rather than the Scopas Tang again due to aggression issues.

nereefpat · 03/19/2018, 09:59 AM

I would add the anthias first. They are the most delicate of the list, and you want them well established and eating well.

Then the clown pair.

A foxface gets too large, in my opinion.

A scopas/yellow/purple tang is an ok choice, but not ideal. I agree a Ctenochaetus (bristetooth genus) tang would be a better choice, as long as it isn't a chevron. Look at kole, twin spot, truncated, white tail. If you do go with a tang, add it last.

I agree that a flame angel is a coral risk. Many folks have them in reefs. It will probably be safer with SPS and most softies than with clams or fleshy LPS like brains and acans or zoas. The cherub and fireball/flameback are cousins of the flame that stay a little smaller.

Chris918 · 03/19/2018, 12:11 PM

Thank you both for your insight. I'll look at the options that you have presented. I certainly don't want to cause issues between the fish.

hkgar · 03/19/2018, 02:46 PM

I use this as a good guide for tangs

jI have had Flame Angels in my reef tank in the past and never had a problem. But, it can be hit or miss.

Chris918 · 03/19/2018, 05:25 PM

Thank you that is the link I was looking for but couldn't find. I was hoping that following this would be wise, however bertoni lists the Scopas as suitable for a 75, while many individuals I have spoken to and some who replied tp this topic disagree about.

Crooked Reef · 03/20/2018, 06:36 AM

Tangs are a hotly debated topic wherever you go. They are an open water fish that will actually travel from one reef to another, sometimes over great distances giving them a pretty big territory in the wild. Taking them and sticking them in a glass box goes against their natural instincts that have evolved over time. This is the same for other species as well, but some adjust better than others and some stress more. Tangs in my opinion are more apt to stress. In the tang species though each fish is individual. Some may be fine getting lazy and fat with you bringing food to them and some may want more freedom and never adjust well no matter what size tank they go in. If you get a small enough tang that stays on the small side and keep them in a relatively peaceful setting, it may be easier to keep them long term. The wider that tank for swimming space and the more rock you have for them to graze on the better. I used to have a 65 gallon tank (3 foot tank) and have tried a couple of yellow tangs in it. They did not work out. A Kole tang did great in there though. I now have a 90 gallon and have a yellow tang who seems peaceful and not stressed at all. Happy and fat and comes up to my hand when I place nori sheets in the tank. He did get a bit mad when I put a virgate rabbitfish in the tank and showed some aggression to it for a couple of days, but since they swim mostly together once he found out there is enough food and the rabbit wasn’t out to dominate him. The rabbit did get a couple of punctures in his side from the tang, real shallow but not slashed but I never saw the rabbit raise his spikes during their couple of days of battles. They were the same size.

If you really want to try a tang I would suggest a Kole. They are excellent fish and usually do well in smaller tanks compared to other tangs. There are also captive bred yellow tangs now but I don’t know how hard they are to find or how expensive they are. They may be better suited to a tank than their wild caught brethren. Tangs do produce a lot of waste though, so make sure your tank can handle them and that you are up to doing water changes as necessary.

Scopas tangs can get 12” long making a smaller tank real cramped. They are a free swimming fish and when they get 10”-12” they will have difficulty turning and grazing on your rock. They may work out when they are small, but at the very least you must be aware that sooner or later if they live to their full potential, you will need a bigger tank or be prepared to trade the fish. Kole tangs get 7” and yellow 8” I believe. This is why they are stated as being better for smaller tanks than the scopas.

hkgar · 03/20/2018, 11:55 AM

My Kole is about 3 inches and seems to have stopped growing. My Purple is a little larger and also does not seem to be growing. My Atlantic, on the other hand, is about 7-8 inches and may still be growing.

03/19/2018, 12:19 AM	#1
Chris918 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 174	What order should I add these fish to my aquarium? Hello, I have a Red Sea Reefer 350. (73 gallon; 91 with sump) These are the fish I have selected: Ocellaris Clownfish (2) Scopas Tang Foxface Rabbitfish/Flame Angelfish Ignitus Anthias (3) Can I add anymore fish in addition to this list? Regardless if I can add more, what order would you add these fish in? I am a bit torn on the Rabbitfish and Angel bc I've heard stories of them being reef safe coming down to the particular fish. Please share your experience and thank you in advance if you can provide a list of which fish should be added first and also if there are any husbandry issues. Thank you!

03/19/2018, 09:59 AM	#6
nereefpat Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Central Nebraska Posts: 3,190	I would add the anthias first. They are the most delicate of the list, and you want them well established and eating well. Then the clown pair. A foxface gets too large, in my opinion. A scopas/yellow/purple tang is an ok choice, but not ideal. I agree a Ctenochaetus (bristetooth genus) tang would be a better choice, as long as it isn't a chevron. Look at kole, twin spot, truncated, white tail. If you do go with a tang, add it last. I agree that a flame angel is a coral risk. Many folks have them in reefs. It will probably be safer with SPS and most softies than with clams or fleshy LPS like brains and acans or zoas. The cherub and fireball/flameback are cousins of the flame that stay a little smaller. __________________ Pat Current Tank Info: 125 in-wall , 40b sump. 6 bulb T5. ASM G2 skimmer. LPS and leathers

03/19/2018, 02:46 PM	#8
hkgar Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Dewitt MI Posts: 5,051	I use this as a good guide for tangs jI have had Flame Angels in my reef tank in the past and never had a problem. But, it can be hit or miss. __________________ Gary 180 gallon, 40 gallon sump, 3 250 W MH + 4 80W ATI T5's, MTC MVX 36 Skimmer, Apex controller Aquamaxx T-3 CaRx Current Tank Info: A 2 Barred Rabbitfish, Red Head Salon, Yellow/Purple, McMaster Fairy, Possum, 2 Leopard Wrasses, Kole, & Atlantic Blue Tangs, 2 Percula Clown, 3 PJ and 1 Banggai Cardinalfish , Swallowtail, Bellus and Coral Beauty Angels

03/20/2018, 06:36 AM	#10
Crooked Reef Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 1,765	Tangs are a hotly debated topic wherever you go. They are an open water fish that will actually travel from one reef to another, sometimes over great distances giving them a pretty big territory in the wild. Taking them and sticking them in a glass box goes against their natural instincts that have evolved over time. This is the same for other species as well, but some adjust better than others and some stress more. Tangs in my opinion are more apt to stress. In the tang species though each fish is individual. Some may be fine getting lazy and fat with you bringing food to them and some may want more freedom and never adjust well no matter what size tank they go in. If you get a small enough tang that stays on the small side and keep them in a relatively peaceful setting, it may be easier to keep them long term. The wider that tank for swimming space and the more rock you have for them to graze on the better. I used to have a 65 gallon tank (3 foot tank) and have tried a couple of yellow tangs in it. They did not work out. A Kole tang did great in there though. I now have a 90 gallon and have a yellow tang who seems peaceful and not stressed at all. Happy and fat and comes up to my hand when I place nori sheets in the tank. He did get a bit mad when I put a virgate rabbitfish in the tank and showed some aggression to it for a couple of days, but since they swim mostly together once he found out there is enough food and the rabbit wasn’t out to dominate him. The rabbit did get a couple of punctures in his side from the tang, real shallow but not slashed but I never saw the rabbit raise his spikes during their couple of days of battles. They were the same size. If you really want to try a tang I would suggest a Kole. They are excellent fish and usually do well in smaller tanks compared to other tangs. There are also captive bred yellow tangs now but I don’t know how hard they are to find or how expensive they are. They may be better suited to a tank than their wild caught brethren. Tangs do produce a lot of waste though, so make sure your tank can handle them and that you are up to doing water changes as necessary. Scopas tangs can get 12” long making a smaller tank real cramped. They are a free swimming fish and when they get 10”-12” they will have difficulty turning and grazing on your rock. They may work out when they are small, but at the very least you must be aware that sooner or later if they live to their full potential, you will need a bigger tank or be prepared to trade the fish. Kole tangs get 7” and yellow 8” I believe. This is why they are stated as being better for smaller tanks than the scopas. __________________ “In wine there is wisdom; in beer there is freedom, in water there is bacteria.” - Benjamin Franklin Current Tank Info: 90 gallon reef. Biocube 29 lionfish tank. Mantis tank. Last edited by Crooked Reef; 03/20/2018 at 06:44 AM.

03/20/2018, 11:55 AM	#11
hkgar Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Dewitt MI Posts: 5,051	My Kole is about 3 inches and seems to have stopped growing. My Purple is a little larger and also does not seem to be growing. My Atlantic, on the other hand, is about 7-8 inches and may still be growing. __________________ Gary 180 gallon, 40 gallon sump, 3 250 W MH + 4 80W ATI T5's, MTC MVX 36 Skimmer, Apex controller Aquamaxx T-3 CaRx Current Tank Info: A 2 Barred Rabbitfish, Red Head Salon, Yellow/Purple, McMaster Fairy, Possum, 2 Leopard Wrasses, Kole, & Atlantic Blue Tangs, 2 Percula Clown, 3 PJ and 1 Banggai Cardinalfish , Swallowtail, Bellus and Coral Beauty Angels

03/19/2018, 01:04 AM	#2
umairz01 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2017 Posts: 8	Well i'm no expert however would suggest following order: Ocellaris Clownfish (2) Ignitus Anthias (3) Foxface Rabbitfish/Flame Angelfish Scopas Tang Believe for Tang and foxface there should be more space, but best of luck with your choice.

03/19/2018, 01:07 AM	#3
Chris918 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 174	Yes the space was something I was trying to be careful on. Liveaquaria lists 70 gallons for a Foxface and 120 for a Scopas. However, I hear the opposite from some and differing size recommendations from others. Husbandry is my number 1 goal here. It becomes one heck of an argument when tank size and fish selection come into play haha. I just want what's best for the fish.

03/19/2018, 01:08 AM	#4
Chris918 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 174	If anyone has any experience with either the foxface or flame angel in a reef tank please let me know. Also I'm happy to hear more opinions on the size of this tank compared to the fish.

03/19/2018, 09:06 AM	#5
thegrun Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Garden Grove, Ca Posts: 17,023	I would advise against both fish in a 73 gallon tank. Both the Foxface and the Angel are very likely to get overly aggressive when confined to a tank under 120 gallons, and even at 120 gallons I had to remove a Flame Angel as it started killing it's tank mates. The Flame Angel also poses a substantial risk of nipping or even destroying corals. They are one of my favorite fish but nearly all will at least nip at corals, many eventually start full on eating corals. I think you would be a lot safer with either a Kole Tang or a Bristletooth Tang rather than the Scopas Tang again due to aggression issues.

03/19/2018, 12:11 PM	#7
Chris918 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 174	Thank you both for your insight. I'll look at the options that you have presented. I certainly don't want to cause issues between the fish.

03/19/2018, 05:25 PM	#9
Chris918 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Posts: 174	Thank you that is the link I was looking for but couldn't find. I was hoping that following this would be wise, however bertoni lists the Scopas as suitable for a 75, while many individuals I have spoken to and some who replied tp this topic disagree about.