Alternative to GFO

[RobZilla04]

Searching for a better alternative to GFO to maintain low PO4. Couple years back I used Phosguard, however I didn't see results. No surprise the market place is flooded with products for PO4 removal/maintenance.

Prefer to have something which can be run in a reactor.

[hegeh]

Can elaborate on didnot see result? Under recomended gfo ammount maybe?

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[Jaffster]

I've had great success using ATM Agent Green, there's plenty of other products also on the market that use Lanthanum Chloride.

It bonds to phosphate and creates small white beads. Though remember that this is an active way of removing PO4 rather than the passive method with GFO, so you'll need to keep on top of it.

I did read a few threads were people were also drip adding to their systems with good success.

[RobZilla04]

Originally Posted by hegeh

Can elaborate on didnot see result? Under recomended gfo ammount maybe?

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

PO4 would steadily increase. Even when changing weekly (more frequently is not worth the $) an increase was still observed.

[RobZilla04]

Originally Posted by Jaffster

I've had great success using ATM Agent Green, there's plenty of other products also on the market that use Lanthanum Chloride.

It bonds to phosphate and creates small white beads. Though remember that this is an active way of removing PO4 rather than the passive method with GFO, so you'll need to keep on top of it.

I did read a few threads were people were also drip adding to their systems with good success.

Looked into this as well and concluded that it is likely more complex and time consuming than I'm willing to commit to.

Hoping to get feedback on other bonding materials which can be run (and safely tumbled lightly) in a reactor.

How were you using the liquid Agent Green? In a sock?

[RobZilla04]

Thoughts/experiences with DrTim's NP-Active Pearls?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B006MP0JBW...detail_0?psc=1

[mcgyvr]

GFO is a generic name for "granular ferric oxide".. There are different brands (Rowaphos,etc...) and quality covered under that..
Phosguard is a "granular aluminum oxide" product..
Lanthanum Chloride is another chemical used for phosphate binding.. More brands there..

However.. Those products ALL work when used correctly..
If its not working then something else is going on..

Of course I also personally feel that if you need phosphate binding products full time you are likely just overfeeding.. and if you can fix that you don't need the GFO,etc..
I have never needed any phosphate products ever..
The only 2 reasons I've seen for phosphate issues in this hobby are overfeeding and purchasing Pukani rock or similar rock with phosphate already bound in it..

Carbon dosing (pearls/vinegar/vodka/nopox,etc...) all do reduce phosphate but don't seem to be as effective as they are at reducing nitrate..

[reefgeezer]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

GFO is a generic name for "granular ferric oxide".. There are different brands (Rowaphos,etc...) and quality covered under that..
Phosguard is a "granular aluminum oxide" product..
Lanthanum Chloride is another chemical used for phosphate binding.. More brands there..

Carbon dosing (pearls/vinegar/vodka/nopox,etc...) all do reduce phosphate but don't seem to be as effective as they are at reducing nitrate..

+1 for all the above. Carbon dosing is simple to implement. You may find you need to add nitrate to enable the process to manage phosphate, but that's simple also. You can automate the process cheaply also.

You could turn reactor it into a Cheato Reactor. That'll help with phosphates. Size is usually a limiting factor though.

[mcgyvr]

Always a good video when phosphate questions come up..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZRIKW-9d2xI

[hkgar]

I over feed and my SPS love me for it. I do dose carbon (a 70/30 mix of vinegar/vodka at 40 ml/day) and do run GFO if PO4 creeps up above .05

[bertoni]

PhosGuard will work, if enough is used, but it will release some aluminum, which sometimes seems to cause problems. GFO seems to be fine. How high is the phosphate level? GFO (and PhosGuard) can be exhausted in a few hours if the GFO level is very high at all.

For a 90g reef, I might start with ¼ cup or less, depending on the phosphate level, but I am fairly cautious.

[RobZilla04]

It was 0.45 when I put GFO back in to reduce it. I do feed slightly heavy, mostly to keep a few fish from nipping at the coral.

[hegeh]

Using GFO in reactor? Never heard gfo did not do its work.. mine was half the recomended ratio and its too effective.. rowaPhos is very good imo

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

[LobsterOfJustice]

Am I the only one wondering why OP wants something that is run like GFO and does the same thing as GFO, but isn’t GFO?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[bertoni]

I would expect the media to be exhausted in a few hours if run in a reactor. That level is fairly high.

[RobZilla04]

Originally Posted by LobsterOfJustice

Am I the only one wondering why OP wants something that is run like GFO and does the same thing as GFO, but isn’t GFO?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by bertoni

I would expect the media to be exhausted in a few hours if run in a reactor. That level is fairly high.

Exactly why I am searching for a media (similar to GFO) which does not exhaust so quickly and strip so much PO4.

As in the original post the question I posed was a similar type media for maintenance.

At this point going to use a small amount of GFO 24/7 for a while since I am seeing good results.

[homer1475]

Might want to try some high capacity GFO from BRS. While it's still GFO, it can absorb a lot more then regular old GFO and won't be exhausted so quickly. I had good results with the HC GFO when regular GFO was being exhausted so quickly when I had a PO4 issue.



Only caveat is it's a bit more expensive.

[mcgyvr]

If you want it to work "slower" just run it in a media bag and not in a reactor..
That way you can continue to feed heavily and continue to maintain your current level..

[RobZilla04]

Originally Posted by homer1475

Might want to try some high capacity GFO from BRS. While it's still GFO, it can absorb a lot more then regular old GFO and won't be exhausted so quickly. I had good results with the HC GFO when regular GFO was being exhausted so quickly when I had a PO4 issue.



Only caveat is it's a bit more expensive.

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

If you want it to work "slower" just run it in a media bag and not in a reactor..
That way you can continue to feed heavily and continue to maintain your current level..

Thx will look into both of these options.

Finally what is the negative to running GFO (in small amounts) 24/7 if any?

[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by RobZilla04

Thx will look into both of these options.

Finally what is the negative to running GFO (in small amounts) 24/7 if any?

Its going to be exhausted quickly and then just useless sitting there..

Its basically a sponge in a puddle.. It fills up to what it can take then you just have a wet sponge in a puddle..

IMO...Identify/stop the reason for the elevated phosphate then use GFO to drop it and then discontinue GFO.
I personally don't understand why people run it long term..

[RobZilla04]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

Its going to be exhausted quickly and then just useless sitting there..

Its basically a sponge in a puddle.. It fills up to what it can take then you just have a wet sponge in a puddle..

IMO...Identify/stop the reason for the elevated phosphate then use GFO to drop it and then discontinue GFO.
I personally don't understand why people run it long term..

My reason is probably similar to most if not all others: feeding. I know I overfeed (slightly or moderately).

I have a pair of damsels which pick at birdsnest coral. The way to eliminate this is to make sure they are full and happy. Additionally I tend to leave monthly for at least a few days during which time the fish are unfed. Overfeeding during the week compensates.

[reefgeezer]

It is possible to regenerate GFO. It's a PIA but cuts expenses.

[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by RobZilla04

I have a pair of damsels which pick at birdsnest coral. The way to eliminate this is to make sure they are full and happy.

Nothing like needing to pay for GFO and excessive food for a few dollars in fish..
Flush them and problem solved..
Its damsels man.. Dime a dozen.. Solve the problem..

[RobZilla04]

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

Nothing like needing to pay for GFO and excessive food for a few dollars in fish..
Flush them and problem solved..
Its damsels man.. Dime a dozen.. Solve the problem..

If catching them was only that easy. Guess a fish trap would solve that problem.

Six months or so ago I destroyed half my scape to remove one of them. That effort took a week to accomplish and weeks more to rescape/recover.

Not to mention I'd still have excess nutrients just from the bio load, even if I removed two small damsels.

[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by RobZilla04

Not to mention I'd still have excess nutrients just from the bio load, even if I removed two small damsels.

And a single shot of GFO will take care of that right after you stop overfeeding

Or if you are having both nitrate and phosphate issues then try carbon dosing if you aren't already.. That will drop both..
I'd recommend vinegar or vodka vs biopellets.. Liquid is just so much easier/faster,etc...