Calling all engineers!! - Page 2

laverda · 04/16/2018, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sisterlimonpot

I'm well along with a build for my 300g in-wall tank. I'm about to start building the stand (out of wood) and need some engineering guidance.

My tank is 96" long 30" deep and 24" tall. the front of the tank will be sitting on 2x6 rails with 2x4 uprights every 16".

Plenty of support up front, here's where I need the help of the engineers, for the back of the tank I want to have it completely open, which means the top rails are going to have to be pretty beefy. What do I need to carry the weight of the 300g and have very little (or within acceptable limits) deflection on that top beam?

Thanks for reading.

Shouldn’t the header above the opening be doubled up"

laverda · 04/16/2018, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sisterlimonpot

I'm well along with a build for my 300g in-wall tank. I'm about to start building the stand (out of wood) and need some engineering guidance.

My tank is 96" long 30" deep and 24" tall. the front of the tank will be sitting on 2x6 rails with 2x4 uprights every 16".

Plenty of support up front, here's where I need the help of the engineers, for the back of the tank I want to have it completely open, which means the top rails are going to have to be pretty beefy. What do I need to carry the weight of the 300g and have very little (or within acceptable limits) deflection on that top beam?

Thanks for reading.

Shouldn’t the header above the opening be doubled up? Also it needs to be supported properly on the left end.

Sisterlimonpot · 04/16/2018, 09:33 AM

There is, you just can't see it.

Sisterlimonpot · 04/16/2018, 09:34 AM

9' ceilings outside and 8' inside....

Crusty Old Shellback · 04/16/2018, 12:06 PM

For the engineers, what if he made a I beam out of 2X4 and 2X6 or 2X8, would that help carrying the load better than just a 2x8?
Glued and screwed together. Route a rabbit in the 2X4 about 1/3 way thru for the 2X6 or 2X8 to fit in. So 2X6 or 8 on the vertical, capped top and bottom with a 2X4 or even a 2X6.

Sisterlimonpot · 04/16/2018, 01:26 PM

Update,

I went to the local lumber yard and spoke to an engineer of the company that is making my laminate beam. I gave him the numbers (bumped the weight up to 2000 lbs for safe measure).

Long story short, with a .07 deflection at 2000 lbs eight foot long, I needed a 5 1/8"x9" laminate.

Ray, based on what I ordered, I would have had to glue two 2x8's and used another 2x8 rabbited on top and bottom (all screwed and clued) to achieve similar strength.

I know that this is probably going to the extreme. Having the piece of mind that the beam I ordered has been tested and will guarantee what I want.

The last thing I want is to build this stand with, this has what worked for me..., I think this will work..., what I would do..., I feel that this will work... and so on just to have to later add a center upright brace. I wanted factual numbers in which is far beyond my scope of expertise. I'm just glad that I approached this the way I did because I can sleep easy at night.

sus · 04/16/2018, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sisterlimonpot

Update,

I went to the local lumber yard and spoke to an engineer of the company that is making my laminate beam. I gave him the numbers (bumped the weight up to 2000 lbs for safe measure).

Long story short, with a .07 deflection at 2000 lbs eight foot long, I needed a 5 1/8"x9" laminate.

Ray, based on what I ordered, I would have had to glue two 2x8's and used another 2x8 rabbited on top and bottom (all screwed and clued) to achieve similar strength.

I know that this is probably going to the extreme. Having the piece of mind that the beam I ordered has been tested and will guarantee what I want.

The last thing I want is to build this stand with, this has what worked for me..., I think this will work..., what I would do..., I feel that this will work... and so on just to have to later add a center upright brace. I wanted factual numbers in which is far beyond my scope of expertise. I'm just glad that I approached this the way I did because I can sleep easy at night.

Nice. I think this was definitely the way to go! What numbers did he give you? Just curious

Sisterlimonpot · 04/16/2018, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sus

Nice. I think this was definitely the way to go! What numbers did he give you? Just curious

The only number I wrote down was how much it deflected, anything else he said was beyond my comprehension. Sorry

Sisterlimonpot · 04/23/2018, 10:37 AM

Quick update,

I got the tank in the wall and it's currently filled with tap water to check for leaks.

When the tank was empty, I took measurements of the center of the beam to the floor and measured 33.0625 and then again when it was full and got 33.03125. I can live with a 1/32 deflection. And a special thanks to sus for lending your expertise to the matter. I appreciate you navigating me through the process!!

sus · 04/23/2018, 11:16 AM

Happy to help!

What did you use for the vertical timber?

Sisterlimonpot · 04/23/2018, 01:16 PM

I didn't even think to calculate that....on each side there are 3 douglas fur 2x4's, 2 glued and screwed on the 3.5" face and the 3rd glued and screws perpendicular to the 2 other 2x4's, making the uprights 5"x3" column. the uprights are 31.125" tall. Then there is an upright that fastens to the column and extends to the glue lam. Hopefully the pictures will help explain.

sus · 04/23/2018, 01:27 PM

Right on. That should be plenty strong

Jonviviano · 04/24/2018, 01:22 PM

Nice house, Nice build! well done!

Sisterlimonpot · 04/24/2018, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonviviano

Nice house, Nice build! well done!

Thank you, now I can turn my attention to getting the tank and all the equipment ready so that I can one day fill it with livestock.

04/16/2018, 09:33 AM	#28
Sisterlimonpot R.C. Fraternity President Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Litchfeild Park AZ Posts: 11,490 Blog Entries: 2	There is, you just can't see it. __________________ Jimmy MASVC President Dishes are done man! Current Tank Info: 300 in progress

04/16/2018, 09:34 AM	#29
Sisterlimonpot R.C. Fraternity President Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Litchfeild Park AZ Posts: 11,490 Blog Entries: 2	9' ceilings outside and 8' inside.... __________________ Jimmy MASVC President Dishes are done man! Current Tank Info: 300 in progress

04/16/2018, 12:06 PM	#30
Crusty Old Shellback MASVC OG Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Home of the FREE, Thanks to the BRAVE! Posts: 5,089	For the engineers, what if he made a I beam out of 2X4 and 2X6 or 2X8, would that help carrying the load better than just a 2x8? Glued and screwed together. Route a rabbit in the 2X4 about 1/3 way thru for the 2X6 or 2X8 to fit in. So 2X6 or 8 on the vertical, capped top and bottom with a 2X4 or even a 2X6. __________________ Have you THANKED a Veteran lately for the freedoms you take for granted each day? Best quote ever! "This is a hobby for God sakes and so many people get so uptite. A "hobby" so it should be fun and not a cause to worry or go broke." Paul B Current Tank Info: Tankless for a while. RIP my 8+ yr old pair of Naso tangs, 4 + yr old Moorish Idol

04/16/2018, 01:26 PM	#31
Sisterlimonpot R.C. Fraternity President Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Litchfeild Park AZ Posts: 11,490 Blog Entries: 2	Update, I went to the local lumber yard and spoke to an engineer of the company that is making my laminate beam. I gave him the numbers (bumped the weight up to 2000 lbs for safe measure). Long story short, with a .07 deflection at 2000 lbs eight foot long, I needed a 5 1/8"x9" laminate. Ray, based on what I ordered, I would have had to glue two 2x8's and used another 2x8 rabbited on top and bottom (all screwed and clued) to achieve similar strength. I know that this is probably going to the extreme. Having the piece of mind that the beam I ordered has been tested and will guarantee what I want. The last thing I want is to build this stand with, this has what worked for me..., I think this will work..., what I would do..., I feel that this will work... and so on just to have to later add a center upright brace. I wanted factual numbers in which is far beyond my scope of expertise. I'm just glad that I approached this the way I did because I can sleep easy at night. __________________ Jimmy MASVC President Dishes are done man! Current Tank Info: 300 in progress

04/23/2018, 10:37 AM	#34
Sisterlimonpot R.C. Fraternity President Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Litchfeild Park AZ Posts: 11,490 Blog Entries: 2	Quick update, I got the tank in the wall and it's currently filled with tap water to check for leaks. When the tank was empty, I took measurements of the center of the beam to the floor and measured 33.0625 and then again when it was full and got 33.03125. I can live with a 1/32 deflection. And a special thanks to sus for lending your expertise to the matter. I appreciate you navigating me through the process!! __________________ Jimmy MASVC President Dishes are done man! Current Tank Info: 300 in progress

04/23/2018, 11:16 AM	#35
sus Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Arvada Colorado Posts: 606	Happy to help! What did you use for the vertical timber?

04/23/2018, 01:16 PM	#36
Sisterlimonpot R.C. Fraternity President Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Litchfeild Park AZ Posts: 11,490 Blog Entries: 2	I didn't even think to calculate that....on each side there are 3 douglas fur 2x4's, 2 glued and screwed on the 3.5" face and the 3rd glued and screws perpendicular to the 2 other 2x4's, making the uprights 5"x3" column. the uprights are 31.125" tall. Then there is an upright that fastens to the column and extends to the glue lam. Hopefully the pictures will help explain. __________________ Jimmy MASVC President Dishes are done man! Current Tank Info: 300 in progress

04/23/2018, 01:27 PM	#37
sus Premium Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Arvada Colorado Posts: 606	Right on. That should be plenty strong

04/24/2018, 01:22 PM	#38
Jonviviano Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 417	Nice house, Nice build! well done!