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Unread 05/06/2018, 07:44 PM   #1
sea witch1
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Can we start a new lighting thread

It's become very difficult to find up to date info on lighting recommendations in the forums. The large threads are too long to get through and havent had a lot of recent (2018) information posted. Can someone with lighting knowledge please start a thread that begins a discussion on which "lighting" does what in regard to current best practice for coral growth. Thanks in advance.
IMHO it seems you have to already know what your getting in order to gain insight. Not seeing a lot of experienced reefers posting why they use which lighting... pro's and con's for different type tanks


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Unread 05/07/2018, 05:03 AM   #2
mcgyvr
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All the same information still applies..
Nothing has really changed..


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Unread 05/07/2018, 07:00 AM   #3
sea witch1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcgyvr View Post
All the same information still applies..
Nothing has really changed..
Okay that seems reasonable. The problem I'm having is finding the actual points. So much traffic in the post the main points are lost. Thank you for responding.


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Unread 05/07/2018, 07:20 AM   #4
mcgyvr
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Is there a specific post you are talking about?

Or a specific question you have?
Or specific brand you want to ask about?

A lot of it is highly opinionated..

In general..
MH and T5 are still the best (proven across the board) but the downsides to them are heat and cost.. Cost are higher in energy usage and frequent bulb replacement costs..
Pros seem to be a better (proven) spectrum/less chance for self-shadowing (SPS stick problem for the most part) that can be a problem with point source lighting like LEDs.
And for the most part a turn them on and forget it aspect..

LED have certainly been shown to allow one to grow corals and do so while producing less heat to deal with and do not need to be replaced for a LONG time..
Not all LED fixtures are the same.. There are some that are better left for fish only or very low light requirements while others pack more power to allow deeper penetration and higher power levels necessary to achieve higher PAR.
Then you have the virtually infinite adjustments that can help/hurt you and just because you can set it to that color or power level doesn't mean its going to work well for your tank..

Those are pretty much the basics that apply to lights..


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Unread 05/07/2018, 08:56 AM   #5
HarlequinTusk
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I'd love to see separate forums for lighting. Lighting, Filtration, & other equipment encompasses pretty much everything.


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Unread 05/07/2018, 10:06 AM   #6
oreo57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcgyvr View Post
In general..
MH and T5 are still the best (proven across the board)
Naaahhh.... not really.
Even considering LED + t5 vs LED + MH..

each has plusses and minuses.. Dominance is shifting ..

want to believe "special interests".. ?
https://blog.marinedepot.com/2018/03...ld-school.html

Quote:
The fluorescent lamp remains one of the greatest lighting inventions of all time.

HUH.. Kind of funny..


6500K MH's are "superior" to 20000k mh's .. Why isn't everyone using them?

Hmm.. Are you considering the 2 together?
Not sure that holds vs t5/LED pair..

http://www.saltwatersmarts.com/deep-...nologies-6787/



Last edited by oreo57; 05/07/2018 at 10:24 AM.
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Unread 05/08/2018, 10:00 AM   #7
solitude127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oreo57 View Post

6500K MH's are "superior" to 20000k mh's .. Why isn't everyone using them?
Because 6.5k makes corals look brown and dull. Most people like the 20k look because it makes their coral glow in the dark


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Unread 05/08/2018, 12:33 PM   #8
oreo57
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So since it is believed LED's make corals grow slower.. it is no different really.. right?
That is part of the point, people don't use "the best" MH's yet are annoyed w/ LEd's

kind of funny actually..

Look, flourescence, growth, ect are all inter-related in light choices.. making NONE "perfect"..
most seem to think LED's "glow" better.. and really they should if all narrow spectrum blue..
no "visually distracting" "not blue" for the most part..

Then again hard to believe a single narrow bandwidth can grow anything...well..


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Unread 05/08/2018, 05:49 PM   #9
RobZilla04
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Led's as the lone variable don't grow coral any slower or faster than other light sources.


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Unread 05/11/2018, 04:22 PM   #10
sea witch1
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Actually, this is what i wanted ..... dialogue about the pro's and cons of different lighting and why people use one over the other.... regardless of personal preference... just some facts


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Unread 05/14/2018, 06:36 PM   #11
moondoggy4
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A great place to look is BRS video they showed the how the MH verses the T-5 battle, and in the corner the new guy LED's. Lots of great information back up with a very expensive PAR meter. I have all three and each ones has it strengths and weakness.

I am setting up a nano tank that will have LPS so I will start with LEDs and then switch to a four bulb T-5. No need buying bulbs in the beginning.

Lighting is like a tool in the garage, chose the correct tool, and you will get better results, not to many roofers using crescent wrenches for hammers.


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Unread 05/14/2018, 10:02 PM   #12
sea witch1
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Great information. Thank you


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Unread 05/14/2018, 11:46 PM   #13
moondoggy4
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http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh....php?t=2405972 A nice read from Premium Aquatics


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Unread 05/15/2018, 12:23 PM   #14
d2mini
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Do NOT base your decision on coral growth.

What "look" do you like? MH, T5 and LED all can give the tank a distinctive look.
Is electricity a major concern? LED can be more expensive upfront but for someone in California for instance, that money will be recouped more quickly.
Do you have a canopy? Canopies trap heat... something that might sway you to T5 or LED instead of MH.
Are you ok with on/off or do you need all that slow ramping up and down, thunderstorms, etc?
Do you want to be able to change spectrum throughout the day? How much? Change it on the fly with an app or quick button press?
How many fixtures of each will you need and what will that upfront cost be? Don't underestimate how many LED fixtures you'll need... manufacturers are still working on getting better light spread out of them.

These are the kinds of questions you should be asking yourself.


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Unread 05/15/2018, 01:34 PM   #15
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The biggest problem I have is with LED's and knowing what I need to get for the corals I want that will adequately provide the par I need at the depths I need in the foot print I have to work without dropping a grand plus in the process. Being an Old School Reefer, I know what Halides, VHO's, T-5HO's or the combination of two, I need to get the results I want based off experience using them. For those three, I could talk the ear off the side of your face!!! But when it comes to LED's I dont know much about jack really!

For example...I have herd that the Kessil 80 Tuna Blue is capable of lighting up a 10 gallon typical glass box nano reef and adequately light my tank up enough to keep SPS corals, while others suggest that its only good enough PAR wise for LPS and Softies. Some real world experience on what "really works" would be a lot more useful in choosing a light vs relying solely on a manufactures sometimes overly optimistic recommendations.

Just my Buck O Five on this topic...


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Unread 05/19/2018, 03:11 PM   #16
nikon187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imaexpat2 View Post
The biggest problem I have is with LED's and knowing what I need to get for the corals I want that will adequately provide the par I need at the depths I need in the foot print I have to work without dropping a grand plus in the process. Being an Old School Reefer, I know what Halides, VHO's, T-5HO's or the combination of two, I need to get the results I want based off experience using them. For those three, I could talk the ear off the side of your face!!! But when it comes to LED's I dont know much about jack really!

For example...I have herd that the Kessil 80 Tuna Blue is capable of lighting up a 10 gallon typical glass box nano reef and adequately light my tank up enough to keep SPS corals, while others suggest that its only good enough PAR wise for LPS and Softies. Some real world experience on what "really works" would be a lot more useful in choosing a light vs relying solely on a manufactures sometimes overly optimistic recommendations.

Just my Buck O Five on this topic...
you example would depend on the depth of the tank and the height off the water the led was hung. every tank will be different unless all the variables are the same. that being said a kessil 160 would be my choice as the 15w a80 wont cut it for higher light demanding corals.


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Unread 05/19/2018, 03:43 PM   #17
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Thoughts on 2 Kessil 160 or hydra 26 for 75 gal with some basic softie as I am just starting out. W


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Unread 05/19/2018, 07:51 PM   #18
sea witch1
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Thanks for showing an interest. These are similar concerns to the ones I have... It would be helpful if more general information was shared... like a person that has multiple lighting types and there findings... of course tank size will be different but those adjustments can be made independently


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Unread 05/19/2018, 08:26 PM   #19
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Concerning small tanks and leds lights. I have the Kessil 160 and the AI Prime HD.

Pros Kessil 160 do not need a timer, just turn the two knobs to what you like, what to acclimate just turn intensity down.
Con If you have the controller you can only turn down the lights so much, for a ten gallon tank the intensity is to high.
Secondly the spill light crazy.

AI Prime HD.
Pro the color spectrum is much nicer than the Kessil 160, you can mimic the AP+ spectrum, you can download someone else light program so you do not have to the do the math. Less light spill, this light is over my 10 gallon QT tank. It has a built in controller so you save over a 100 bucks from Kessil. At first I hated the AI Prime HD and I was going to sell it, but not anymore.

Con I cannot set it with my new MAC computer, ie I cannot figure out how. Secondly ever phone has a different experience with their interface, mine never had the Done button, so I did not know how to save my program, I would set it up exactly the way I like, I thought I saved it and voila it went right back to 100% across the board, it screwed up my QT tank so bad it killed all of my Aptisa and they have never grown back. In the end I like the AI Prime better. Yeah I am not very tech savvy at all.


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Unread 05/20/2018, 07:17 AM   #20
sea witch1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moondoggy4 View Post
Concerning small tanks and leds lights. I have the Kessil 160 and the AI Prime HD.

Pros Kessil 160 do not need a timer, just turn the two knobs to what you like, what to acclimate just turn intensity down.
Con If you have the controller you can only turn down the lights so much, for a ten gallon tank the intensity is to high.
Secondly the spill light crazy.

AI Prime HD.
Pro the color spectrum is much nicer than the Kessil 160, you can mimic the AP+ spectrum, you can download someone else light program so you do not have to the do the math. Less light spill, this light is over my 10 gallon QT tank. It has a built in controller so you save over a 100 bucks from Kessil. At first I hated the AI Prime HD and I was going to sell it, but not anymore.

Con I cannot set it with my new MAC computer, ie I cannot figure out how. Secondly ever phone has a different experience with their interface, mine never had the Done button, so I did not know how to save my program, I would set it up exactly the way I like, I thought I saved it and voila it went right back to 100% across the board, it screwed up my QT tank so bad it killed all of my Aptisa and they have never grown back. In the end I like the AI Prime better. Yeah I am not very tech savvy at all.
Perfect. Thank you


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Unread 05/20/2018, 02:04 PM   #21
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There are too many tanks doing fantastic with all of the lighting options mentioned above to not take any of the options serious. I started two years ago in this hobby (so take my opinion for what its worth) and spent 1 year with LEDs (Hydra 26HD). I switched to T5s after 1 year, so IME see below:

LED
Pro: controllability, sleek form factor, the blue spectrum light of LEDs is really sharp, last a long time, have proven to grow corals (not so much me on this one, unless you count mushrooms and the beginning new tank uglies)
Con: too much control led me to change settings too often, coverage is not what manufacturers say when you factor in shading, which makes up front costs expensive (depending on brand), some reefer friends who are very experienced by me couldn't get them to work for their tanks for whatever reason.

For my new larger tank I went with T5s again, set it and forget it. So much data out there on PAR, etc. etc. et.

Good luck.


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Unread 05/24/2018, 07:00 PM   #22
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One reason I like MH (and ive tried led) is the simplicity of plug and play. I love to turn it on and it works. When I had led I was always tinkering with the different channels to fit my eye and I didn't have great luck wth them. BUT I also can admit that is more user error than light error. I just like the simplicity of them, my opinion. And they work (plenty of ppl with nice tanks using all types of light)

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Unread 06/01/2018, 05:23 PM   #23
sea witch1
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Well, ive decided to run the big 3 and see what happens. Leds in the front and t-5's along with M-H behind them. I will put in a few common pieces in the front and back and see If i can tell the difference.


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Unread 06/08/2018, 01:39 PM   #24
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want to believe "special interests".. ?
https://blog.marinedepot.com/2018/03...ld-school.html

I don't trust marine crap-O for a minute. As soon as the refurbished products they push start coming back they will close up again. They do this all the time. Open a year close a couple. Open two yrs and close up. You wonder why. They buy refurbished or warranty work and push it out the door. Look over the threads and youtube.

With LED's. It's still really new in terms of being used. LED's are still growing and getting better.


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