Pacific Sun Pandora hyperion hybrid Fanclub

[paal]

Thanks Przemek. Much appreciated.

I just went to the [System] -tab and clicked [Default settings]
When it finished, the current correct time was shown in the LCD. However, the clock would not run after this. (same as when i tried to set new time earlier)
I also tried a [Soft reset] but again: clock did not change.

Everything else seems to be working exactly like before. Only the clock seems bugged.

EDIT:
Nevermind; clock is now running

I spent many hours trying "everything" from resets / new versions / using different phones and PCs. Nothing seemed to help. Clock was frozen.
Tonight though, I noticed the lamp had begun to turn off for the night as scheduled. When I then checked the LCD panel, I noticed the clock was "live" again.

So...I do not know why it was "dead" for a few days, and I do not know what fixed it, but at least now everyting seems OK :P

[kainic]

Hi all,

I'm currently using stock PAR scenario on a PacSun Pandora Hyperion S 2*145 + 4*39 with a 90 minutes sunrise/sunset.
I really like how my aquarium looks when on sunset because the ratio UV/other colors is higher than when not in sunset. All my colors are set at 100% except for red and orange, so I can't increase my UV leds to see the effect I'm looking for. My lamp intensity is at 90% so what I can do is decrease color leds and increase lamp intensity leaving UV leds at 100%.
Sorry if this is not clear enough, english is not my mother language.

TIA
@Przemek_PacSun

[Przemek_PacSun]

Originally Posted by paal

Thanks Przemek. Much appreciated.

I just went to the [System] -tab and clicked [Default settings]
When it finished, the current correct time was shown in the LCD. However, the clock would not run after this. (same as when i tried to set new time earlier)
I also tried a [Soft reset] but again: clock did not change.

Everything else seems to be working exactly like before. Only the clock seems bugged.

EDIT:
Nevermind; clock is now running

I spent many hours trying "everything" from resets / new versions / using different phones and PCs. Nothing seemed to help. Clock was frozen.
Tonight though, I noticed the lamp had begun to turn off for the night as scheduled. When I then checked the LCD panel, I noticed the clock was "live" again.

So...I do not know why it was "dead" for a few days, and I do not know what fixed it, but at least now everyting seems OK :P

Good to hear that :-)


@kainic
UV leds generate very small amount of light - you are not able to see that during the day but as you can see - on each square matrix(20x20mm) there three LED's working(UV) - so corals "can see that lighting by the skin" - human eyes unfortunately not(its working like shutter in photo camera - more light, you can't see high energy light - short waves).

[kainic]

@kainic
UV leds generate very small amount of light - you are not able to see that during the day but as you can see - on each square matrix(20x20mm) there three LED's working(UV) - so corals "can see that lighting by the skin" - human eyes unfortunately not(its working like shutter in photo camera - more light, you can't see high energy light - short waves).

I'll try to explain again. I'm looking for a "pop" on my corals. I want to increase fluorescence in my corals. When my lamp is on sunset, the colors on my corals just "pop". What should I do to mimic this when not on sunset? I'm running stock PAR scenario with 90min sunset. What is my lamp doing on sunset? Can explain me the changes on light when on sunset?

Thanks again

[Przemek_PacSun]

It's not working like you think.
Why corals "pop"? Because they have built special pigments (usually gamma flour proteins) which absorb some light and reflect the rest.
Green corals "pop" under blue light.
Why?I will try to explain it on green pigments.
Take a look for chart below:


Corals lighted by blue light(about 450nm - typical Royal Blue led) took some energy from wavelengths. If energy is smaller - lightwaves are longer - so there is spectrum shift from blue to green(usually - many pigments are active in this spectrum range).

Take a look for another chart:


You can see several points on chart - X axis is information about excitation wavelengths (used for lighting corals in simple words) - on Y axis you can see what kind of light(color/ lengths) is emitted by coral pigment . You can see that in almost all situation in GFP pigments "absorbed" light have higher energy(shorter wavelengths) than emitted light - cause coral "take" some energy from this light (so there is spectrum shift - blu light used - green coral is "popping" , used yellow light - "more red is emitted by corals " etc.
Thats why it's important to use properly designed led panels with less which emit light in proper spectrum range.
But..
If you will use only Blue lights(or mostly blue only - from LED which is monochromatic kind of light) your corals will have very nicely built green pigments - but all other colors will gone.
Most important for corals spectrum is between 490 to 550nm). Other important area is 570-595nm. Thats why you should have cyan, lime, green channels on during the day turned on (and set for high power) - the same like amber(585nm).

Reasuming :-)
If you like your corals popping during sunset - it good, but left it only for sunset. If you will have that kind dominated during whole day - your corals will look bad after weeks/months. They will not adapt to "catching" light from different spectrum areas and pigments will not be built in coral skin.

PS. I hope that you understood what I tried to tell you. We are not making led panels for human eyes - but for nice looking corals in long term. But you need to remember that LED light(as high energy light source) require some additional supplementation for corals. It's like in plant tank - if you will use too strong light but without carbon dioxide supplementation - plants will not grow.
With corals it's looking the same - you have to remember about proper levels of Potassium, Strontium(it's responsible for calcification process) and Iron. From my personal experience - it's better to have some organic discoverable by aquarium test instead of having ULNS and stron LED light - it's like asking for troubles...

Have a nice weekend.

Regards

Przemek

[kainic]

Originally Posted by Przemek_PacSun

It's not working like you think.
Why corals "pop"? Because they have built special pigments (usually gamma flour proteins) which absorb some light and reflect the rest.
Green corals "pop" under blue light.
Why?I will try to explain it on green pigments.
Take a look for chart below:


Corals lighted by blue light(about 450nm - typical Royal Blue led) took some energy from wavelengths. If energy is smaller - lightwaves are longer - so there is spectrum shift from blue to green(usually - many pigments are active in this spectrum range).

Take a look for another chart:


You can see several points on chart - X axis is information about excitation wavelengths (used for lighting corals in simple words) - on Y axis you can see what kind of light(color/ lengths) is emitted by coral pigment . You can see that in almost all situation in GFP pigments "absorbed" light have higher energy(shorter wavelengths) than emitted light - cause coral "take" some energy from this light (so there is spectrum shift - blu light used - green coral is "popping" , used yellow light - "more red is emitted by corals " etc.
Thats why it's important to use properly designed led panels with less which emit light in proper spectrum range.
But..
If you will use only Blue lights(or mostly blue only - from LED which is monochromatic kind of light) your corals will have very nicely built green pigments - but all other colors will gone.
Most important for corals spectrum is between 490 to 550nm). Other important area is 570-595nm. Thats why you should have cyan, lime, green channels on during the day turned on (and set for high power) - the same like amber(585nm).

Reasuming :-)
If you like your corals popping during sunset - it good, but left it only for sunset. If you will have that kind dominated during whole day - your corals will look bad after weeks/months. They will not adapt to "catching" light from different spectrum areas and pigments will not be built in coral skin.

PS. I hope that you understood what I tried to tell you. We are not making led panels for human eyes - but for nice looking corals in long term. But you need to remember that LED light(as high energy light source) require some additional supplementation for corals. It's like in plant tank - if you will use too strong light but without carbon dioxide supplementation - plants will not grow.
With corals it's looking the same - you have to remember about proper levels of Potassium, Strontium(it's responsible for calcification process) and Iron. From my personal experience - it's better to have some organic discoverable by aquarium test instead of having ULNS and stron LED light - it's like asking for troubles...

Have a nice weekend.

Regards

Przemek

Need to digest that amazing answer. Thank you Przemek.

[paal]

Curious to see how you guys have your lamps set up. Please share.


My tank is about 2 years. It did "ok" in the beginning, but I got a nasty outbreak of dinoflagellates after I dropped my nutrients too low (super efficient chaeto reactor). Struggled with the dinos about half a year and finally beat them about two months ago. I lost all my inverts, a few fish and a lot of coral. The surviving SPS are recovering well, and alk consumption is increasing steadily every single week.

LEDs were originally at only 20% because I don't like to have the cooling fans running. I started increasing them little by little after the dinos were gone and now I'm all the way to 75!
Since the SPS have done so well the last few months, I don't dare to turn the LEDs down again, even though I'm quite sure I could(?)

My lamp is set up in the simplest way possible. No custom program, no clouds etc... (only thing not shown below is a moonlight set to 1% + "dark moon". It lasts until 00:05)
The only reason I don't have all the blues set to max is just to get a smoother off-ramping (to keep the fish calm )

Lamp model is 8x39W + 2x145W

[paal]

Maybe imgur works better...?

[Ted_C]

Hi @paal

Mine is very similar to yours. My Lamp power is at 50% though. My Red, Green and Amber is at no more than 25%. everything else is at 100% on the color table.

Some differences: My sunrise to sunset is 08:30 AM through 20:30 PM (08:30 PM).

My T5's are on from 12:30 PM through 16:30 (4:30 PM)

Rather than ramp up via the daylight settings page, I ramp up the lamp via the par table page. My Sunrise / sunset is 210 minutes (3.5 hours) - so my lamps only reach full intensity at 12:00 PM (Noon) and start ramping down at 17:00 PM (5 PM) to sunset at 20:30 PM (8:30 PM).

I do this for one main reason: any interruption to the power during the ramp up / ramp down would affect the intensity of the lights. The par table seems to handle this better than the daylight settings page. While this isn't usually an issue, since I have these plugged into an APEX unit - the apex routinely resets itself and I would not have the ramp up if the power were interrupted.

I say if what you have is working for you - don't change. You have some lovely colonies that seem to be growing very well.

[paal]

Thanks for the reply @Ted_C
I have some follow-up questions for you if you do not mind

Which lamp model do you have?
What are your tank's dimensions?
Which t5 bulbs do you run?

How did you end up using your current led configuration?
Personal preference/Aesthetics?
Suggestions from PacSun/others?
Personal trial and error based on coral health/growth?



My setup is simply based on personal preference/aesthetics. (Which is why I am interested in other users experiences...Hopefully slightly more scientific than mine. Haha :P)
I guess most users run the blue channels and UV channel high for the “pop” that you do not get from the T5 alone. Personally, I could have run the lamp with only these channels and I would have been happy (would have just added more white T5s)
However, the red channel also really gives pop to anything red-ish. It is awesome in my opinion, especially with orange/purple/red fish. That is why I crank that channel up as well.
Although it is not really seen that much with all the T5s on, the red (together with the blue) does make a purple-ish ambient look in the tank that I do not like. The cyan channel nullifies this though, which is primarily why I crank that one up as well. (I have found I like to keep it adjusted to the same as the red channel regardless of levels)

The orange channel is what I use to adjust the tank “whiter”. If I crank it too high, the purple corals start looking a bit dull and the white-ish corals turn more towards brown. If the channel is too low, the tank gets the blue windex look. I simply try to achieve a happy medium between the two. 30-50% feels good to me with my current T5 setup. (The crappy mobile pictures I posted makes the tank look a LOT more blue than it really is. The sand bed for example is sparkling white)

Finally, we have the green channel. If anyone has any advice for this channel in regards to coral health I will adjust it accordingly. Mine is set totally random I truly cannot see any color difference with it set to 0 or 100. Maaaaaybe a slightly stronger shimmer-effect?

Regarding the overall LED power set to 75:
Like I mentioned above, I started adjusting it higher and higher once my tank had recovered from the dino-crash. The corals reacted better and better each day, but I am quite sure they would have done so regardless of the LED intensity: corals were probably just happy to finally be rid of the dinos. Maybe I would have had even faster growth if the LEDs were actually lower? I have no idea. The only reason I stopped at 75 was that I did not want any more shimmer effect in the tank. (at that point, the LEDs started overpowering the T5s too much if that makes sense.) I may actually prefer it more at about 66ish, but I am hesitant to change anything at this point.

[Ted_C]

Which lamp model do you have? What are your tank's dimensions?
I have one Pandora S3 145w over my 150 gallon (60 inch x 24 inch x 24 inch)
I have two Pandora S2 145w over my 300 gallon (96 inch x 32 inch x 24 inch)

Which t5 bulbs do you run?
s3: 2x crystal blue 54 watt, 2x SpectraPlus 54 Watt
2 S2's: 4x crystal blue 39 watt, 4x SpectraPlus 39 Watt

How did you end up using your current led configuration?
Lots of research. it seems that the consensus is it's better for the corals with maximum intensity only occurring for no more than 4 hours in a day. Whether this is anecdotal or not - I do not know. If this is based on observing corals in the wild throughout the year to see when the best growth occurs - I do not know. It's what others have reported as good - so that's what I use. I consider the T-5's to "add" to the overall usable light in the system - so they also run during the LED maximum intensity - only 4 hours per day.

The intensity is trial and error. Every tank is different when it comes to types of corals, nutrients (both good and bad), filtration, flow. I ran 30% for the longest time but have had nutrient issues in the past that inhibited my growth. I solved my nutrient issues with a calcium reactor (good nutrients), changing my salt mix (good nutrients) and using a GFO reactor (bad nutrients). 50% seems to be doing a good job at the moment. I'm getting good growth and encrusting. My 300 gallon tank is only 1.5 years running so I do not have the colonies you do.

The use of the par table over the daylight tab is a necessity for me since my Neptune Apex resets almost every day for no good reason - which causes the lamps to briefly lose power - which interrupts the daylight ramp down (example: if my sunset starts at 5:00 PM and has a duration of 210 minutes - if I lose power briefly at 5:01 - then the lights do not come back on after the power is restored until the next morning.

I wish it could be more visibly appealing - but the color settings are necessary for healthy corals. there has been studies about how red wavelengths are not the best for corals (https://www.advancedaquarist.com/2018/4/aafeature)

I dont have a link to a study for green leds - but it's the same recommendation as the red based on info from Pac Sun and others (LFS too).

So my lights are much more blue than I would like - but it's what is good for the corals.

[paal]

Awesome information. Thanks!

For starters, I will at least turn down the green channel. Visually, it does nothing for me anyway, so...
Then I will consider getting a whiter T5 setup in order to turn down both the red and the amber LEDs. Maybe something like 2B+, 2Act, 2C+, 2P+ and then set Amber & Red LED channels to the 20-30 range.

Have to admit, I am also a bit interested in trying 6500k T5s

[Przemek_PacSun]

Hello Paal and Ted_C :-)
We are in the middle of holiday break so please forgive me late reply.
Cyan/Green light is very important for corals - the same like Orange(about 585nm).
Why?
I will try to explain using my poor technical language :-)
There are scientific studies which show that amount of green/yellow light is something like "switch" for corals - informing them on which deep they are growing and what kind of energy/spectrum they can expect.
Due our expedition(a specially - BALI four years ago) we did light measurements on different depths (spectrum and intensity) - on 2, 5,10m depth during different hours during the day.
We saw several colonies on different stages the same species iofcorals - but looking(color) and growing different. Only different was a depth.
Designing Hyperion S panels we tested several different LED chips(hundreds ? ;-) and as you can see - overall spectrum in final models is made from different LED chips - but we are NOT using white LED color chips. It simply not needed, its rather more harmful and helpful for corals and as you can see - many Customers having fixtures with white channels - decrease their intensity very strongly(but overall efficiency of the lamp is also smaller - so corals start going to be brown because energy amount delivered to them is too small. Coral start producing something like "hormone" which tell symbiotic algae to increase their amounts because they need to "catch" more light for coral survival.
For example - during the day Acropora formosa(green slimer as you call them in states as I remember) need to have delivered about 18-23J of energy for proper growth(typical for that species) and also coloration.
Less energy = mean that corals start growing slower and they colors are more darker - too much light mean that corals start going to be pale and due photo inhibition and photo saturation process - also can growing slower - sometimes even stop growth and die(its due increased pH in corals tissue and irritation by saltwater).
Please take a look for following picture(posted by me also previously)

You can see several groups of GFP(gamma flouroproteins responsible for corals "colors") in that important ranges. Most important are Cyan /Green. If you will take a look on range between 490nm to 520nm on X axis - you will see that almost 60-65% of all GFP is placed there - mean they need to be lighted by that kind of light (wavelength) to start showing colors listed on Y axis.(I hope thats clear - if not, please let me know I will show it on exact GFP type on one from well know species).
The same with range about 575-585nm - corals need to be lighted by that wavelengths(X Axis) to start showing pigments listed on Y axis( looking from the bottom - in some corals it will be blue pigments, green, yellow and orange..)
So using RED channel decreased is good idea - however we experienced that in many times orange channel working on full give us very good effects in LONG TERM.
It's very important - LONG TERM - because as many LED lamp users can observe, switching from one source of light to LEDs -in first days, months, weeks corals looks very good(much better than under T5/halide for example) but after some time colors are gone. Thats because spectrum was "nice for our eyes" - but not for corals, their GFP's weren't excited in proper ranges/spectrum - and pigments disappeared.

Best regards

Przemek Cybulski

[paal]

Awesome reply Przemek. Thank you

Again, lamp is doing great both in regards to color and growth, but I am still interested in tweaking it if that would result in better sps health as long as I am at least "OK" with the look. (i have rather dull corals in the first place though. Most of my good looking ones were lost during the dino incident and the closest fish store is about 400km away... :P )

Anyway... given my current T5 setup shown below (8x39W), how would you tweak my current LED setup that I posted a screenshot of above? From your post I assume you would suggest increasing the orange a bit and reduce the red? ...and then maybe leave the other channels as they are?

I know this will be very tank specific, and of course it will vary with what kind of T5 is used, but I just want to make sure I understand you correctly



B+
C+
Act
B+

2x 145W led

B+
Act
C+
B+


Oh, and... when is the beautiful BlueEx T5-bulb making a comeback?

[smokinreefer]

Przemek,

I sent you a message.

I finally opened my lights I ordered long time ago and unfortunately the power supply/cords sent are not the north american version I need.

Please advise how to get this fixed!

Thanks!

Sent from my SM-G955W using Tapatalk

[Przemek_PacSun]

Hello
I got your pm - power supply are universal(110-230v) - maybe only cables are from EU version?
You are patient - waiting 1.5 year without opening box! :-) Haha , I can't hold too long if any new "toy" arrive to my home ;-)

[smokinreefer]

Ok so I can figure out the power cords...
But how do I set up the spider mount?

Is it supposed to be secured to the fixture some how?

None of the holes line up in any fashion that would make sense to me.

Any thoughts?

Also is there an extension cable for the screw on cable between the fixture and the power supply?

Thanks again!

Sent from my SM-G955W using Tapatalk

[PacSun Service]

@smokinreefer :

Hello

Spider mounting set should include metal pins which hold lamp in place - you must screw them in holes in spider mounting.
But I can see also on Your photos that You put spider mountings directly on tank, this is not right as lamp must be mounted minimum 15 cm from water level. You will have to use some additional supports or crown on top of tank to provide proper lamp height over water level. Proper height is very important to avoid water splash on lamp which could damage it. Further questions please send directly at service@pacific-sun.eu - it will allow us to respond faster than here.

Best regards
Pacific Sun Service.

[Rudimenta]

Long time, I had a crash about a year ago and had my corals and most my fish at a friends place. My glass was scratched up so I thought lets just redo the whole thing. In the mean time I have raised one batch of clowns to adult hood which was nice.

My old tank was 160x60x60 and to suite my needs I went 180x70x50 this time. Took me ages to get ultra clear low iron glass here in Nam but I managed.



now the big question, did anybody add fixtures to the sides of their PS? I considering adding either 2 Kessels or Radions, but maybe there are other ideas. I know the fixture will cover most of the tank but that would leave rather a big piece of realestate.

New tank will be bare-bottom and I am going triton ore aquaforest this time. Got a ghost overflow this time, most plumbing supplies are coming this week. So ill make a tank build post maybe later.

[paal]

Awesome looking tank Rudimenta!

Now... just get a 8x24W PandHyp for 100% coverage

[Rudimenta]

Originally Posted by paal

Awesome looking tank Rudimenta!

Now... just get a 8x24W PandHyp for 100% coverage

Hoping to outdo the previous one (both incarnations). Nah I will move my 8x54 plus 3x145 to the middle of the tank and than put two small fixtures on the sides at a later date, but still considering options. Also going to do SPS dominated instead of mixed. Anyway lets hope my shipment arrives this week, cant even buy the plumbing parts in Vietnam, they have their own unique system with super weird diameters.

[smokinreefer]

Hey, so I've gotten my 2 fixtures unpacked and set up...
Finally figured out how to get them both set up with the PC and I've got a couple issues...

1. One of the fixtures has some damage to the corner and also the 1st pair of t5s don't seem to turn off at all.
It's run on the acclimation program and the innermost pair of t5s remain on 24hrs.

2. Need some suggestions on bulb configuration...
At the moment I have
Blue
Blue
Pink
Actinic
LED
Actinic
Pink
Blue
Blue

After acclimation schedule I am planning on running the Bali program.

Thanks!

Sent from my SM-G955W using Tapatalk

[paal]

Originally Posted by smokinreefer

... the 1st pair of t5s don't seem to turn off at all...

When I received my lamp two years ago I had what appears to be the same issue: One of the T5 channels would not turn off. The three other channels were OK.

I could hear the relay engaging/disengaging, but the two T5s remained lit regardless.

I contacted PacSun by eMail. See below:

Originally Posted by Paal to PacSun

Hi again.

Just got home and tested the lamp:
The relay for channel 4 is activating and deactivating. I can both hear it and see it (red light)

Still the lamps are always ON.

Originally Posted by PacSun to Paal

Hello.

Thank You for test. It looks that T5 relay is stuck on closed position. There are two ways to solve this problem - You could open Your lamp, find relay module and slightly hit it by screwdriver for example. This will releaase relay connectors.
If it wont help we will send You new relay module - You could easly replace it by Yourself.
We are very sorry for this situation.

Originally Posted by Paal to PacSun

Hi.

I modded a tiny knife (made the end stump) and poked “relay 4” through the small slanted openings in the side of the fixture. I then went back trying to turn channel #4 on/off multiple times. Nothing happened: Relay went on/off, but the lamp remained constantly lit.
Then I poked the relay some more and this time a bit harder. Then, after just a few cycles of turning the relay on/off, the lamps suddenly shut off.

I am not sure if it was the poking of the relay, or if it was the multiple on/off cycles or a lucky combination of the two... but at least now it works

Also, the new software eliminated the bug. Great work!
And again: I am impressed with the fast service/replies.

Sincerely,
Paal Rune

[PacSun Service]

@smokinreefer: Hello. Did You contacted with our service regarding Your issue with lamp? Did You bought it directly from us or through reseller?
Please send mail at service@pacific-sun.eu - we would help You to solve issue.

Best regards
Pacific Sun Service.

[smokinreefer]

Thanks Paal for the info!

PacSun I will send you an email when I get home.
I purchased direct through you.

About the bulb combo...
I'm only in the acclimation schedule still so not sure what end light will look light when running Bali full on.
So far I'm liking the light color... It's a natural 12k kind of look... Just wondering if having the 2 pink bulbs will be an issue? Spectrum wise?

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