DIY- "Pins" method of gluing acrylic. - Page 10

melev · 03/02/2006, 01:17 PM

I noticed it mentioned Tensol 70 in that PDF on page 28-30. Can you get that one, or only #40?

Paul_MTS · 03/02/2006, 04:00 PM

Whoops, typo!

Yes it's Tensol 70 I can get. It comes with 1 big bottle and 2nd smaller one which is the hardener, if I'ved read the sites correctly.

If thats not right though, someone on the forum kindly offered to ship some Weld-On over to me.

melev · 03/02/2006, 04:03 PM

If this stuff is watery like Weld-On, you'll need needle tip applicator botttles. Get two at least. If it clogs, which it can, hold a match under the needle briefly to unclog it. You can only do this about 5 times before the bottle must be replaced.

Shipping solvents is expensive, because it is explosive and carries and extra price tag. At one point, I thought I could ship small amounts of Weld-on to other hobbyists, but that idea fizzled out when I learned about the extra fee. It was like $20 extra per box, and the product cost less than that!

Paul_MTS · 03/02/2006, 04:08 PM

hehe, yep I'ved read that on your site, although the bottles i found last night suggested that I could just replace the hypodermic needle they take.

so does this stuff sound like the right stuff to you....before I go ordering!?

oh and what guage needle is going to be best?

melev · 03/02/2006, 06:22 PM

I really can't say for sure, so I wouldn't buy the largest amount of this product your first time. Can you not contact some local plastics dealers in your area to ask what they use, even if they don't sell it to the local population? I don't know what size gauge needle to recommend, but it would be very fine. The applicator bottle's hole is so small, I don't have a single thing that will fit the orifice if it clogs, not even a single strand of wire from a group of wires used in hooking up brake lights to a trailer. It is very tiny.

Paul_MTS · 03/02/2006, 06:26 PM

Yer, sorry should of realised.

It seems it only comes in 2 sizes....large or extra large!

So it's going to cost me Ã‚Â£20, but should do the job hopefully, otherwise I can wack it on ebay!

Just bought a mixed pack of hypodermic needles so should have the right size in there somewhere!

Thanks.

Acrylics · 03/02/2006, 09:22 PM

Paul,

I believe the T70 is going to be a 2-part polymeryzable cement similar to Weld-On 40. It is nothing like Weld-On 4 in any way so solvent bonding techniques will not apply.
HTH?
James

Paul_MTS · 03/03/2006, 12:01 PM

Ah!

Reading throught that PDF manual i linked to, they mention Tensol 12 which I'ved also found and this is a single part cement.

Any ideas if this would be more suitable?

Acrylics · 03/03/2006, 05:50 PM

Hi Paul,

They mention that it's okay for filling small gaps so I'm not certain. Is the T12 a water thin cement? If so then it's probably similar to the Weld-On 4. If it thick & syrupy, then it's probably similar to Weld-On 16. Does it mention ingredients? What you are looking for is methylene chloride and/or ethylene dichloride with either acetic acid or trichloroethylene (as a buffer) and *very little* monomer (makes it syrupy). As solvents go, nothing else even comes close to working as well.

HTH,
James

Paul_MTS · 03/03/2006, 06:14 PM

I'ved just e-mailed the company I'll be buying from if it's the right stuff asking them those questions so hopefully I'll have a reply in the next few days.

Paul_MTS · 03/04/2006, 11:34 AM

here's the reply I got from them...

Quote:

Hi Paul

According to the MSD we have it contains

Methyl Methacrylate 30-60%
Dicholromethane 30-60%
2-Phenoxyethanol 1-5%

Apart from that I don't know. I trust this all makes sense to you because
it's double Dutch to me.

It is a relatively thick liquid.

Regards

Sounds like it's similiar to #16 so guess I'll be getting some #4 shipped over!

pappasmurf · 03/30/2006, 04:28 PM

Zephrant-----PM SENT

spykes · 06/05/2006, 10:00 AM

how do you cut such a thin wood wedge?

disbjohn · 06/05/2006, 10:42 AM

Just buy a pack of wood shims at the hardware store. No need to cut your own wedges.

NorthernCF · 06/05/2006, 10:44 AM

I like the plastic? shims. Run the edge on a sander.

artnsx · 07/21/2006, 10:54 PM

Hey, Ive tried looking around local stores for weld on. I can't find it ANYWHERE? Does anybody have any suggestions besides ebay ? Should i start calling hobby shops ?!

melev · 07/21/2006, 11:37 PM

artnsx,

To Reef Central

tapplastics.com sells it. Did you look up "plastics" in the Yellow Pages to find someone that sells acrylic? Typically if they do, they sell Weld-On as well.

NorthernCF · 07/22/2006, 09:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by artnsx
Hey, Ive tried looking around local stores for weld on. I can't find it ANYWHERE? Does anybody have any suggestions besides ebay ? Should i start calling hobby shops ?!

Not all the plastic shops carry it. For your time searching and money driving it may just be worth ordering it. This depends on how much you go through of course.

greenstarman · 07/22/2006, 09:37 AM

Zeph or Acrylics,

When attaching the bottom of a sump, is it easier to put the bottom on a flat surface and then put the 4 side assembly on top of that and use the pins? Or should I put the 4 side assembly on a flat surface and put the bottom piece on top of that then insert my pins? Thanks for any input.

NorthernCF · 07/22/2006, 09:40 AM

Bottom on the bottom, sides on top of that, pins in the center. It helps if the bottom is a bit larger than the foot print of the sides to give a runner for the weldon as it wicks in.

olemos · 08/17/2006, 05:10 PM

what type of cement would you guys recommend, to put together a 96"L x 40"W x 36"H and also,what thickness should the acrylic be?

melev · 08/17/2006, 08:12 PM

I would imagine the acrylic needs to be 1" thick, and you should use Weld-On #40, the two part mixture. That is the one recommended for display tanks.

Zephrant · 08/21/2006, 11:10 PM

Weldon #40 is tough to use- I'd suggest that it is beyond the average person doing their first tank.

It's entirely possible to get a perfect looking joint, that has almost no strength at all to it due to a poor "bite" in to the acrylic.

I'd suggest #4 slowed down with some #5, using the above method. More room for error, and if you mess it up, you can tell.

Zeph

melev · 08/22/2006, 12:18 AM

Thanks Zeph. Where've you been? I never see your posts anymore.

Zephrant · 08/28/2006, 10:40 PM

Busier than I want to be.

My 2.5 year old frag is more fun that I ever thought, so I spend as much time with him as I can.

Other than that, working on new designs and new projects, all on top of my regular job. I check all the old threads regularly, and keep up with some of the heated ones, but I just don't have much time to contribute right now. By the time I get to a thread to post relevant information, some-one else has done it already.

Zeph

03/02/2006, 04:08 PM	#229
Paul_MTS Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Essex- UK Posts: 25	hehe, yep I'ved read that on your site, although the bottles i found last night suggested that I could just replace the hypodermic needle they take. so does this stuff sound like the right stuff to you....before I go ordering!? oh and what guage needle is going to be best? Last edited by Paul_MTS; 03/02/2006 at 04:20 PM.

06/05/2006, 10:00 AM	#238
spykes Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Brooklyn NY Posts: 422	how do you cut such a thin wood wedge? __________________ David - Current Tank Info: 125 long 50 gallon sump 3x icecap 250s.

07/21/2006, 10:54 PM	#241
artnsx Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Linden, NJ Posts: 199	Hey, Ive tried looking around local stores for weld on. I can't find it ANYWHERE? Does anybody have any suggestions besides ebay ? Should i start calling hobby shops ?! __________________ AIM : artnsx Email: artie1112@hotmail.com Current Tank Info: 29 oceanic biocube

08/17/2006, 05:10 PM	#246
olemos Premium Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 1,791	what type of cement would you guys recommend, to put together a 96"L x 40"W x 36"H and also,what thickness should the acrylic be? __________________ ? Current Tank Info: 350 gl

03/02/2006, 01:17 PM	#226
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	I noticed it mentioned Tensol 70 in that PDF on page 28-30. Can you get that one, or only #40?

03/02/2006, 04:00 PM	#227
Paul_MTS Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Essex- UK Posts: 25	Whoops, typo! Yes it's Tensol 70 I can get. It comes with 1 big bottle and 2nd smaller one which is the hardener, if I'ved read the sites correctly. If thats not right though, someone on the forum kindly offered to ship some Weld-On over to me.

03/02/2006, 04:03 PM	#228
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	If this stuff is watery like Weld-On, you'll need needle tip applicator botttles. Get two at least. If it clogs, which it can, hold a match under the needle briefly to unclog it. You can only do this about 5 times before the bottle must be replaced. Shipping solvents is expensive, because it is explosive and carries and extra price tag. At one point, I thought I could ship small amounts of Weld-on to other hobbyists, but that idea fizzled out when I learned about the extra fee. It was like $20 extra per box, and the product cost less than that!

03/02/2006, 06:22 PM	#230
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	I really can't say for sure, so I wouldn't buy the largest amount of this product your first time. Can you not contact some local plastics dealers in your area to ask what they use, even if they don't sell it to the local population? I don't know what size gauge needle to recommend, but it would be very fine. The applicator bottle's hole is so small, I don't have a single thing that will fit the orifice if it clogs, not even a single strand of wire from a group of wires used in hooking up brake lights to a trailer. It is very tiny.

03/02/2006, 06:26 PM	#231
Paul_MTS Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Essex- UK Posts: 25	Yer, sorry should of realised. It seems it only comes in 2 sizes....large or extra large! So it's going to cost me Ã‚Â£20, but should do the job hopefully, otherwise I can wack it on ebay! Just bought a mixed pack of hypodermic needles so should have the right size in there somewhere! Thanks.

03/02/2006, 09:22 PM	#232
Acrylics Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 4,230	Paul, I believe the T70 is going to be a 2-part polymeryzable cement similar to Weld-On 40. It is nothing like Weld-On 4 in any way so solvent bonding techniques will not apply. HTH? James

03/03/2006, 12:01 PM	#233
Paul_MTS Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Essex- UK Posts: 25	Ah! Reading throught that PDF manual i linked to, they mention Tensol 12 which I'ved also found and this is a single part cement. Any ideas if this would be more suitable?

03/03/2006, 05:50 PM	#234
Acrylics Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 4,230	Hi Paul, They mention that it's okay for filling small gaps so I'm not certain. Is the T12 a water thin cement? If so then it's probably similar to the Weld-On 4. If it thick & syrupy, then it's probably similar to Weld-On 16. Does it mention ingredients? What you are looking for is methylene chloride and/or ethylene dichloride with either acetic acid or trichloroethylene (as a buffer) and very little monomer (makes it syrupy). As solvents go, nothing else even comes close to working as well. HTH, James

03/03/2006, 06:14 PM	#235
Paul_MTS Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Essex- UK Posts: 25	I'ved just e-mailed the company I'll be buying from if it's the right stuff asking them those questions so hopefully I'll have a reply in the next few days.

03/30/2006, 04:28 PM	#237
pappasmurf Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: columbus, ohio(westside) Posts: 453	Zephrant-----PM SENT

06/05/2006, 10:42 AM	#239
disbjohn Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Dallas Posts: 119	Just buy a pack of wood shims at the hardware store. No need to cut your own wedges.

06/05/2006, 10:44 AM	#240
NorthernCF Premium Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 652	I like the plastic? shims. Run the edge on a sander.

07/21/2006, 11:37 PM	#242
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	artnsx, *To Reef Central* tapplastics.com sells it. Did you look up "plastics" in the Yellow Pages to find someone that sells acrylic? Typically if they do, they sell Weld-On as well.

07/22/2006, 09:37 AM	#244
greenstarman Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Indiana Posts: 435	Zeph or Acrylics, When attaching the bottom of a sump, is it easier to put the bottom on a flat surface and then put the 4 side assembly on top of that and use the pins? Or should I put the 4 side assembly on a flat surface and put the bottom piece on top of that then insert my pins? Thanks for any input.

07/22/2006, 09:40 AM	#245
NorthernCF Premium Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 652	Bottom on the bottom, sides on top of that, pins in the center. It helps if the bottom is a bit larger than the foot print of the sides to give a runner for the weldon as it wicks in.

08/17/2006, 08:12 PM	#247
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	I would imagine the acrylic needs to be 1" thick, and you should use Weld-On #40, the two part mixture. That is the one recommended for display tanks.

08/21/2006, 11:10 PM	#248
Zephrant Premium Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 3,234	Weldon #40 is tough to use- I'd suggest that it is beyond the average person doing their first tank. It's entirely possible to get a perfect looking joint, that has almost no strength at all to it due to a poor "bite" in to the acrylic. I'd suggest #4 slowed down with some #5, using the above method. More room for error, and if you mess it up, you can tell. Zeph

08/22/2006, 12:18 AM	#249
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	Thanks Zeph. Where've you been? I never see your posts anymore.

08/28/2006, 10:40 PM	#250
Zephrant Premium Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Spokane, WA Posts: 3,234	Busier than I want to be. My 2.5 year old frag is more fun that I ever thought, so I spend as much time with him as I can. Other than that, working on new designs and new projects, all on top of my regular job. I check all the old threads regularly, and keep up with some of the heated ones, but I just don't have much time to contribute right now. By the time I get to a thread to post relevant information, some-one else has done it already. Zeph