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Old 01/02/2013, 07:08 AM   #1
Chihuahua6
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Warning using Ammo Lock dangerously lowers pH

If you're using Ammo Lock in your quarantine tank stop using it right away!!!! I lost most of the fish I was treating and finally found out that The Ammo Lock lowers pH to dangerously low levels. The pH was less than 7.0. I know it was the Ammo Lock because I tested some water and then tested again after adding the product and bingo. I am going to warn as many folks as I can and also write to the manufacturer and companies that carry this peice of garbage product. It killed many of my fish in quarantine before I figured it out!

If you have already used it please test the pH of your water. If it's dangerously low do a water change but acclimate the fish to the new water.

I hope this helps someone not lose their fish. I think it should be a sticky here since this product is a fish killer.


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Old 01/02/2013, 10:12 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chihuahua6 View Post
If you're using Ammo Lock in your quarantine tank stop using it right away!!!! I lost most of the fish I was treating and finally found out that The Ammo Lock lowers pH to dangerously low levels. The pH was less than 7.0. I know it was the Ammo Lock because I tested some water and then tested again after adding the product and bingo. I am going to warn as many folks as I can and also write to the manufacturer and companies that carry this peice of garbage product. It killed many of my fish in quarantine before I figured it out!

If you have already used it please test the pH of your water. If it's dangerously low do a water change but acclimate the fish to the new water.

I hope this helps someone not lose their fish. I think it should be a sticky here since this product is a fish killer.

Easy there turbo. How did you measure this pH? It can also affect your measurement. How did you dose it? How much? I'm not saying you're wrong but let's get all the facts out before we start running people off a product that so many have used without incident.


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Old 01/02/2013, 10:14 AM   #3
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Also what was the salinity of the water you added it to that it dropped the pH so bad in?


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Old 01/02/2013, 11:26 AM   #4
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Easy there turbo.
Are you serious? I don't answer to comments like that. I'm not a kid. Speak like you're talking to an adult and you will get more respect.


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Old 01/02/2013, 12:20 PM   #5
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Are you serious? I don't answer to comments like that. I'm not a kid. Speak like you're talking to an adult and you will get more respect.
Lol. . Little thin skinned are we? It is a figure of speech. Sorry you didn't know how to take it. I just meant to cool off and let's figure out what happened before we go making blanket statements that this or that product will kill your fish.


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Old 01/02/2013, 12:44 PM   #6
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Thin skinned? Hardly at all. I just have a thing about kids blabbing their mouths like I'm one of their peers ; )


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Old 01/02/2013, 12:58 PM   #7
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Very interested in hearing the documented parameters before adding Ammo Lock and after.


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Old 01/02/2013, 01:14 PM   #8
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Yeah someone could use a chill pill.

First off, you shouldnt be using chemicals to fix water parameters. Thats just asking for trouble.


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Old 01/03/2013, 09:02 AM   #9
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Yeah someone could use a chill pill.

First off, you shouldnt be using chemicals to fix water parameters. Thats just asking for trouble.
Wow after 25 years in the hobby I learned something new ; )
If you read my post you would have understood that this was used in quarantine. Have you ever heard of the tank transfer method to eradicate ich? I'm assuming no. Ammonia levels can build rapidly so between transfers an ammonia binding product protects the fish from its harmful effects.

Anyway if anyone uses this product in quarantine beware or don't even take my word for it. If I had a product that was in question the first thing I would do before using it is run my own test.

Do a simple pH test. I did with fresh water and also with saltwater. Test pH. Add product at prescribed dose. Recheck pH. It's not rocket science.


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Old 01/03/2013, 09:07 AM   #10
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Try a water change to control ammonia during treating in a QT. Done.


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Old 01/03/2013, 10:14 AM   #11
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Yes. And when you do it try to use a reliable method to check that pH. Not a color change kit.


Quote:
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I'm just guessing the pH because the test water was yellow instead of a shade of purple. The fish are breathing faster than normal.
So you guess at the pH and notice a symptom with no relation to pH and you blame a product containing aliphatic amine salts and thiosulfate for lowering pH. If you want to claim that a product lowers pH to dangerous levels you need to have more than a guess.


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Old 01/03/2013, 10:15 AM   #12
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Quote:
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Thin skinned? Hardly at all. I just have a thing about kids blabbing their mouths like I'm one of their peers ; )
Amanda, you need to relax.

This -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chihuahua6 View Post
I am going to warn as many folks as I can and also write to the manufacturer and companies that carry this peice of garbage product.
and this -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chihuahua6 View Post
I hope this helps someone not lose their fish. I think it should be a sticky here since this product is a fish killer.
make you seem just a bit out-of-control, especially since others have used this product without issue. So, let's try to figure out EXACTLY what happened in your QT tank and why it hasn't happened to others before we go labeling a product garbage and asking that a post trashing a product be made a sticky.

Kevin


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Old 01/03/2013, 11:17 AM   #13
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Ok you're right regarding me bashing the product. I was very upset after reading the tests and then experimenting and getting the same result. I never had fish die like that in quarantine so I was emotional when I wrote it.

Regarding a kid nick naming me Turbo and telling me to relax however is not tolerable. Joking with your pals is one thing but a woman you don't know who just may be old enough to be your mom is a no no young man ; )


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Old 01/03/2013, 11:17 AM   #14
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Double post


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Old 01/03/2013, 11:31 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chihuahua6 View Post
Ok you're right regarding me bashing the product. I was very upset after reading the tests and then experimenting and getting the same result. I never had fish die like that in quarantine so I was emotional when I wrote it.

Regarding a kid nick naming me Turbo and telling me to relax however is not tolerable. Joking with your pals is one thing but a woman you don't know who just may be old enough to be your mom is a no no young man ; )
You are absolutely right your heighness. We will never mistake you for a friendly person again.


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Old 01/03/2013, 11:45 AM   #16
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BTW: It wasn't a nickname. It is a figure of speech. means the same as "cool your jets" It never was personal.

And if you focused less on perceived insolence and more on the fish we might figure out what happened to them and how to fix it. If that was what you were really concerned with.


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Old 01/03/2013, 01:46 PM   #17
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Unfortunately, with the written word it is sometimes hard to discern intent. "Body language" and nuance are lost. To me, the term "turbo" means you're speeding ahead, and that's the way I read both that comment and your original post. Obviously, you didn't read it that way.

Whatever the miscommunications, something happened in your QT tank, and without more information, we can't figure out how to keep it from happening again.

Were you medicating the tank? What size was it? How many fish (and their sizes)? How long had they been in the tank? What is your filtration, and more importantly, what is your water (specifically surface water) movement? Where is your tank located (since in winter months our tanks' Ph tends to drop due to the higher amount of CO2 in indoor air)?

Just a few questions that might shed some light on the problem.

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Old 01/03/2013, 02:03 PM   #18
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Wow... David you are patient.


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Old 01/06/2013, 06:46 PM   #19
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I am having a similar issue in my Quarantine tank at the moment. Added Amquel yesterday and noticed my pH dropped. Have a pH probe on it and I double checked with a Salifert kit. Was down to 7.48 before I started adding buffer. I am running an air stone in it and it had not occured to me that it may be the CO2 in the air bringing the ph down. Have been adding buffer but does not help much. QT tank is in the basement. Could that be the reason? Should I cut off the air? I have a bio-wheel type filter and powerhead in there also.


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Old 02/12/2018, 10:48 PM   #20
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Thanks for the warning guys


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Old 02/13/2018, 02:26 AM   #21
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Not sure why one would even need this product? And why would anyone be using in SW? I thought it was a FW only product, guess I was wrong.

After TTMing several fish(15 to 20 over the course of the years), I have yet to see an ammonia buildup to dangerous levels in 72 hours or less.

If you are seeing a dangerous level buildup, consider larger tanks, smaller specimens, or doing a few extra transfers with each transfer being only 24 or 48 hours.



FWI I read the entire thread, OP sounded like a kid in the OP, and I totally got Bertoni's meaning to "Turbo". People are so touchy these days, age, sex, and/or expertise doesn't always convey very well in written form.


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Old 02/13/2018, 12:31 PM   #22
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FWI I read the entire thread, OP sounded like a kid in the OP, and I totally got Bertoni's meaning to "Turbo". People are so touchy these days, age, sex, and/or expertise doesn't always convey very well in written form.
LOL. It wasn't "these days," it was years ago. how people find these threads to drag back to the top I have no idea...

Kevin


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Old 02/13/2018, 12:44 PM   #23
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So after 22 posts. I still dont know if the product is good or bad.
I have never used it. It might be helpful to know in the future.
It might be helpful to know TTM day used, other meds, fish type and number, concentration, size of tank, why fish were treated?


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Old 02/13/2018, 03:46 PM   #24
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LOL. It wasn't "these days," it was years ago. how people find these threads to drag back to the top I have no idea...

Kevin

Wow no kidding!

I usually look at the the OP date before I post, guess this time I didn't.


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Old 02/13/2018, 04:07 PM   #25
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Ancient post brought back to life, but for whoever thats interested:
I have personally used prime in my qt for years with no ill effect. however I add much less then whats recommend on the bottle and only when its needed.
Just make sure to NEVER use prime or any ammonia reducers with copper!
TTM method is my proffered choice of qt as well and I have been doing it for year but I have to admit that I have had some failures with it when doing it every 3 days (less then 72 hours) swaps so I changed to every 48 hours and it has worked perfectly!
No need to worry about ammonia either.
however TTM doesn't treat for velvet which is becoming just as common as ich.


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