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Old 02/09/2018, 05:49 PM   #276
Wally.B
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NO WAY!!! Can't cannot be brought onto stand.

If I do, then I'll lose access to the Wall on the SUMP ROOM Side. (TOP)
Tank is 24" deep so It will be a tough reach. Prone to damaging tank.

I have to frame the tank with a removable TOP panel (all fitted). [FRONT and RIGHT Side]

Then Tank can go it. And Panels put on.


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Old 02/09/2018, 08:33 PM   #277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally.B View Post
NO WAY!!! Can't cannot be brought onto stand.

If I do, then I'll lose access to the Wall on the SUMP ROOM Side. (TOP)
Tank is 24" deep so It will be a tough reach. Prone to damaging tank.

I have to frame the tank with a removable TOP panel (all fitted). [FRONT and RIGHT Side]

Then Tank can go it. And Panels put on.

That's a good work around, if you didn't add that last part we'd have forced you to break down the wall. Priorities and such.


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Old 02/09/2018, 10:15 PM   #278
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SUMP Room Prepared for Tank (Cut Outs)

Rakie, Not funny. No more demolition work Hate it

Now the TANK can be brought in.



I want to run Possible PLUMBING and/or WIRING over the Front Side of Tank (TO HIDE THINGS [In-Wall, Above Tank] )

If Tank was in, these cuts would be near impossible. Even Hard without it.


Side CUTOUT in Drwall is 23" while TANK is 22" so it can SLIDE IN.




((( I NEED THE TANK in place now since I came up with a BETTER FRAMING IDEA )))


I'll show it later, but the original Plan to Have Tank Flush with Drywall will happen.
(The revelation is the TANK Bottom TRIM is 1", while the Framing is 1/2") ** PERFECT ** You'll see soon.


I just need to find 3 helpers to carry the tank into Basement.



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Old 02/09/2018, 10:25 PM   #279
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Another reason I realized the TANK MUST BE Put on Stand......

-> I need to Level Stand with Tank on it (using Shimmy's with access to all 4 sides of Stand)
-> Have Tank sit on Compression Foam till it Settles (Level)
-> Once Tank is Settled (few hours FULL OF FULL WEIGHT WATER)
-----> Then I can Frame the Bottom
-----> Then the TOP to cover the Front Side EDGE Glass

I'll take pictures of the steps.


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Old 02/10/2018, 07:29 PM   #280
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Final Sump Room SIDE (Improvement) Hose/Wire Grommet boards

I couldn't leave SHARP Steel Stud for Wire and Water Hoses.

Was thinking inserting 2x4 Wood Pieces, but too thick.



So I used Leftover Scraps of the DRI CORE Panelling.



Much safer


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Old 02/11/2018, 10:11 PM   #281
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TANK TIME really soon (ALL ROOM RENO DONE) Including Office Area

Decided to Really finish things off with Wall Work.

Tackled the Office (removing Everything except That un-movable Desk Unit). Painted it with left over paint.

Nice PANORAMA Photo Stitch shows Completed Work (using "Hugin" application)



NOW I'm daydreaming about how to frame the tank. (Dozen of ideas)

Final Flooring will come after Tank since I don't want to damage the Nice WPC Panels.


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Old 02/11/2018, 11:34 PM   #282
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TANK FOUNDATION (Concept) High Density SyroFoam (For Even Weight Distribution)

The Ideal about High Density SyroFoam was given to me by Miracles Aquariums (Derek).

I liked the idea and it will work perfectly for my Stand/Framing idea.

Basically the STAND will be covered by 1/2" SyroFoam (Miracle provided it)



What I show above is how the tank will be placed (on Stand, on Syrofoam).
-> Tank will hang over 1/4" off the Stand (on Front and Right Wall Facing Side)
------> 1/4" will be on Main STAND Frame.
-> This will allow me to install the TANK GLASS planes (FLUSH with Drywall above)


AS SHOW BELOW (the TANK has a 1/2" Trim on the Bottom).
-> The Trim FACE GLASS Trim has been cut away (on Front and Right side of tank)
-> The Trim on Bottom of Tank remains in place



When the tank is placed on the Styrofoam (will compress) and do two things.

-> Fill in the area where the trim is not there (Center of Tank Bottom)
-------> THUS the TANK WEIGHT will be EVENLY Distributed across the whole bottom of tank (NOT AT THE TRIM EDGES only)

-> Tank will also AUTO-LEVEL (with Gravity) to offset any small leveling imperfections of THE STAND
-------> I will fill tank with water (to maximize FOAM compression) THEN Stand Skirt and Framing will be done around tank (perfectly lined up)


AS SHOWN BELOW (Under SyroFoam) the tank will hang over the Main Stand Portion a tiny bit 1/4
(exactly the width of the Skirt Plywood)




The outer Panel (or STAND "Skirt") will not be exposed to minimal Weight/Stress

Hope this makes sense as I have tried to explain.



Last edited by Wally.B; 02/11/2018 at 11:57 PM.
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Old 02/12/2018, 08:43 AM   #283
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Wally, is that the foam Derrek provided in the picture above? Looks like the inexpensive white insulation foam you can get at Home Depot.


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Old 02/12/2018, 10:53 AM   #284
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Quote:
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Wally, is that the foam Derrek provided in the picture above? Looks like the inexpensive white insulation foam you can get at Home Depot.
Yes, I totally agree with you. It is the Styrofoam that Derek provided and I think it may have been a mistake (since delivery driver just gave it too me from his truck).

The cheap foam is inadequate according to me.



Cheap White Foam on left to me is useless (for Long Term and a 100's of LBS).
-------> It does compress so will fill in the Bottom rim.
-------> It crumbles, AND doesn't not spring back.
-------> I think over time will continue to compress (ruining my perfect framing alignment)


The Purple Foam (Kids Play Mat foam) is the one I used for my 55 Gallon Sump foundation
-------> Sump full of water sat on it for 3 years (slight impression)
-------> Doesn't crumble

I tested it (UNDER NEW TANK), and it's not bad. But I'll get something THICKER and BLACK.



Pink CORNING Foam is better than the White Styrofoam (but)
-------> Also Crumbles
-------> Was under my carpet for 10 years, and (flattened to paper thin where we walked a lot)

I NEED TO FIND SOMETHING BETTER.
----> Will Compress
----> Will NOT Crumble
----> Water Resistant


Whatever I use it will compress, and my framing should be designed to be adjusted (downward on TOP), and planned for move of about 1/4" (on Bottom)



Last edited by Wally.B; 02/12/2018 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 02/12/2018, 12:36 PM   #285
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TANK TRIM (Design Concept) Hinged Access Door

Going to home depot to look at Foam Underpads.

Want to pick up trim and came up with this.



I was going to make a small panel door, but a seam would appear in wall (impossible to hide).

This way I make seam (beside tank) far away from tank (so not a visible distraction)

Not sure how I can hide the seam under tank (since trim won't look good there) [Any ideas? Maybe painting thiner trim with wall colored paint will hide Bottom Trim somewhat ]



Last edited by Wally.B; 02/12/2018 at 12:42 PM.
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Old 02/12/2018, 12:53 PM   #286
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Nope. Above idea is almost impossible to hide seams without trim.

The will also be a horizontal seam, and putting trim that way will look awful.

Maybe a dumb idea (at this point).


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Old 02/12/2018, 06:24 PM   #287
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Better (TANK UNDERPADING) Denser & Black Color

This will do better than then White Styrofoam



-> Still Compresses but a bit denser they the Kids Play Stuff.
-> Black/Grey-Edge Color Nicer
-> 4 Square Pack enough for two Layers thick


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Old 02/12/2018, 06:38 PM   #288
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TANK TRIM (Choices) One SMALL Problem

Going to Experiment with some variety of trims (Width and Thickness)



However I just realized I don't know Running Water Height LINE!!! (For Top Trim placement).......Till tank is full and running via External Overflow.


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Old 02/12/2018, 07:45 PM   #289
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Tank UNDERPAD (Perfect STAND FIT)

Hard to believe but the two Joined Pad Fit the Stand PERFECTLY



I can go 1 or 2 Pads thick with the 4 Pack


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Old 02/12/2018, 10:15 PM   #290
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Originally Posted by Rakie View Post
Funny... Just noticed your tank is in the thread on the other forum, came here to say that and poof, it's the topic of the hour!

Anywho. Honestly, your tank can definitely hang with those other tanks. Don't be too modest
Thanks Rakie, TenurePro.

Obviously I didn't win the POTM Contest since a Very Well Deserved Tank did.
Kind of Cool that he crammed in all those coral into a 120Gal Tank.
That gives me hope with my 110G.

But I did Place in Top 10 (10th PLACE to be exact). Was at 9th at one point near the end.
Happy with that.


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Old 02/13/2018, 12:18 AM   #291
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My goodness you are thorough. I'm not entirely sure your foam tests are entirely valid though. The 120 I will be taking possession of shortly has a footprint of 30x48", so that's 1440 sq. in. The tank will weigh around 1400lb full, so that's 1lb per sq. in. of pressure distributed over the foam.

A person walking is putting their weight over a much smaller area. if you figure a persons foot covers ~ a 3x12" area both feet would be around 72 sq. in. that's 2.8 lb per sq. in., almost three times as much pressure as my tank exerts on a foam layer. We walk heel to toe, so that weight will be distributed over a much smaller area as we walk.

I did a search and ca1ore here on RC has used pink foam under hist 250/280 gallon tank and over 10 years got 1/8" compression.

I'm sure that mat you got will work just fine as well though.

There does not seem to be equal agreement among manufacturers over whether foam should be used or not. I plan to use it under my used rimless tank for insurance.


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Old 02/13/2018, 09:51 AM   #292
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Yes FredFish, I did a similar Calculation and the weight per sq/in is minimal. (The Raised Bottom Trim area will compress more, as I experienced with my SUMP and the Kids Matt Foam)
If you have a totally flat Glass Bottom Tank (your point is 100% accurate)

My stand was also built OVERKILL.

The whole reason for this extra caution is my tank is built into wall, and will be lined up near perfect with Drywall, so any minimal shift WILL cause cracks or misalignment with framing over time (even though I plan to do some appropriate Gap spacing).

THIS ALSO includes having a SOLID IN-place tank (no wiggle during maintenance, cleaning glass with Magnet, etc)

I am actually thinking I should only use 1 pad thickness rather than two to minimize shift.

All my tanks have always been on solid wood stands 65GAL and 90GAL and there have been no issues over 10-15years.

There is value to foam underpad which I experienced with my sump. Noise from vibration of pumps.

What was the manufacturer reason for not using foam underpad?




Last edited by Wally.B; 02/13/2018 at 10:06 AM.
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Old 02/13/2018, 10:37 AM   #293
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GLASS Cleaner (FOR NEW TANK) Best Needed (No Scratch)

So with NEW TANK, one of my greatest concerns will be not to SCRATCH the glass.

I need to buy the best (Effective Algae Cleaning, with good Corner/Edge Reach..... but no-scratch safe) there is for a glass cleaner.
(I won't have a sand bed, but particulate, stone particle can accumilate)

I currently have a beaten up 10 year of MAG FLOAT Glass cleaner (with a Razor blade attachment) that I don't trust.

Here are a few choices.


Hammerhead Float Plus


https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/hamme...loat-plus.html



TUNZE Care Magnet


https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/care-...025-tunze.html


FLIPPER MAX


https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/flipp...t-cleaner.html

Anyone have any of these? Opinions?


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Old 02/13/2018, 12:16 PM   #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally.B View Post
Yes FredFish, I did a similar Calculation and the weight per sq/in is minimal. (The Raised Bottom Trim area will compress more, as I experienced with my SUMP and the Kids Matt Foam)
If you have a totally flat Glass Bottom Tank (your point is 100% accurate)
I thought you might have.
...
Quote:
There is value to foam underpad which I experienced with my sump. Noise from vibration of pumps.
Good point. I need to remember that for my sump.
Quote:

What was the manufacturer reason for not using foam underpad?
No good reason that I could see. Some think it evens out the pressure, some think it will cause uneven pressure in the long run (foam degradation??). Maybe some manufacturers feel the end user will mess up the installation of the foam?

There was actually one manufacturer that was recommending to sandwich the foam between two layers of ply.

From the anecdotal evidence here and a few other sites, the foam seems to work as advertised and does not compress overly much. I figure if I put 1/2" foam under the tank and it compresses by 1/8" that will leave most of the foam intact, but will smooth out any little imperfections. My stand is actually good quality tube steel, so I only have to worry about minor imperfections in the plywood layer.


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Old 02/13/2018, 01:01 PM   #295
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I thought you might have.
...... My stand is actually good quality tube steel, so I only have to worry about minor imperfections in the plywood layer.
Here is my 15 year old 65G stand. I now use it for storing boxes.
Probably not as good quality as yours since I just got my from LFS (for cheap).....Miracles the aquarium manufacturer offere me a steel stand for like $600 (that is why I build from wood, MUCH CHEAPER)

It was black painted (when I originally bought it).
But over the years of salt mist, especially with sump underneath, it became this. (The welds are still strong, but I wouldn't trust mine with a heavy tank anymore). Plus looks awful as you can see.



Same thing (corrosion) happened in my Steel Studs behind drywall (in my Sump Room).
When doing my reno, a few of the stud crumbled in my bare hand.

So I would suggest you possibly paint Your STAND a few extra coats of rust protection paint. So it lasts FOREVER.


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Old 02/13/2018, 08:03 PM   #296
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I use a hammerhead with a magic eraser in between it and the glass. I also use a flipper for scraping.


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I'm not saying let's get rid of all the stupid people.* I'm just saying let's remove all the warning labels and let the problem work itself out.

Current Tank Info: 150g DT plumbed to an 80g frag tank and 220g sump in the basement. ~6-MP40s ~ 12 ATI powered t5s ~ Reefbrites and Radions supplementing ~ Custom GEO Skimmer ~ GEO CA Reactor 6x24~ Iwaki 70 Return ~
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Old 02/13/2018, 08:09 PM   #297
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I use a hammerhead with a magic eraser in between it and the glass. I also use a flipper for scraping.
??? Magic Eraser like the Wall Cleaning Pad (with Chemicals) from Mr Clean?
INSIDE TANK???? Is the M.E. Pad full of harsh chemicals?
I checked what it's made of. Not sure if good https://www.wired.com/2015/09/whats-...-magic-eraser/

I kind of like the Tunze, since it has strong plastic blades (zero risk to scratch pads. Low risk of gravel/grit on a pad), high pressure only at ends.
Comes witha steel blade attachment for strong scraping the odd time.

Flipper sounds interesting too.


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Old 02/13/2018, 08:13 PM   #298
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Tunze -- I have a flipper, stuff can bet trapped in there, or in my case, limpets and micro stars... As far as glass goes, low iron (starfire) scratches very easily. Tunze is great. I lost mine somewhere when I "organized" all my fish junk

And yeah, lots of people use the magic eraser in tank with no issues. I thought the same thing, but so far, it's pretty safe..


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Old 02/13/2018, 08:15 PM   #299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally.B View Post
??? Magic Eraser like the Wall Cleaning Pad (with Chemicals) from Mr Clean?
INSIDE TANK???? Is the M.E. Pad full of harsh chemicals?
I checked what it's made of. Not sure if good https://www.wired.com/2015/09/whats-...-magic-eraser/

I kind of like the Tunze, since it has strong plastic blades (zero risk to scratch pads. Low risk of gravel/grit on a pad), high pressure only at ends.
Comes witha steel blade attachment for strong scraping the odd time.

Flipper sounds interesting too.
There are no chemicals it's foam. I and many others have been using them for seemingly ever. They work great.

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I'm not saying let's get rid of all the stupid people.* I'm just saying let's remove all the warning labels and let the problem work itself out.

Current Tank Info: 150g DT plumbed to an 80g frag tank and 220g sump in the basement. ~6-MP40s ~ 12 ATI powered t5s ~ Reefbrites and Radions supplementing ~ Custom GEO Skimmer ~ GEO CA Reactor 6x24~ Iwaki 70 Return ~
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Old 02/13/2018, 08:18 PM   #300
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There are no chemicals it's foam. I and many others have been using them for seemingly ever. They work great.
No it's not just foam. Check the link above.

Also says don't use on Delicate or Glossy materials (but maybe glass isn't delicate)
Weird. Who ever thought of using Mr. Clean Magic Erasers

I'm leaning towards the Tunze.


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