DIY Icecap...its not what you think - Page 11

Slartibartfast · 07/05/2002, 09:42 PM

Just FYI, there is a GE bulb, part number GE40904 that is supposed to by 9325 K. I see some of them for sale online, but I haven't seen any in the store.

Home depot doesn't seem to carry T8s in 36" size, so I am going to have to go to a specialty store.

Does anyone know if you can overdrive a 12" tube for a nano?

mswt5 · 07/05/2002, 11:32 PM

you could probably overdrive any flourescent bulb just as long as its not too much

Slartibartfast · 07/05/2002, 11:35 PM

Right. But I don't know if you can find a 4-way ballast that is designed to run 12" tubes.

The 4-way ballasts seem designed for industrial applications, and I can't image an industrial application that would need a bunch of 12" tubes.

Maybe Santa's workshop....

mswt5 · 07/05/2002, 11:36 PM

wow....i just realized your from round rock....cool....im from around there

mswt5 · 07/05/2002, 11:37 PM

get a 2 way....you dont necessarily have to have a 4 way.....what is the wattage on a 12" bulb?

Slartibartfast · 07/06/2002, 03:52 PM

This is my attempt at documenting the difference in the lights. This is a 3' 30W T-12 actinic bulb. I used "exposure lock" on my camera, so the exposure should be the same between these two shots.

1X overdrive:

4X overdrive:

And here is the PC vs NO:

Appearance-wise, it does seem brighter than my 96 Watt PC from AH-supply (as I would hope it would). The PC is of unknown age, so I am sure that is a factor. Also, I can touch the NO indefinitely but the PC for only a few seconds. Clearly I am losing a lot of watts on the PC to heat.

Slartibartfast

mswt5 · 07/06/2002, 06:07 PM

wow....nifty....what type bulbs are those and what type ballast are you using?

Slartibartfast · 07/06/2002, 06:07 PM

Here is "before"

Here is "after"

This is basically the result of switching from an old PC to a new overdriven NO actinic.

Not a huge difference in the camera, but it is definitely brighter and less yellow to my eye.

mswt5 · 07/06/2002, 06:07 PM

oh sorry....i see

Slartibartfast · 07/06/2002, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mswt5
wow....nifty....what type bulbs are those and what type ballast are you using?

The bulb is a generic actinic from the pet store. Expensive ($14), but I wanted to play around today.

Still, even at pet store prices it is a lot cheaper than $40 for a replacement PC actinic.

The ballast is pretty much the same one everyone is talking about here. Mine is a Magnetek electronic ballast, designed to run 4 lights. I got it at Home Depot for $27, and the box was covered in a huge layer of dust.

mswt15, you are welcome to come by and check it out if you are in the neighborhood. I sent you my email address.

Next, I am planning to swap out the regular PCs, if I can find 3' T8s anywhere that are 6500K. No luck at any of the home supply stores.

mswt5 · 07/06/2002, 06:40 PM

on the original post there was something that said not to use magnetic ballasts becuase they worked different but if your not having any probs i guess they work......my overdriven NOs run about the same brightness as my PC.....how did you get them so bright?....of course my PC is a 6500K but i dont know......how would you be able to tell how many watts your actually putting through a bulb??.....because im using a 4x32 on a 20W bulb but i dont know if im getting as much power as the rest of yall

Slartibartfast · 07/07/2002, 12:16 AM

Whoa!

Magnatek is a brand name. It is an *electronic* ballast. The original guy wasn't wrong -- magnetic ballasts work on an entirely different principle.

I think mine just looks extra bright in comparison to a PC actinic that was essentially worn out. I don't expect it to be a lot brighter than a PC, just to have bulbs that are a lot cheaper.

You can measure power consumption with a multi-meter (be extra careful with house current), or also a "clamp on" meter that measures current just by clamping it on a power cord. (current gives you the power)

mswt5 · 07/07/2002, 11:21 AM

OOPS......haha.....sorry

Slartibartfast · 07/15/2002, 07:18 PM

I am using the GE Magnatek ballast that comes from Home Depot. I've noticed that the power consumption is the same (60 watts or so) whether I use one or both yellow wires. It seems like the ballast is not providing any additional current through the second yellow wire.

Any suggestions?

StirCrazy · 07/15/2002, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Slartibartfast
I am using the GE Magnatek ballast that comes from Home Depot. I've noticed that the power consumption is the same (60 watts or so) whether I use one or both yellow wires. It seems like the ballast is not providing any additional current through the second yellow wire.

Any suggestions?

ya use the right wires

seriously thought the yellows are the return pqth and you have to use both of them.. it is the red and blue wires you want to double up on.

Steve

Slartibartfast · 07/15/2002, 09:10 PM

Either way, it doesn't matter to me.

I tied all the red and blue together. If I use one yellow or two yellow, I get the same wattage, same brightness.

I think this ballast must work differently from the Advance ballast.

ToeCutter · 07/23/2002, 04:46 PM

If anyone has knows 18" T8 parts numbers for the lamps and ballasts, please post them.

I'm planning on using 2 overdriven NO bulbs for my 10 gal nano.

Also, if you have found any suppliers for those parts, it would be great if you could post those also.

TIA

DerrickT · 07/26/2002, 12:52 AM

Advance Transformer Co.
High Frequency Electronic Ballast for (1) or (2) F32T8 Lamps
Model: #VEL2P32SC35I
SKU: #362376

17.49 at www.homedepot.com I thought it was around 35 dollars?

I think yours is around 15watts for 18" bulbs. Plug in two outputs from this ballast so you'll be 4x overdriving your 18".

Krusk · 07/26/2002, 08:40 AM

What is the advantage of over drive the NO e-ballast?

cost advantage over the VHO ballast?

Yes, we will save some $$$ if we over drive instead of getting IceCap ballast?

I'm sure some of you aware of WorkHorse 7 (220 W) e-Ballast for VHO.

If we want to have 2 Overdrive(4x) NO ballast:

we need 2 of (4)F32T8 e-ballasts. They are cost about $29.97 at HomeDepot (Advance manufacture). We are talking about $59.94 for 2 ballasts.

We can also get the WorkHorse 7 e-ballast for about $50 to fire 2 110 watt VHO bulbs.

I don't really see the saving advantage between over drive and the workhorse 7.

If I'm missing something please let me know.

DerrickT · 07/26/2002, 09:31 AM

They are 17 bucks at home depot.

Advance Transformer Co.
High Frequency Electronic Ballast for (3) or (4) F32T8 Lamps
Model: #REL4P32SC35I
SKU: #261255
17.49

Also, you have complete control over single bulbs, turning one on and leaving others off. Second, if one ballast blows, it is 17 dollars. I am not sure if the WH7 can do this, though.

Krusk · 07/26/2002, 11:21 AM

WH 7 do not allow you to control each bulbs on/off.

WH 7 do allowed dimable. I dont think Advance ballast allow you to do so.

And seen most of us or not all of us used timer for the lighting system. Is that mean we need to get additional Timer? yes it's only a few bucks.

I think it make sense if we setting this up for 55 G or smaller tank and only have 2 bulbs. We wanted to create dawn/dusk effect.

It's doesn't make sense if our tank is required 4 or more bulbs.

Again, if I'm missing something please let me know.

DerrickT · 07/26/2002, 11:58 AM

If you've read my post above, you'll see the Advance is 17 dollars.

Second, dimming flourescent cuts its life even shorter; flourescents are not design for that purpose.

Third, we can get these at our local home depots instead of ordering them.

Fourth, the original discussion was using these types of ballast (advance, wh) compare to the icecaps.

Thx

Krusk · 07/26/2002, 01:16 PM

Do you have any expericen on Lamp's life? when are you doing 1x 2x or 4x over drive?

thanks you

DerrickT · 07/26/2002, 02:04 PM

I don't, but the original author of this thread and others say the average life of a 4x F32T8 bulb is 6 months. Replacing them shouldn't be much cost since they are around 5 US dollars? For actinic, it is of course more expensive since they run around 20 dollars. However, running regular actinics at 2x or even normal output should be fine on reefs. It is the intensity of the low kelvin spectrums that seems to matter the most.

But the bottom line to this is it beats the heck out of buying an icecap for people on low budget like I am. Plus you can always upgrade as time goes by. You can always ask the author of this thread for more answers.

GROSSR · 07/29/2002, 06:38 AM

I want to get rid of my ICECAP. What gets me is if one bulb goes they all go.

So now I must scramble to or better yet, send 20 bucks a bulb to replace them say at 9 months.

Here I can get a dawn/dusk effect, if I want, I only spend 5 bucks a bulb for T8 6500k bulbs. And if one bulb goes, the other three ballasts work fine. And in theory I get brighter light.

07/06/2002, 03:52 PM	#256
Slartibartfast Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Round Rock, TX Posts: 204	This is my attempt at documenting the difference in the lights. This is a 3' 30W T-12 actinic bulb. I used "exposure lock" on my camera, so the exposure should be the same between these two shots. 1X overdrive: 4X overdrive: And here is the PC vs NO: Appearance-wise, it does seem brighter than my 96 Watt PC from AH-supply (as I would hope it would). The PC is of unknown age, so I am sure that is a factor. Also, I can touch the NO indefinitely but the PC for only a few seconds. Clearly I am losing a lot of watts on the PC to heat. Slartibartfast Last edited by Slartibartfast; 07/06/2002 at 05:53 PM.

07/26/2002, 08:40 AM	#269
Krusk Moved On Join Date: May 2002 Location: Grand Rapids MI Posts: 350	Over Drive NO What is the advantage of over drive the NO e-ballast? cost advantage over the VHO ballast? Yes, we will save some $$$ if we over drive instead of getting IceCap ballast? I'm sure some of you aware of WorkHorse 7 (220 W) e-Ballast for VHO. If we want to have 2 Overdrive(4x) NO ballast: we need 2 of (4)F32T8 e-ballasts. They are cost about $29.97 at HomeDepot (Advance manufacture). We are talking about $59.94 for 2 ballasts. We can also get the WorkHorse 7 e-ballast for about $50 to fire 2 110 watt VHO bulbs. I don't really see the saving advantage between over drive and the workhorse 7. If I'm missing something please let me know.

07/05/2002, 09:42 PM	#251
Slartibartfast Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Round Rock, TX Posts: 204	Just FYI, there is a GE bulb, part number GE40904 that is supposed to by 9325 K. I see some of them for sale online, but I haven't seen any in the store. Home depot doesn't seem to carry T8s in 36" size, so I am going to have to go to a specialty store. Does anyone know if you can overdrive a 12" tube for a nano?

07/05/2002, 11:32 PM	#252
mswt5 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 312	you could probably overdrive any flourescent bulb just as long as its not too much

07/05/2002, 11:35 PM	#253
Slartibartfast Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Round Rock, TX Posts: 204	Right. But I don't know if you can find a 4-way ballast that is designed to run 12" tubes. The 4-way ballasts seem designed for industrial applications, and I can't image an industrial application that would need a bunch of 12" tubes. Maybe Santa's workshop....

07/05/2002, 11:36 PM	#254
mswt5 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 312	wow....i just realized your from round rock....cool....im from around there

07/05/2002, 11:37 PM	#255
mswt5 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 312	get a 2 way....you dont necessarily have to have a 4 way.....what is the wattage on a 12" bulb?

07/06/2002, 06:07 PM	#257
mswt5 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 312	wow....nifty....what type bulbs are those and what type ballast are you using?

07/06/2002, 06:07 PM	#258
Slartibartfast Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Round Rock, TX Posts: 204	Here is "before" Here is "after" This is basically the result of switching from an old PC to a new overdriven NO actinic. Not a huge difference in the camera, but it is definitely brighter and less yellow to my eye.

07/06/2002, 06:07 PM	#259
mswt5 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 312	oh sorry....i see

07/06/2002, 06:40 PM	#261
mswt5 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 312	on the original post there was something that said not to use magnetic ballasts becuase they worked different but if your not having any probs i guess they work......my overdriven NOs run about the same brightness as my PC.....how did you get them so bright?....of course my PC is a 6500K but i dont know......how would you be able to tell how many watts your actually putting through a bulb??.....because im using a 4x32 on a 20W bulb but i dont know if im getting as much power as the rest of yall

07/07/2002, 12:16 AM	#262
Slartibartfast Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Round Rock, TX Posts: 204	Whoa! Magnatek is a brand name. It is an electronic ballast. The original guy wasn't wrong -- magnetic ballasts work on an entirely different principle. I think mine just looks extra bright in comparison to a PC actinic that was essentially worn out. I don't expect it to be a lot brighter than a PC, just to have bulbs that are a lot cheaper. You can measure power consumption with a multi-meter (be extra careful with house current), or also a "clamp on" meter that measures current just by clamping it on a power cord. (current gives you the power)

07/07/2002, 11:21 AM	#263
mswt5 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 312	OOPS......haha.....sorry

07/15/2002, 07:18 PM	#264
Slartibartfast Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Round Rock, TX Posts: 204	I am using the GE Magnatek ballast that comes from Home Depot. I've noticed that the power consumption is the same (60 watts or so) whether I use one or both yellow wires. It seems like the ballast is not providing any additional current through the second yellow wire. Any suggestions?

07/15/2002, 09:10 PM	#266
Slartibartfast Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Round Rock, TX Posts: 204	Either way, it doesn't matter to me. I tied all the red and blue together. If I use one yellow or two yellow, I get the same wattage, same brightness. I think this ballast must work differently from the Advance ballast.

07/23/2002, 04:46 PM	#267
ToeCutter Reefer Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 228	If anyone has knows 18" T8 parts numbers for the lamps and ballasts, please post them. I'm planning on using 2 overdriven NO bulbs for my 10 gal nano. Also, if you have found any suppliers for those parts, it would be great if you could post those also. TIA

07/26/2002, 12:52 AM	#268
DerrickT Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: South Bay, Bay Area CA Posts: 236	Advance Transformer Co. High Frequency Electronic Ballast for (1) or (2) F32T8 Lamps Model: #VEL2P32SC35I SKU: #362376 17.49 at www.homedepot.com I thought it was around 35 dollars? I think yours is around 15watts for 18" bulbs. Plug in two outputs from this ballast so you'll be 4x overdriving your 18".

07/26/2002, 09:31 AM	#270
DerrickT Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: South Bay, Bay Area CA Posts: 236	They are 17 bucks at home depot. Advance Transformer Co. High Frequency Electronic Ballast for (3) or (4) F32T8 Lamps Model: #REL4P32SC35I SKU: #261255 17.49 Also, you have complete control over single bulbs, turning one on and leaving others off. Second, if one ballast blows, it is 17 dollars. I am not sure if the WH7 can do this, though.

07/26/2002, 11:21 AM	#271
Krusk Moved On Join Date: May 2002 Location: Grand Rapids MI Posts: 350	WH 7 do not allow you to control each bulbs on/off. WH 7 do allowed dimable. I dont think Advance ballast allow you to do so. And seen most of us or not all of us used timer for the lighting system. Is that mean we need to get additional Timer? yes it's only a few bucks. I think it make sense if we setting this up for 55 G or smaller tank and only have 2 bulbs. We wanted to create dawn/dusk effect. It's doesn't make sense if our tank is required 4 or more bulbs. Again, if I'm missing something please let me know.

07/26/2002, 11:58 AM	#272
DerrickT Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: South Bay, Bay Area CA Posts: 236	If you've read my post above, you'll see the Advance is 17 dollars. Second, dimming flourescent cuts its life even shorter; flourescents are not design for that purpose. Third, we can get these at our local home depots instead of ordering them. Fourth, the original discussion was using these types of ballast (advance, wh) compare to the icecaps. Thx

07/26/2002, 01:16 PM	#273
Krusk Moved On Join Date: May 2002 Location: Grand Rapids MI Posts: 350	Do you have any expericen on Lamp's life? when are you doing 1x 2x or 4x over drive? thanks you

07/26/2002, 02:04 PM	#274
DerrickT Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: South Bay, Bay Area CA Posts: 236	I don't, but the original author of this thread and others say the average life of a 4x F32T8 bulb is 6 months. Replacing them shouldn't be much cost since they are around 5 US dollars? For actinic, it is of course more expensive since they run around 20 dollars. However, running regular actinics at 2x or even normal output should be fine on reefs. It is the intensity of the low kelvin spectrums that seems to matter the most. But the bottom line to this is it beats the heck out of buying an icecap for people on low budget like I am. Plus you can always upgrade as time goes by. You can always ask the author of this thread for more answers.

07/29/2002, 06:38 AM	#275
GROSSR Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Aberdeen NJ Posts: 1,853	I want to get rid of my ICECAP. What gets me is if one bulb goes they all go. So now I must scramble to or better yet, send 20 bucks a bulb to replace them say at 9 months. Here I can get a dawn/dusk effect, if I want, I only spend 5 bucks a bulb for T8 6500k bulbs. And if one bulb goes, the other three ballasts work fine. And in theory I get brighter light.