An SPS tank of mysteries.

Skujio · 08/27/2019, 05:30 PM

Back again with the very troubled tank. Following recent threads of mine posted, most of the problems I've observed have been fixed thanks to the communities pointers. However for only a very short time. Stability is the main goal in this system and I work very hard to limit change in the parameters. The only problem I still run into and have been since the beginning is keeping any sps. Every frag I've ever put in can last for a few months down to a couple days. I've never once observed STN or RTN, I see more so a full body base to tip degeneration of tissue where brown algae then takes over the exposed skeleton. The big mystery is what could be causing it, and I'm hoping the hardcore acro magicians here can give me a few pointers on how to stop this once and for all. I really appreciate if you've made it this far in my quick rant, this is definitely the most disappointing thing I've ran into being in the hobby.
Parameters posted below.

Temp- 78 to 79 always
Salinity- 1.025
Alk- 8.6
Cal- 440
Mag- 1320
NO3- 50ppm
Po4- .23
(Both have been elevated and where they should be for periods of time and still saw the same problems)

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

outssider · 08/30/2019, 05:04 PM

well, for now the no3/po4 are high. what were they before ? Any possible metal contact with the water (rust) ?

Skujio · 09/01/2019, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outssider

well, for now the no3/po4 are high. what were they before ? Any possible metal contact with the water (rust) ?

They sat at .03 and 10 for months before the change. Also this was definitely my first thought back when I first saw this happening and found the old magdrive I had was rusted. I removed it and upgraded since that occurance about 7 months ago.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

outssider · 09/02/2019, 05:45 PM

I assume you are keeping your alk somewhat stable !......next thing after rust, I would check is your lighting...what exactly are you using...

Skujio · 09/02/2019, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outssider

I assume you are keeping your alk somewhat stable !......next thing after rust, I would check is your lighting...what exactly are you using...

Alk keeps around 8.2 using Cal Rx, for lighting I'm using 6 bulb ATI fixture with 4x Blue+, 1x Actinic, and 1x Purple+ running at 100% for 6 hours. Ramp up from 3pm to 5pm and ramping down from 9pm to 11pm.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Tek · 09/03/2019, 01:47 PM

N03 and P04 are high and would cause issues with keeping SPS. You mentioned problems when it was in an acceptable range. I actually left a metal thermometer in my sump for a month before realizing it was causing my SPS to die slowly. It’s taken multiple water changes and carbon to clean it up over the last 3 months.
Are you running any filter media? Carbon or GFO? Carbon 24/7 in the past caused me numerous problems with SPS.

Skujio · 09/03/2019, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tek

N03 and P04 are high and would cause issues with keeping SPS. You mentioned problems when it was in an acceptable range. I actually left a metal thermometer in my sump for a month before realizing it was causing my SPS to die slowly. It’s taken multiple water changes and carbon to clean it up over the last 3 months.

Are you running any filter media? Carbon or GFO? Carbon 24/7 in the past caused me numerous problems with SPS.

Only metal probe I have in tank at the moment is the end of an Inkbird. On the topic of media I use carbon periodically and I've gotten the same results with or without its use.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

outssider · 09/03/2019, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skujio

running at 100% for 6 hours. Ramp up from 3pm to 5pm and ramping down from 9pm to 11pm.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

5-9 at 100%=4hrs at 100% + 4hrs of ramping up and down ? total 8hrs ?

I'm running 4 t5's.... 2b+ 1cp+ 1p+ over driven with an IceCap 660 VHO Ballast for 9hrs at 100%. My tank is very bright and I have many sps growing at the surface. I'm thinking it cant hurt if you gave them more light but I doubt if that's your problem.

Skujio · 09/03/2019, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outssider

5-9 at 100%=4hrs at 100% + 4hrs of ramping up and down ? total 8hrs ?

I'm running 4 t5's.... 2b+ 1cp+ 1p+ over driven with an IceCap 660 VHO Ballast for 9hrs at 100%. My tank is very bright and I have many sps growing at the surface. I'm thinking it cant hurt if you gave them more light but I doubt if that's your problem.

I agree, I'm not sure if that would be my main problem but at this point I'm considering anything. Also would pH have any affect? First time texting it today and it seems like its sitting on the low end.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

outssider · 09/03/2019, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skujio

I agree, I'm not sure if that would be my main problem but at this point I'm considering anything. Also would pH have any affect? First time texting it today and it seems like its sitting on the low end.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

ph is a function of the co2 dissolved in the tank water, the more co2 the lower the ph, so in order for this to be the problem, you would need to have a lot of people/pets in a closed up house. I live in a house by myself so co2 is not a problem. When I have checked it …(maybe 5 times in 9 years) it's always about 8 ish… what ph readings are you getting ?

Skujio · 09/03/2019, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outssider

ph is a function of the co2 dissolved in the tank water, the more co2 the lower the ph, so in order for this to be the problem, you would need to have a lot of people/pets in a closed up house. I live in a house by myself so co2 is not a problem. When I have checked it …(maybe 5 times in 9 years) it's always about 8 ish… what ph readings are you getting ?

Sitting around 7.8 ish due to Cal Rx.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

outssider · 09/04/2019, 04:09 PM

7.8 shouldn't be a problem. we're missing something obvious, it shouldn't be that tough. I also have a 10 gal with hang on filter and a small circulation pump. I run diy led. I clean the filter once a year and 100% water change once a year ( and the alk is way off when I do)...sps does ok in there....I do need to dose it daily for alk/cal...and occasionally mag

Skujio · 09/04/2019, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outssider

7.8 shouldn't be a problem. we're missing something obvious, it shouldn't be that tough. I also have a 10 gal with hang on filter and a small circulation pump. I run diy led. I clean the filter once a year and 100% water change once a year ( and the alk is way off when I do)...sps does ok in there....I do need to dose it daily for alk/cal...and occasionally mag

I definitely agree. With what were looking at sps like purple stylo and green slimer shouldn't be dying in a matter of days. There has to be something very wrong at that point.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

outssider · 09/04/2019, 05:37 PM

I've never used a cal rx, I wonder if that's got something to do with it...it souldn't...

Skujio · 09/04/2019, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outssider

I've never used a cal rx, I wonder if that's got something to do with it...it souldn't...

I wouldnt think, other than the lowering of pH.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Daddi0 · 09/04/2019, 06:13 PM

Are you way over-feeding?
- Nitrates too high
- Phosphate too high
Are you sure that you have chlorine/chloramine free water?
Sounds like a chemical issue.
Cheers! Mark

Skujio · 09/04/2019, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daddi0

Are you way over-feeding?
- Nitrates too high
- Phosphate too high
Are you sure that you have chlorine/chloramine free water?
Sounds like a chemical issue.
Cheers! Mark

Feed once a day with the auto feeder and mysis every other day or so. My RO runs with 2 BRS chloramine blocks so very good in that department.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Tek · 09/08/2019, 09:44 AM

There is some sort of contamination. Mine was the metal thermometer. Another guy had issues even though parameters where all within range. He was frustrated and tore the whole tank down to find a rusting screw in the sump.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Skujio · 09/08/2019, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tek

There is some sort of contamination. Mine was the metal thermometer. Another guy had issues even though parameters where all within range. He was frustrated and tore the whole tank down to find a rusting screw in the sump.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Gonna do a good look over to double check all equipment and I'll give an update

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

shih87 · 09/08/2019, 11:07 PM

If coral are dying bottom up, then they might be starving. Good water quality in parameters needs come with rich nutrition in water column. How many fishes you have and how old the tank is? and how you feed your coral? Does your currents and turbulent adequate?

Just my 2 cents...

rickyb · 09/12/2019, 11:42 AM

I haven't been in RC in a while, I'm glad to see people are still contributing to the forum.
As several have said, PO4 & NO3 could be a problem.
How old are the bulbs? How do you test salinity & is it accurate?

Skujio · 09/12/2019, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyb

I haven't been in RC in a while, I'm glad to see people are still contributing to the forum.
As several have said, PO4 & NO3 could be a problem.
How old are the bulbs? How do you test salinity & is it accurate?

Bulbs are about 4 months old. Also using calibrated refracto

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

rickyb · 09/12/2019, 02:02 PM

Have you tested for Copper? Unusual but you never know.

Skujio · 09/12/2019, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rickyb

Have you tested for Copper? Unusual but you never know.

I've actually sent in a few ICP tests over the last few months and none have shown any trace of copper

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

Fig · 09/26/2019, 05:43 PM

Run a Polyfilter and see what color it turns.

08/27/2019, 05:30 PM	#1
Skujio Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 54	An SPS tank of mysteries. Back again with the very troubled tank. Following recent threads of mine posted, most of the problems I've observed have been fixed thanks to the communities pointers. However for only a very short time. Stability is the main goal in this system and I work very hard to limit change in the parameters. The only problem I still run into and have been since the beginning is keeping any sps. Every frag I've ever put in can last for a few months down to a couple days. I've never once observed STN or RTN, I see more so a full body base to tip degeneration of tissue where brown algae then takes over the exposed skeleton. The big mystery is what could be causing it, and I'm hoping the hardcore acro magicians here can give me a few pointers on how to stop this once and for all. I really appreciate if you've made it this far in my quick rant, this is definitely the most disappointing thing I've ran into being in the hobby. Parameters posted below. Temp- 78 to 79 always Salinity- 1.025 Alk- 8.6 Cal- 440 Mag- 1320 NO3- 50ppm Po4- .23 (Both have been elevated and where they should be for periods of time and still saw the same problems) Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk

08/30/2019, 05:04 PM	#2
outssider Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Reseda, Ca. Posts: 1,717	well, for now the no3/po4 are high. what were they before ? Any possible metal contact with the water (rust) ? __________________ Please don't feed the bears because the bears will become dependent on free handouts and forget how to take care of themselves …... Current Tank Info: 75 Gal. Mixed reef mostly sps

09/02/2019, 05:45 PM	#4
outssider Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Reseda, Ca. Posts: 1,717	I assume you are keeping your alk somewhat stable !......next thing after rust, I would check is your lighting...what exactly are you using... __________________ Please don't feed the bears because the bears will become dependent on free handouts and forget how to take care of themselves …... Current Tank Info: 75 Gal. Mixed reef mostly sps

09/04/2019, 04:09 PM	#12
outssider Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Reseda, Ca. Posts: 1,717	7.8 shouldn't be a problem. we're missing something obvious, it shouldn't be that tough. I also have a 10 gal with hang on filter and a small circulation pump. I run diy led. I clean the filter once a year and 100% water change once a year ( and the alk is way off when I do)...sps does ok in there....I do need to dose it daily for alk/cal...and occasionally mag __________________ Please don't feed the bears because the bears will become dependent on free handouts and forget how to take care of themselves …... Current Tank Info: 75 Gal. Mixed reef mostly sps

09/04/2019, 05:37 PM	#14
outssider Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Reseda, Ca. Posts: 1,717	I've never used a cal rx, I wonder if that's got something to do with it...it souldn't... __________________ Please don't feed the bears because the bears will become dependent on free handouts and forget how to take care of themselves …... Current Tank Info: 75 Gal. Mixed reef mostly sps

09/03/2019, 01:47 PM	#6
Tek Mr. Vu Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Yukon, Oklahoma Posts: 1,608	N03 and P04 are high and would cause issues with keeping SPS. You mentioned problems when it was in an acceptable range. I actually left a metal thermometer in my sump for a month before realizing it was causing my SPS to die slowly. It’s taken multiple water changes and carbon to clean it up over the last 3 months. Are you running any filter media? Carbon or GFO? Carbon 24/7 in the past caused me numerous problems with SPS.

09/04/2019, 06:13 PM	#16
Daddi0 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Redwood City Posts: 1,354	Are you way over-feeding? - Nitrates too high - Phosphate too high Are you sure that you have chlorine/chloramine free water? Sounds like a chemical issue. Cheers! Mark __________________ 2x 65g displays with a 30g cryptic refugium and 30g sump - 55g reef 30g Bio-cube reef - I.M. 30g reef - 45g freshwater

09/08/2019, 09:44 AM	#18
Tek Mr. Vu Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Yukon, Oklahoma Posts: 1,608	There is some sort of contamination. Mine was the metal thermometer. Another guy had issues even though parameters where all within range. He was frustrated and tore the whole tank down to find a rusting screw in the sump. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

09/08/2019, 11:07 PM	#20
shih87 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Hsinchu, Taiwan Posts: 1,294	If coral are dying bottom up, then they might be starving. Good water quality in parameters needs come with rich nutrition in water column. How many fishes you have and how old the tank is? and how you feed your coral? Does your currents and turbulent adequate? Just my 2 cents... __________________ Zeovit DTOTQ Q3 2015 RC TOTM April 2016 Reef Hobbyist Magazine Q2 2017 R二R TOTM Oct 2017 Aquaforest ROTM June 2019

09/12/2019, 11:42 AM	#21
rickyb Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Coppell, TX Posts: 1,683	I haven't been in RC in a while, I'm glad to see people are still contributing to the forum. As several have said, PO4 & NO3 could be a problem. How old are the bulbs? How do you test salinity & is it accurate? __________________ Reefaholic #9999889888777444899111558 Current Tank Info: 240G Custom Planet Aquariums

09/12/2019, 02:02 PM	#23
rickyb Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Coppell, TX Posts: 1,683	Have you tested for Copper? Unusual but you never know. __________________ Reefaholic #9999889888777444899111558 Current Tank Info: 240G Custom Planet Aquariums

09/26/2019, 05:43 PM	#25
Fig Registered Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: Iowa Posts: 817	Run a Polyfilter and see what color it turns.