Reef Central Online Community

Home Forum Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences View New Posts View Today's Posts

Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Reefkeeping ...an online magazine for marine aquarists Support our sponsors and mention Reef Central

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > General Interest Forums > Do It Yourself
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

User Tag List

Reply
Thread Tools
Old 10/22/2018, 10:51 AM   #1
HarlequinTusk
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Niagara Falls, NY
Posts: 102
DIY Stand for 210 gal Aqueon

I'm building my first aquarium stand and it's for a relatively big tank (Aqueon 180g or 210g). I know that support is required on the edges and the center bracing. What I don't know is what goes on with the glass in those open areas. Is it important that those areas be left open for the glass to expand downward? Or is it better to support every inch of the bottom if possible? I'd like to build my stand with with lots of support (I tend to over design) and then cover with a layer of 1/2" or 3/4" plywood. I was also thinking about a layer of neoprene between the plywood and the glass bottom tank. I'd hate to go to all that trouble to find out that the glass bottom does better with edge and center bracing support only! NOTE: I'll be drilling the back for synergy 16" shadow overflow (so no pre-drilled holes in the bottom of the tank). Thoughts?


HarlequinTusk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/22/2018, 11:11 AM   #2
mcgyvr
Registered Member
 
mcgyvr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 17,461
The bottom glass is resting up off the ground sitting on the trim in a few places.
You simply make a flat top to the stand and it just sits on that and the trim touches around the perimeter and any cross bracing..
You do not need foam between a trimmed tank either.

I actually make all my stands now without a top and just put bracing under where the trim pieces are so that I can look up from the bottom and see everything under the sand,etc...


__________________
Being blunt and having fun
mcgyvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/23/2018, 11:03 AM   #3
HarlequinTusk
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Niagara Falls, NY
Posts: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcgyvr View Post
The bottom glass is resting up off the ground sitting on the trim in a few places.
You simply make a flat top to the stand and it just sits on that and the trim touches around the perimeter and any cross bracing..
You do not need foam between a trimmed tank either.

I actually make all my stands now without a top and just put bracing under where the trim pieces are so that I can look up from the bottom and see everything under the sand,etc...
The tank trim and bracing is strong, but it's not really that thick. Are you saying that if you had a flat top underneath it the glass wouldn't flex down to touch it...or it might barely touch it....but that's OK?


HarlequinTusk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/23/2018, 11:13 AM   #4
mcgyvr
Registered Member
 
mcgyvr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 17,461
The glass will not flex down to touch a flat top...
That should not be a concern..


__________________
Being blunt and having fun
mcgyvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10/23/2018, 10:51 PM   #5
pco1988
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Annapolis, MD
Posts: 328
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcgyvr View Post
The glass will not flex down to touch a flat top...
That should not be a concern..
100% correct, AGA stands are done the same exact way!


__________________
Philip

There are two types of people in this hobby:
"The ones who have had a tank crash, and the ones that are going to have a tank crash"

Current Tank Info: 11gal Nano Reef
pco1988 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/07/2018, 12:57 PM   #6
HarlequinTusk
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Niagara Falls, NY
Posts: 102
I recently received the following technical response from Aqueon to my question.

"You do not want anything pressing upward on the glass. Only the perimeter of the tank needs to be supported. The glass does need to be able to flex a little."

This is suggesting that there is flex and a plywood supporting surface is NOT desired....at least one that is supporting the trim/bracing at the same height as the glass.

I still can't help to think there could be a solution that implements both. Maybe a full sheet of plywood, then possibly 1/2" high trim pieces that align perfectly with the aquarium trim and bracing. Then possibly 1/4" thick neoprene that would sit in between those 1/2" high trim pieces offering some support to the glass while still allowing it to flex down into those gaps. I'm probably overthinking this, but that's in my nature when it comes to my home projects.


HarlequinTusk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/07/2018, 02:42 PM   #7
mcgyvr
Registered Member
 
mcgyvr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 17,461
You are overthinking this..
Put the damn tank on a sheet of plywood already..
Leave the bottom glass floating/unsupported..Thats what they are designed to do..

The glass will not flex down enough to contact the surface/plane that the trim is sitting on.. That does not happen..


__________________
Being blunt and having fun
mcgyvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/07/2018, 05:02 PM   #8
davocean
Registered Member
 
davocean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 14,644
What the manufacturer is saying is don't do what some people have done and put too thick of foam sheeting that actually pushes on tank bottom, or does not allow it to sit as designed.
Personally I always build w/ a ply subtop for every tank, a trimmed tank just will not touch it, but a ply sub top adds a great deal of strength and rides minor deviations that typically come on a dimensional lumber frame.
Any glass flex is very slight, it will not touch ply bottom


__________________
There's a fine line between owning your tank and your tank owning you!

Current Tank Info: SCA 120g RR Starfire, Tunze silence 1073.02 return, 40g sump w/ fuge, SWC Extreme 160 cone skimmer,Geismann reflexx 4xT5, 2x Panorama Pro LED strips, Vortech MP40QD
davocean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/07/2018, 07:14 PM   #9
HarlequinTusk
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Niagara Falls, NY
Posts: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by davocean View Post
What the manufacturer is saying is don't do what some people have done and put too thick of foam sheeting that actually pushes on tank bottom, or does not allow it to sit as designed.
Personally I always build w/ a ply subtop for every tank, a trimmed tank just will not touch it, but a ply sub top adds a great deal of strength and rides minor deviations that typically come on a dimensional lumber frame.
Any glass flex is very slight, it will not touch ply bottom
In the interest of accuracy, I should have posted my question along with the response from the manufacturer.

Question:
I'll be purchasing either a 180 gal or 210 gal Aqueon aquarium. I will be building my own stand. I've read that for a glass aquarium, the stand only needs to brace the edges (and the center support for larger tanks). I'd like to put a layer of 3/4" plywood on the top to more fully support the weight of the aquarium. Is this OK to do....or does the glass need to be able to expand downwards into an open area? Any advice would be appreciated.

Answer:
You do not want anything pressing upward on the glass. Only the perimeter of the tank needs to be supported. The glass does need to be able to flex a little.

So technically, the response is stating (or at least implying) not to use plywood as that's what I stated I wanted to do. Not trying to be argumentative here. It's very possible that the guy that responded doesn't know what he's talking about. If multiple people here have put the tank directly on plywood and not had a problem, then I'm guessing it's safe.


HarlequinTusk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/07/2018, 07:42 PM   #10
davocean
Registered Member
 
davocean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 14,644
While the tank itself does not need bottom support like a rimless or non trimmed tank, that does not mean a ply top will harm it, and in adding a ply top it usually makes the stand itself stronger.

Years ago we saw debates over the foam padding(still a little today but more so back when)
I guess there were cases of people using foam padding thicker than the air gap space that will be under your tank bottom.
Thicker padding than that space can cause reverse pressure which conflicts w/ the design.
So this rep may not have understood or answered your question properly.
If you add a ply top and it covers the entire perimeter, so trim sits on top of that, your bottom panel will still remain suspended, it's like a 1/2" space or so, if that bottom panel flexed more than 1/8" or even a 1/16" I'd be surprised, so in other words far from touching or being an issue.


__________________
There's a fine line between owning your tank and your tank owning you!

Current Tank Info: SCA 120g RR Starfire, Tunze silence 1073.02 return, 40g sump w/ fuge, SWC Extreme 160 cone skimmer,Geismann reflexx 4xT5, 2x Panorama Pro LED strips, Vortech MP40QD
davocean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/07/2018, 08:11 PM   #11
mcgyvr
Registered Member
 
mcgyvr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 17,461
You are misinterpreting the manufacturers response.
Nothing about that says to not use plywood.

Its implyimg to not have the bottom glass sitting directly on anything.. Plain and simple..
So do not cut plywood or any other material that fits up into the recessed pocket where the bottom glass is not supported by any trim.

Maybe you think the bottom of a trimmed aquarium is completely flat..Its not. The bottom glass is like a half inch higher than the trim around it so the only thing touching if you put the entire tank on a flat plane is the trim..The bottom glass is NOT touching that flat plane at all


__________________
Being blunt and having fun
mcgyvr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/08/2018, 10:26 PM   #12
NCreefwannabe
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 955
Whether it sits on flat plywood or it sits on concrete or it sits on steel or it sits on just 2x4s on the edge, doesnt matter.

They are saying dont out something between the glass and the TOP of your stand, aka dont fill the trim void area....

As its been said before, just out a plywood top on the stand. Stop overthinking it


NCreefwannabe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/09/2018, 12:25 AM   #13
Tripod1404
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,760
Manufacturer is saying dont put anything under the tank high enough to touch the glass. You can put the tank on any flat surface. I would be surprised if glass flexed more than 2- 3 milliliters. Glass will not flex enough to touch the bottom of a flat surface. If it were to flex that much, it would crack.


Tripod1404 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/09/2018, 09:49 AM   #14
HarlequinTusk
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Niagara Falls, NY
Posts: 102
I'm convinced. And for further confirmation, I had sent a followup question to Aqueon that also confirms what people are saying here.

Clarification Request:
I've been discussing this topic on a reefcentral.com forum thread. I was interpreting the Aqueon response to say that you should NOT put plywood under the tank. People on the forum are saying that you can (and probably should) put plywood under the tank. They are stating that glass will not flex enough to overcome the thickness of the framing...and therefore will NOT touch the plywood even when full of water. They are stating that the concern comes from people that have put things like thick neoprene on top of the plywood that can push up on the glass.


Clarification Response:
If you are setting the tank on a plywood flat-top where the tankís trim will set down on the ply wood, that is fine. You just donít want the plywood inset and pressing upwards on the glass.


HarlequinTusk is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:34 PM.


TapaTalk Enabled

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2018 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright ©1999-2014
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.