Do I need an APEX?

allendehl · 08/25/2017, 07:23 AM

Hi there,

I am still gathering all the info and equipment I'll need to setup my first tank ever. Stuff is starting to show up at home!! Very excited.

Until now, I didn't have an APEX in my plans. To be honest I am not even clear of what its function is. By reading and looking it up online I see it is a device that allows to control power to several things in the tank. Is this a must have from the beginning or is a "make your life easier" kind of investment? If the latter...how much easier?

My setup so far is:

- Reefer 350 with 2X Hydra26
- Reef Octopus Classic 152-s Skimmer
- Sicce Syncra 3.0 return pump
- 2X Jebao PP8 powerheads

Thank you as usual!

hubtech · 08/25/2017, 07:33 AM

Need? No.... But from what I understand once configured they make reef life easier.

mcgyvr · 08/25/2017, 08:12 AM

You absolutely do not need a reef controller to run a tank.. (APEX is only one brand.. there are others too)
Its functionality is very clear..

vhuang168 · 08/25/2017, 08:22 AM

No you do not NEED a controller. Especially if this is your 1st tank. You will need to make decisions setting it up that you have no experience to base on. It will complicate what has already a very steep learning curve.

Keep it simple for now and slowly add pieces as your tank evolves.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ryeguyy84 · 08/25/2017, 09:56 AM

you don't need one but I certainly like mine. it depends what your plan is. I justified the cost of mine (I have a JR. so the cheaper one) by looking at what it does and seeing the cost of the apex Vs. separate units. For example:

I needed an Auto top off because i know i'm to lazy to top off everyday so I looked at the JBJ which was close to $100 but couldn't send me a text when the reserve was empty so plus for Apex.

then I thought about a heater controller which was about $50 and the apex can do that.

you could definitely not have one and it is a "Nice to have" but get the tank setup and see what you need.

LuizW13 · 08/25/2017, 10:23 AM

Well, if you decide to buy an Apex, you may want to do it within the next couple of days. BRS has a sale on them right now- i'm also in the same boat as you.

Optionman · 08/25/2017, 10:38 AM

i added an apex to my 150 gal (+25 gal sump) after 3 months. it's nice to be able to monitor salinity/orp/ph/temp, and control all power outlets, via the iphone app.

the best feature for me is the ability to control and monitor my Ca reactor and CO2 regulator via a ph probe in the reactor.

since you dont have one i've posted some pictures below of what the app can display:

allendehl · 08/25/2017, 11:15 AM

Oh wow...thanks a lot for the explanations and pictures. I believe I'll pass for now because of all the other expenses of a full setup but this is definitely something to have in the shopping list.

Thank you!

Ron Reefman · 08/25/2017, 12:21 PM

Probably a good call. Besides, pH isn't an issue, salinity hardly ever changes unless you add water and temperature should be an easy read with a cheap thermometer. How can that justify spending hundreds of dollars?

vhuang168 · 08/25/2017, 12:47 PM

Now you have even more incentive to get an Apex. They just announced the Trident!

Not only does it monitor Alk, it does Ca and Mg too!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Optionman · 08/25/2017, 01:09 PM

ron, i agree i wouldnt recommend an apex just to monitor basic parameters, but its ability to notify you of problems such as power failures, pump failures, as well as regulate ATO, wave makers, reactors, etc is worth it once your setup gets extensive.

my apex has notified me of problems with my CA reactor that i wouldnt have known if not for the app. i have enough invested in my set-up to view the apex as both operationally beneficial and insurance (piece of mind).

Etoimos · 08/25/2017, 01:10 PM

I setup my first reef aquarium 4 months ago (last one I had was freshwater back in the mid 90s), it is a 60g cube. One of the most haves on my list was a controller of some type. I did not find that it added complexity to my first tank, just the opposite actually. In the beginning I was concerned about all the water parameters and having the Apex let me check those at a glance and move on to other more important and complicated things.

They are by no means a necessity, but I feel they make reefing a manageable hobby for people with a busy family life. I do feel that the basic parameters that it monitors are not as crucial as the tank matures, but the outlet control (heaters, lights, reactors, etc.) is the real power and convenience to it.

hkgar · 08/25/2017, 02:01 PM

I have one and wouldn't go without it. Necessary, of course not, but very helpful

That said, I think the decision to not get one right away is the right decision. You will get to know your tank and its little quirks and when yu do go to a controller you will have more confidence in what, AND WHY, you are doing certain things.

Not sure that makes any sense.

allendehl · 08/25/2017, 02:31 PM

Thank you very much for all the input folks!! It is clear that it is not needed and, Gary, I agree with you. It is better to go old school for a while so things make sense later instead of just reacting to the controller and w/o knowing the "why" of the things.

allendehl · 08/25/2017, 02:33 PM

Tried to "Edit" but could not find the way.

Just to clarify , when I said "not needed" didn't mean to say "useless" at all, just that is not a requirement to start.

xCry0x · 08/25/2017, 02:45 PM

The Trident looks awesome -- too bad it probably will cost an arm and a leg.

I have managed for years without a name brand controller.

That said, I built a DIY temperature controller and have my lights all on digital timers.

The one thing I would love automated is my alk/ca monitoring & corresponding dosing to keep them balanced. Even with a doser I have always found alk/ca to be a headache -- but that is probably because I bought a used bubble magnus.

vhuang168 · 08/25/2017, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xCry0x

The Trident looks awesome -- too bad it probably will cost an arm and a leg.

Projected price is $500-$600. $40 reagent. 4 tests a day for alk n Ca and 2 a day for Mg.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Jon0807 · 08/26/2017, 12:19 AM

There's such a huge learning curve to saltwater tanks that I would learn the basics before I got controllers to control and monitor everything before I even know what they were supposed to control and monitor. People have been reefing for decades without it and have been very successful. Yes they make life easier, but like I said, learn the basics of chemistry first, then move on from there

PsychoticBeauty · 08/26/2017, 12:51 AM

What's an APEX? If you've got the time to feed your fish once a day couldn't you just cancel this so called APEX out? Do the work in other words...

rrmoore · 08/27/2017, 10:48 AM

I don't regret buying mine. It saved my tank from itself mire then a few times.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

FullBoreReefer · 08/27/2017, 11:05 AM

Best investment I've ever made for my tank. Why? It paid for itself in one shot when I had a catastrophic leak while at work. I was notified, auto programming shut off all pumps(other than my vortechs) until I got home. I replaced a few power supplies that were splashed, but my stand, carpet, subfloor, trim work, drywall, cabinets, etc were all saved because of my apex. I lost maybe 2 gallons versus worst case 100+gals.

Monitoring is great to glance at, but the safety features that you program in can be life savers.

Do you NEED an Apex, No, BUT to each their own...

vhuang168 · 08/27/2017, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PsychoticBeauty

What's an APEX? If you've got the time to feed your fish once a day couldn't you just cancel this so called APEX out? Do the work in other words...

Can you be by the tank 24/7 356 to make sure your tank doesn't spring a leak?

Can you be by the tank 24/7 356 to see if your return pump sucked up a snail or something jamming it? Thus causing there to be very little to no return this causing your tank temp to drop and oxygen circulation to be lowered so your fish as gasping?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

hkgar · 08/27/2017, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vhuang168

Can you be by the tank 24/7 356 to make sure your tank doesn't spring a leak?

Can you be by the tank 24/7 356 to see if your return pump sucked up a snail or something jamming it? Thus causing there to be very little to no return this causing your tank temp to drop and oxygen circulation to be lowered so your fish as gasping?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

If I could do 356 why would I take 9 days off?

FullBoreReefer · 08/27/2017, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hkgar

If I could do 356 why would I take 9 days off?

scooters reef · 08/27/2017, 04:15 PM

Of COURSE you need an Apex!! What else would any of us have done that have been in this hobby for 40 years without one?

Oh. Ummm. Dang, I didn't have one

I will say I love it though!!! It also gives me the ability to combine my IT knowledge from work, electronics from 13 years as a Navy avionics tech, and an aquarium. Still working on my new build, but my wife and friends call it the "Geek Tank". So, yes, for ME it was a must have

Yet, we all survived many, many years without it!!

08/25/2017, 07:23 AM	#1
allendehl Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 692	Do I need an APEX? Hi there, I am still gathering all the info and equipment I'll need to setup my first tank ever. Stuff is starting to show up at home!! Very excited. Until now, I didn't have an APEX in my plans. To be honest I am not even clear of what its function is. By reading and looking it up online I see it is a device that allows to control power to several things in the tank. Is this a must have from the beginning or is a "make your life easier" kind of investment? If the latter...how much easier? My setup so far is: - Reefer 350 with 2X Hydra26 - Reef Octopus Classic 152-s Skimmer - Sicce Syncra 3.0 return pump - 2X Jebao PP8 powerheads Thank you as usual!

08/25/2017, 08:12 AM	#3
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	You absolutely do not need a reef controller to run a tank.. (APEX is only one brand.. there are others too) Its functionality is very clear.. __________________ Who me?

08/25/2017, 08:22 AM	#4
vhuang168 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,136	No you do not NEED a controller. Especially if this is your 1st tank. You will need to make decisions setting it up that you have no experience to base on. It will complicate what has already a very steep learning curve. Keep it simple for now and slowly add pieces as your tank evolves. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Vincent 40g custom AIO --> DSA190Pro

08/25/2017, 09:56 AM	#5
ryeguyy84 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: New Jersey Posts: 2,753	you don't need one but I certainly like mine. it depends what your plan is. I justified the cost of mine (I have a JR. so the cheaper one) by looking at what it does and seeing the cost of the apex Vs. separate units. For example: I needed an Auto top off because i know i'm to lazy to top off everyday so I looked at the JBJ which was close to $100 but couldn't send me a text when the reserve was empty so plus for Apex. then I thought about a heater controller which was about $50 and the apex can do that. you could definitely not have one and it is a "Nice to have" but get the tank setup and see what you need. __________________ Current tank: 90G mixed reef. Current Tank Info: 90 gallon

08/25/2017, 12:21 PM	#9
Ron Reefman Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cape Coral, FL Posts: 10,431	Probably a good call. Besides, pH isn't an issue, salinity hardly ever changes unless you add water and temperature should be an easy read with a cheap thermometer. How can that justify spending hundreds of dollars? __________________ The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson) Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017

08/25/2017, 07:33 AM	#2
hubtech Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2017 Posts: 74	Need? No.... But from what I understand once configured they make reef life easier.

08/25/2017, 10:23 AM	#6
LuizW13 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Under the sea Posts: 309	Well, if you decide to buy an Apex, you may want to do it within the next couple of days. BRS has a sale on them right now- i'm also in the same boat as you.

08/25/2017, 11:15 AM	#8
allendehl Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 692	Oh wow...thanks a lot for the explanations and pictures. I believe I'll pass for now because of all the other expenses of a full setup but this is definitely something to have in the shopping list. Thank you!

08/25/2017, 12:47 PM	#10
vhuang168 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,136	Now you have even more incentive to get an Apex. They just announced the Trident! Not only does it monitor Alk, it does Ca and Mg too! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ Vincent 40g custom AIO --> DSA190Pro

08/25/2017, 01:09 PM	#11
Optionman Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: NJ Posts: 774	ron, i agree i wouldnt recommend an apex just to monitor basic parameters, but its ability to notify you of problems such as power failures, pump failures, as well as regulate ATO, wave makers, reactors, etc is worth it once your setup gets extensive. my apex has notified me of problems with my CA reactor that i wouldnt have known if not for the app. i have enough invested in my set-up to view the apex as both operationally beneficial and insurance (piece of mind).

08/25/2017, 01:10 PM	#12
Etoimos Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 161	I setup my first reef aquarium 4 months ago (last one I had was freshwater back in the mid 90s), it is a 60g cube. One of the most haves on my list was a controller of some type. I did not find that it added complexity to my first tank, just the opposite actually. In the beginning I was concerned about all the water parameters and having the Apex let me check those at a glance and move on to other more important and complicated things. They are by no means a necessity, but I feel they make reefing a manageable hobby for people with a busy family life. I do feel that the basic parameters that it monitors are not as crucial as the tank matures, but the outlet control (heaters, lights, reactors, etc.) is the real power and convenience to it.

08/25/2017, 02:01 PM	#13
hkgar Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Dewitt MI Posts: 5,051	I have one and wouldn't go without it. Necessary, of course not, but very helpful That said, I think the decision to not get one right away is the right decision. You will get to know your tank and its little quirks and when yu do go to a controller you will have more confidence in what, AND WHY, you are doing certain things. Not sure that makes any sense. __________________ Gary 180 gallon, 40 gallon sump, 3 250 W MH + 4 80W ATI T5's, MTC MVX 36 Skimmer, Apex controller Aquamaxx T-3 CaRx Current Tank Info: A 2 Barred Rabbitfish, Red Head Salon, Yellow/Purple, McMaster Fairy, Possum, 2 Leopard Wrasses, Kole, & Atlantic Blue Tangs, 2 Percula Clown, 3 PJ and 1 Banggai Cardinalfish , Swallowtail, Bellus and Coral Beauty Angels

08/25/2017, 02:31 PM	#14
allendehl Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 692	Thank you very much for all the input folks!! It is clear that it is not needed and, Gary, I agree with you. It is better to go old school for a while so things make sense later instead of just reacting to the controller and w/o knowing the "why" of the things.

08/25/2017, 02:33 PM	#15
allendehl Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 692	Tried to "Edit" but could not find the way. Just to clarify , when I said "not needed" didn't mean to say "useless" at all, just that is not a requirement to start.

08/25/2017, 02:45 PM	#16
xCry0x Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Martinez, CA Posts: 1,116	The Trident looks awesome -- too bad it probably will cost an arm and a leg. I have managed for years without a name brand controller. That said, I built a DIY temperature controller and have my lights all on digital timers. The one thing I would love automated is my alk/ca monitoring & corresponding dosing to keep them balanced. Even with a doser I have always found alk/ca to be a headache -- but that is probably because I bought a used bubble magnus. __________________ Red Sea Max 250

08/26/2017, 12:19 AM	#18
Jon0807 Registered Member Join Date: May 2016 Location: SF Bay Area Posts: 293	There's such a huge learning curve to saltwater tanks that I would learn the basics before I got controllers to control and monitor everything before I even know what they were supposed to control and monitor. People have been reefing for decades without it and have been very successful. Yes they make life easier, but like I said, learn the basics of chemistry first, then move on from there __________________ 40g breeder DT, 40g breeder sump

08/26/2017, 12:51 AM	#19
PsychoticBeauty Registered Member. Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Gotham City Posts: 123	What's an APEX? If you've got the time to feed your fish once a day couldn't you just cancel this so called APEX out? Do the work in other words...

08/27/2017, 10:48 AM	#20
rrmoore Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Windsor, CT Posts: 30	I don't regret buying mine. It saved my tank from itself mire then a few times. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

08/27/2017, 11:05 AM	#21
FullBoreReefer Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Wooster, OH Posts: 1,862	Best investment I've ever made for my tank. Why? It paid for itself in one shot when I had a catastrophic leak while at work. I was notified, auto programming shut off all pumps(other than my vortechs) until I got home. I replaced a few power supplies that were splashed, but my stand, carpet, subfloor, trim work, drywall, cabinets, etc were all saved because of my apex. I lost maybe 2 gallons versus worst case 100+gals. Monitoring is great to glance at, but the safety features that you program in can be life savers. Do you NEED an Apex, No, BUT to each their own... __________________ 60x36x24 mixed reef. 40b sump. Regal 250int Varios. 4xHydra26HDs+t5s. 4xMp40wes. Apex2016.

08/27/2017, 04:15 PM	#25
scooters reef Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Pensacola, FL Posts: 1,124	Of COURSE you need an Apex!! What else would any of us have done that have been in this hobby for 40 years without one? Oh. Ummm. Dang, I didn't have one I will say I love it though!!! It also gives me the ability to combine my IT knowledge from work, electronics from 13 years as a Navy avionics tech, and an aquarium. Still working on my new build, but my wife and friends call it the "Geek Tank". So, yes, for ME it was a must have Yet, we all survived many, many years without it!! __________________ Current Tank: 270G Miracles (84x30x25)