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Unread 07/07/2007, 11:05 PM   #26
Peter Eichler
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Quote:
Originally posted by Springmo
This is a great list.

Along the same lines as the red coris, I was a little surprised to see the dragon wrasse as needing a 200+ gallon tank. Acquired when small, they don't seem to attain the size of large wild specimens even after many years. What about the harlequin tuskfish? They seem like they belong in 200+ gallon tanks.

200+ gallons was originally just a rough estimate and some of the species I was judging on potential size. It's good that people are noticing these two wrasses IMO though. Them along with Panther Groups and Emperor Snappers are the fish that are most often put in inappropriate sized aquariums. They're also the fish most commonly seen as cute little juvenilles. I'll make some notes on those two wrasses to reflect your concerns when I edit the list.

As for the Harlequin Tusk, they reach a max. length of about 1' as far as I know and are probably less deserving of the list than the Red Corisa and Dragon Wrasse (I need to make some notes about the scientific names as well), especially when you consider their demeanor.

I happy that people are having some problems with things on the list rather than things I missed. So far it seems that I was pretty thorough.


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Unread 07/07/2007, 11:12 PM   #27
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I'd appreciate any feedback on the Potter's Angel and the Blue Chromis. The Blue Chromis was once on the list and the Potter's is one I've thought about adding.

My experience with both fish has been that they don't fare well in captivity. I've seen suggestions that Blue Chromis need to be kept in groups, but even under those circumstances I've seen them die regularly and just generally look unhealthy even if they are surviving.

I've never personally kept either fish so I was hesitant on adding them to the list. However, my experience with then at local fish stores is enough to make me consider adding them.


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Unread 07/07/2007, 11:52 PM   #28
Springmo
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Quote:
200+ gallons was originally just a rough estimate and some of the species I was judging on potential size. It's good that people are noticing these two wrasses IMO though. Them along with Panther Groups and Emperor Snappers are the fish that are most often put in inappropriate sized aquariums. They're also the fish most commonly seen as cute little juvenilles. I'll make some notes on those two wrasses to reflect your concerns when I edit the list.

As for the Harlequin Tusk, they reach a max. length of about 1' as far as I know and are probably less deserving of the list than the Red Corisa and Dragon Wrasse (I need to make some notes about the scientific names as well), especially when you consider their demeanor.

I happy that people are having some problems with things on the list rather than things I missed. So far it seems that I was pretty thorough.
Good points. I think it's worth mentioning though that body depth is as important to consider as body length when thinking about bioload and the tusk is a very deep bodied fish.

Quote:
Originally posted by Peter Eichler
I'd appreciate any feedback on the Potter's Angel and the Blue Chromis. The Blue Chromis was once on the list and the Potter's is one I've thought about adding.

My experience with both fish has been that they don't fare well in captivity. I've seen suggestions that Blue Chromis need to be kept in groups, but even under those circumstances I've seen them die regularly and just generally look unhealthy even if they are surviving.

I've never personally kept either fish so I was hesitant on adding them to the list. However, my experience with then at local fish stores is enough to make me consider adding them.
I've some experience with potters and while I don't think they should be put on the Fish to Avoid list, they are definitely a species with special concerns. They are particularly prone to damage from shipment and should be kept only with docile tankmates. I think this fish is worth mentioning because a lot of people seem to want to keep them.



Last edited by Springmo; 07/08/2007 at 12:01 AM.
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Unread 07/07/2007, 11:55 PM   #29
zemuron114
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centropyge multifasciatus do well from marshall islands. i always get them to eat. but the majority do poorly from indo.

most butterflies do well. those that should be completely avoided are the C. mulleri and C. ornatissmus, C. lunulatus, C. lineolatus. Pretty much any that eat coral. lol But most do well as long as they eat other food then coral.

long nose hawkfish do extremely well in captivity, whether they jump or not?

List is very very informative. I think you've covered almost everything! Someone will always have that one fish that is doing well to go against the norm though... But thats that makes the hobby interesting and hopefully we can learn something from that persons experience


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Unread 07/07/2007, 11:58 PM   #30
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Quote:
Just out of curiousity...who DOESN'T have at least one anemone?
I have none.

Peter, I didn't see drangonettes on your list and I think that they should be added along with scooter blennies.

Great job, by the way.

Lisa


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:05 AM   #31
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Are you talking about the standard blue chromis or the blue reef chromis?


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:17 AM   #32
Peter Eichler
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Quote:
Originally posted by sunfish11
I have none.

Peter, I didn't see drangonettes on your list and I think that they should be added along with scooter blennies.

Great job, by the way.

Lisa
"Mandarin Dragonettte (requires large amounts of live food typically which can be provided naturally in 50+ gal. tanks with a good amount of live rock, will only rarely accept prepared foods)"

"Scooter Blenny (see Mandarin Dragonettes)"

The grouping of those two could be a little better and I'll make changes next time I edit to fix it.


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:17 AM   #33
Peter Eichler
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Quote:
Originally posted by HBtank
Are you talking about the standard blue chromis or the blue reef chromis?
I'm speaking of Chromis cyanea.


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:22 AM   #34
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Thanks Peter for great lists!

...thought I asked before, but don't see post. - can I have your permission to post to another reef forum I frequent?

Thanks,

Scott


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:26 AM   #35
Peter Eichler
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Quote:
Originally posted by zemuron114
centropyge multifasciatus do well from marshall islands. i always get them to eat. but the majority do poorly from indo.

most butterflies do well. those that should be completely avoided are the C. mulleri and C. ornatissmus, C. lunulatus, C. lineolatus. Pretty much any that eat coral. lol But most do well as long as they eat other food then coral.

long nose hawkfish do extremely well in captivity, whether they jump or not?

List is very very informative. I think you've covered almost everything! Someone will always have that one fish that is doing well to go against the norm though... But thats that makes the hobby interesting and hopefully we can learn something from that persons experience
Do you have any examples of longterm success stories with the Multibarred Angel? They're one of my favorite fish and some positive news wouldn't be a bad thing.

The Butterflies are certainly incomplete on the list and I took the easy way out on that one a bit, but for beginner to intermediate hobbyists it's a good basic guideline. There are dozens of species that are incompatible for aquariums IMO, and there are some that will do pretty well that I did not mention. That's something I will work on eventually...

I feel Longnose Hawks are labeled pretty well as it stands now. "Longnose Hawkfish (hardy fish but they are notorious jumpers and be careful with ornamental shrimp with all Hawkfish)" doesn't seem to go against what you just said.

Thanks for the feedback.


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:28 AM   #36
Peter Eichler
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Quote:
Originally posted by OmarD
Thanks Peter for great lists!

...thought I asked before, but don't see post. - can I have your permission to post to another reef forum I frequent?

Thanks,

Scott
Answered you question in the version of it that is a sticky. Feel free to post it elsewhere

I made this one tonight and you may also find it useful.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...5#post10293535


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:34 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Peter Eichler
I'm speaking of Chromis cyanea.
I have had mine for over a year. I love it, great fish and doing great.

I do not believe it does well it in groups.

I may have a hyper aggressive individual, but it chased all others to their death. In fact, in all my SW and FW experience, it was the most aggressive attack I have ever seen.

It is also one of the more dominant fish in my tank, far from "peaceful" in my book.

It eats anything I feed and is a very interesting fish. It has some behavoirs that are really cool.




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Unread 07/08/2007, 01:16 AM   #38
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Peter, I think I have made the comment in the past that you rarely say something I don't like.

Great posts, bookmarked them both


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Unread 07/08/2007, 05:52 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally posted by Peter Eichler
[B][SIZE=3]

Centropyge heraldi (almost always caught using drugs)

That sentence sounds really funny if you read it incorrectly!

Great list!!! This will really help a lot of people in this hobby!


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Unread 07/08/2007, 06:49 AM   #40
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Peter Eichler
[B][SIZE=3]

Centropyge heraldi (almost always caught using drugs)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




That sentence sounds really funny if you read it incorrectly!

Dont knock it til you've tried it


Great post Peter


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Unread 07/08/2007, 11:30 AM   #41
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Thanks for the props guys.

HB thanks for the interesting info. I'd appreciate more experienes from people with Potter's and Blue Reef Chromis.


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:37 PM   #42
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I wonder where does the pineapple fish stand? I dont even know if its a warm water fish or not.

http://www.marinecenter.com/fish/pin...pineapplefish/


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Unread 07/08/2007, 12:56 PM   #43
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FWIW, I would suggest adding the yellow-striped clingfish. They're really beautiful little fish and are very tempting, but difficult if not impossible to feed. Most waste away in captivity.

I have sad experience with this fish that I now understand to be typical. Liveaquaria says that they'll take meaty frozen foods, but mine refused to eat anything I offered, including live mysis, tiggerpods, cyclopeeze, and all manner of other frozen foods. I did not have an urchin in with him (ordered one but it didn't make it through shipping) so do not know if it would have made the difference. In any event, not a good fish for beginners.


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Unread 07/08/2007, 01:23 PM   #44
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nice list


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Unread 07/08/2007, 01:24 PM   #45
Peter Eichler
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Quote:
Originally posted by happyface888
I wonder where does the pineapple fish stand? I dont even know if its a warm water fish or not.

http://www.marinecenter.com/fish/pin...pineapplefish/
At one time Pinecone fish were on the list and to be honest I'm not sure why they aren't anymore. In my limited experience they are very poor survivors, most accounts I've heard reflect that. I think Marine Center is portraying a far more optimistic outlook on the chances of survival than I would. Nocturnal planktivores that require live food and a very quite tank with subdued lighting aren't exactly what I'd call "not a particularly dfficiult fish to maintain". They're not impossible, but I'd imagine almost all of them die within their first couple months of aquarium life.


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Unread 07/08/2007, 01:32 PM   #46
Peter Eichler
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Quote:
Originally posted by rssjsb
FWIW, I would suggest adding the yellow-striped clingfish. They're really beautiful little fish and are very tempting, but difficult if not impossible to feed. Most waste away in captivity.

I have sad experience with this fish that I now understand to be typical. Liveaquaria says that they'll take meaty frozen foods, but mine refused to eat anything I offered, including live mysis, tiggerpods, cyclopeeze, and all manner of other frozen foods. I did not have an urchin in with him (ordered one but it didn't make it through shipping) so do not know if it would have made the difference. In any event, not a good fish for beginners.
That's a good suggestion. I don't have any personal experience with them but I have heard of very few success stories and lots of failures. I can't even recall this fish being avilable in the hobby longer than 5 years ago...


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Unread 07/08/2007, 02:56 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally posted by Peter Eichler
At one time Pinecone fish were on the list and to be honest I'm not sure why they aren't anymore. In my limited experience they are very poor survivors, most accounts I've heard reflect that. I think Marine Center is portraying a far more optimistic outlook on the chances of survival than I would. Nocturnal planktivores that require live food and a very quite tank with subdued lighting aren't exactly what I'd call "not a particularly dfficiult fish to maintain". They're not impossible, but I'd imagine almost all of them die within their first couple months of aquarium life.
Marine Center ALWAYS portrays a much more optimistic outlook on almost all species they list...


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Unread 07/08/2007, 03:45 PM   #48
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Hmm I have another anemone to add where do tube anemones stand? I have had mine for 7 years and it seems pretty hardy. But I was told these were cold water species but its doing find it my tank. Hmm what about hog fishes and other hawk fish?


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Unread 07/08/2007, 04:20 PM   #49
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"Centropyge heraldi (almost always caught using drugs)"

are you refering to cyanide collection or something else?

on a side note when i first read that I had a good laugh thinking" fish uses drugs" lol


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Unread 07/08/2007, 05:00 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by UN-Sizzlers
"Centropyge heraldi (almost always caught using drugs)"
Yeah, I think that's just the juveniles.

Edit: Without the emoticon, the joke just didn't make it.



Last edited by rssjsb; 07/08/2007 at 05:06 PM.
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