My journey using Chloroquine Phosphate begins...

[monkiboy]

Originally Posted by GTR

http://fishremedies.com/
Using them for at least 2 years for most medications. 1 kg CP lasts about 9-12 months here.

also confirmed to be china-sourced, though.

[jasonrusso]

Originally Posted by jasonrusso

So that's a non prescription based site. I did see that when I was shopping. How do you feel the quality is? I'm sure it is on the same plane as fishman chemicals.

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I'm using it now. It's working out well for me. The velvet is gone and everyone is active.

I don't know why some people still can't accept the fact that Dr. Fishman himself said it comes from India. I believe he said the company was Ajanta.



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[alprazo]

If you are going to buy the China stuff you might as well go directly to the Source and buy from China. https://m.alibaba.com/trade/search?S...xt=chloroquine.
I personally buy from a vet or Canada initially. I've documented it all in this or earlier threads when first trying to source it.

For a while when CP caught on some of the companies being discussed were calling quinine chloroquine and other bogus info. It was dishonest and I lost trust in them. Also posted somewhere on RC.

[jasonrusso]

Originally Posted by alprazo

If you are going to buy the China stuff you might as well go directly to the Source and buy from China. https://m.alibaba.com/trade/search?S...xt=chloroquine.
I personally buy from a vet or Canada initially. I've documented it all in this or earlier threads when first trying to source it.

For a while when CP caught on some of the companies being discussed were calling quinine chloroquine and other bogus info. It was dishonest and I lost trust in them. Also posted somewhere on RC.

I'd love to get a prescription and get it from a vet. It was near impossible (unless I wanted to pay $400 for a housecall) to get in sue happy Massachusetts.

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[alprazo]

PM me

[Ridem32]

Alprazo is just trying to give everyone good advice. Real CP can't be bought over the internet with out a script.


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[bnumair]

i bought 100 grams from national fish pharmacy.

[ReefTeacher]

Really? How? When I ordered from National Fish Pharmacy they never shipped! luckily they never charged me either. I called the place 5 or 6times; it was always going out tomorrow. Very shady if you ask me.

[jason77777]

Originally Posted by ReefTeacher

Really? How? When I ordered from National Fish Pharmacy they never shipped! luckily they never charged me either. I called the place 5 or 6times; it was always going out tomorrow. Very shady if you ask me.

I got mine in 3 days.

[bnumair]

by the way NFP does not ship it directly. they only take your order online and then send it to a pharmacy in someother state and they ship it to you directly.

Just checked my emails, i placed the order on april 3rd through NFP website. they sent me email with invoice in pdf file. but the email itself came from fishchemical.com out of North Carolina while NFP is located in Florida and they are 2 separate companies and 2 separate websites.

Note: after searching little more i found out both companies are in FL. and yes i got mine within few days.

[jason77777]

Originally Posted by bnumair

by the way NFP does not ship it directly. they only take your order online and then send it to a pharmacy in someother state and they ship it to you directly.

Just checked my emails, i placed the order on april 3rd through NFP website. they sent me email with invoice in pdf file. but the email itself came from fishchemical.com out of North Carolina while NFP is located in Florida and they are 2 separate companies and 2 separate websites.

Note: after searching little more i found out both companies are in FL. and yes i got mine within few days.

NFP and Fishman chemical are the same company. NFP sells small quantities, Fishman chemical sells to aquariums in large quantities.

I ordered 100g from NFP. My CC statement said Fishman. When I called NFP, Dr. Fishman answered.

I've had good luck so far. Please keep us updated, many are very skeptical of Fishman. Maybe if there are more success stories, their reputation will improve and those of us who cannot get a script will gain confidence.

[bnumair]

Originally Posted by jason77777

NFP and Fishman chemical are the same company. NFP sells small quantities, Fishman chemical sells to aquariums in large quantities.

I ordered 100g from NFP. My CC statement said Fishman. When I called NFP, Dr. Fishman answered.

I've had good luck so far. Please keep us updated, many are very skeptical of Fishman. Maybe if there are more success stories, their reputation will improve and those of us who cannot get a script will gain confidence.

i have already successfully used it 1st round of treatment on some fish last month. also shared some with a fellow reefer and he treated his fish with CP and had good success. i have 3 tangs as of yesterday in QT due to start treatment tuesday. so so far 2 treatments have gone 100% satisfactory.

[jerrypam5855]

I said in an earlier post I have been using cp from NFP for quite a while.I have always had good results with it.

[foxt]

I'm in rural upstate NY, and haven't been able to find a vet that will consider giving me a script. I am tempted to either buy directly from NFP, or through the ebay seller that tells me that he gets his CP from NFP.

Please help me understand the risks with the NFP stuff. There are several recent posts from folks who say they are using NFP's CP and are having good results. Is that proof enough that NFP's product is ok for our use? What could go wrong?

I'd rather use the stuff that folks are getting through their vet, but that is not an option for me unless there is another way ...

[jasonrusso]

Originally Posted by foxt

I'm in rural upstate NY, and haven't been able to find a vet that will consider giving me a script. I am tempted to either buy directly from NFP, or through the ebay seller that tells me that he gets his CP from NFP.

Please help me understand the risks with the NFP stuff. There are several recent posts from folks who say they are using NFP's CP and are having good results. Is that proof enough that NFP's product is ok for our use? What could go wrong?

I'd rather use the stuff that folks are getting through their vet, but that is not an option for me unless there is another way ...

I think the risk is that it would not work as well due to the possible lower purity.

I don't think there would be any negative results like killing the fish.

Read the packaging in my previous post. NFP recommends 60mg/g. Previous posts put the effective range between 40-80, but most use 40mg. I used 40-45 mg/g and it worked fine.

Fishman claims that it is at least 98.8% pure.

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[foxt]

Thanks for the reply. Barring any other source, I will give the NFP stuff a try and see what happens.

[jduck]

Originally Posted by bnumair

by the way NFP does not ship it directly. they only take your order online and then send it to a pharmacy in someother state and they ship it to you directly.

Just checked my emails, i placed the order on april 3rd through NFP website. they sent me email with invoice in pdf file. but the email itself came from fishchemical.com out of North Carolina while NFP is located in Florida and they are 2 separate companies and 2 separate websites.

Note: after searching little more i found out both companies are in FL. and yes i got mine within few days.

They are the same. Or at least using same suppliers. Go to the websites and look at addresses.

I've ordered from fishman and gotten a bucket with a NFP label on it.

[jason77777]

Has anyone successfully used CP in quarantine with a wartskin angler? I have one coming next week and I don't know if it is a "sensitive" species.

[jason77777]

Anyone ever used CP with a firefish goby?

[Smokey Stover]

So what about the New Life Spectrum ICK'SHIELD Powder?
It says its active ingredients include N4-(7-chloro-4-quinolinyl)-NI...
WTH is that? Any evidence it works?

[Dmorty217]

Originally Posted by Smokey Stover

So what about the New Life Spectrum ICK'SHIELD Powder?
It says its active ingredients include N4-(7-chloro-4-quinolinyl)-NI...
WTH is that? Any evidence it works?

It seems to be hit or miss with this product. I have used it in the past with success but switched to NFP brand (1000g) because unnoticed sometimes I would get the Ich shield brand and it would not work.

[Dmorty217]

Originally Posted by jason77777

Anyone ever used CP with a firefish goby?

Both fish you named should have no problem with CP

[Dennis30]

Be careful with dosing this. I had 4 fish with a minor case of ich. They were fine except for the scratching in the gills and occasional salt grains. They were in my tank for maybe 2 years with this condition on and off, but were fine, active, happy and ate very well. Eventually I saw more salt grains on my flame hawkfish, and decided I should probably take action so it didn't get any worse, and to improve their quality of life. The other fish seemed more resistant to it, but they did gill scratch occasionally.

I got them out of my display into a 20 gallon, used the same tank water, took two large filter sponges out of my sump that were full of bacteria for biological filtration that were put into a large fluval hang on back filter, same temperature was set as display.

The dosage was 1/8th teaspoon was recommended for every ten gallons to get 40mg/gal level for general quarantine. It said 80mg/gal was recommended for bad cases of ich or velvet for max dosage.

They were fine and active in the quarantine tank for 2 days and even ate despite the environment change. I then dosed two 1/8th teaspoons for the 20 gallons to get the minimum recommended dosage.

I watched them for about 10 to 12 hours they seemed okay. So i figured all was well, the medication was being tolerated well by them, and went to bed.

Then the next day they were all hiding, in retrospect I guess they were in pain and suffering from the medication. I moved the rocks around and the flame hawkfish was listless. I moved him with my hand, and he was disoriented and darted around a few times then hid again. So I figured something was really wrong and put a half poly filter and carbon in the filter right away.

I let it run with that for two hours, and noticed they were all still hiding. Looked for the flame hawkfish by picking up a lava rock i had for them to hide in and under, picked him right up, completely still, no gill movements. Dead.

Looked for the purple dottyback, it definitely got up and moved around, but listless and weak and starting swimming upside down within a few minutes.
Dead an hour later.

Did a 50% water change after that. Only 2 left were tomato clown and a blue yellowtail damselfish that are tough as hell. They seemed to perk up and were upright and were swimming in place instead of hiding so i figured everything was okay. I did notice they would just swim and stay in a single area, but they weren't disoriented or anything.
Dead the next day.

I searched online for chloro-quinine phosphate overdose, and I read about how an overdose in humans kills and is usually fatal and irreversible.

"OVERVIEW
Chloroquine is a potentially fatal poisoning often characterised by a rapid deterioration in an apparently "well" patient. Features of toxicity may develop within 30 minutes, death may occur within 3-4 hours, generally from myocardial depression and arrhythmia. A potentially fatal dose is approximately 50 mg/kg although there is wide variation in the response.

MECHANISM OF TOXIC EFFECTS
The presumed mechanism for the cardiac and neurological effects of chloroquine is blockade of voltage-gated ion channels. The exact type of block(s) has not been determined but the ECG changes in humans and animals suggest Ca++, Na+ and K+ channels may be involved as there is progressive prolongation of PR, QRS and QT intervals. Chloroquine is also a direct vasodilator."

I figure since fish have a heart and liver and kidneys and nerves and blood just like humans I guess they died the same way a human would and once exposed it was too late.

Had I done nothing, they would all still be alive, just irritated and occasional scratching.

In retrospect, I should have tried hyposalinity alone instead for 6 to 8 weeks, although I've read that doesn't eliminate the ich parasite 100%.

So today I feel terrible, because 3 of the 4 fish were wild-caught, ripped from the oceans, probably with cyanide (since i just read an article recently that STILL 70% of wild fish are caught with it...very sad)... then they were flown to the USA, survived the dealers tanks and stress... they survived all that, but they didn't survive me and a single dose of CP. The tomato clown I had was a tank raised one. All that just to be my pets.

Anyhow, be careful, have makeup water ready for a large water change and carbon at the ready b4 any medications. This medication is NOT non toxic and comes with the same death risks as copper IMO. Like the saying goes sometimes the treatment can be worse than the disease.

"the-cure-is-worse-than-the-disease"
Phrase
The medical treatment for an illness produces a worse net result than the illness does (threatens a non-negligible risk of doing so), especially via adverse effects.
(figuratively) The solution or proposed solution to a problem produces a worse net result than the problem does (threatens a non-negligible risk of doing so), especially via unintended consequences.

Thanks for listening, I feel terrible, my flame hawkfish was like a water puppy and would greet me at the top of the large live rock piece in the front and sit on top of it every time I came to the tank, and would eat right from my fingers and let me touch him a little. Was a great fish, very smart and dynamic personality.

At this point, I don't know if I want to continue with the saltwater hobby. My live rock and bubble tip anemone are fine in the display right now, but I'm thinking of selling it off.

A friend told me they are just fish, and to go out and get the same ones and start over, and that we eat fish etc, etc. I mean I do eat salmon and seafood sometimes, but fish caught for food in nets for food die a pretty fast death of suffocation after caught.

But, I've been in the hobby a long time, and I feel like at this point if I do continue on with the hobby I will only buy certified tank raised fish from this point on. Which limits me to clownfish and some of the dottybacks I guess.
But right now, I feel down and sad about it.

Sorry to be a downer about the hobby right now. Thanks for letting me vent here. I just feel mad guilty and I'm a sensitive guy.

Thanks guys, and please start with minimum dose, or even half of that to see if they can survive it first.

[lagatbezan]

unfortunately all medications come with some risk factor and I'm sorry it didn't go well for you
Where did you get your CP from?
Also its best to measure the amount you are using with a digital scale to be sure you are adding the right amount. I try to measure the amount of volume of water I have in the tank as well. I personally usually only add 50-60mg/g at most only if I see visible symptoms. If not, just 40mg/g. Its best to add any medication in small progression and raise it up within a few days. Also I know that certain fish like hippo tangs, Anthias and wrases are extremely sensitive to CP and don't cope well with it. (not sure what your other fish were).
my other guess would be oxygen deprivation if proper water movement or an airstone wasn't added to the qt to help with the gas exchange.
Do't give up, we have all been there! take a short break by keeping the DT empty for a while (76-90 days) and start adding fish again after doing a qt

[ca1ore]

Haven't been on this thread in a while ..... but I seem to recall that CP was a single dose, not a daily dose? I do think with some of these potentially dodgy sources you never really know what you are getting. CP is an accepted med for malaria in humans .....