The Big Controller Comparison Chart.

[RobbyG]

Profilux Price changed and AC jr eq. package and price have been changed.

[laurentm]

I own an ACIIIpro so here's my feedback on that controller:

The ACIIIpro can monitor 8 temperature, 15 pH and 8 ORP probes. The ACIII (non-pro) can do 16, 8 and 8 respectively. It can monitor the state of up to 42 switches. I think the lines 16, 17, 18 and 25 should read: Yes/Yes/15(16), Yes/Yes/8, Yes/Yes/8 and Yes/Yes/42.

The AC has a season table that can be programmed to reflect the photoperiod as well as lunar phases of any place in the world. Is that what you meant by 'Regional Settings'.

For the leak detector, since you can connect a regular water detector (waterbug for example) to an I/O breakout box, it should be Yes/42.

The power bar maximum rating is 15A for the bar itself or 15A for each of the 8 outlets (4 for the DC4) when using a socket expansion box. One socket expansion box per outlet would allow you control up to 120A perpower bar (60A for the DC4).

One thing that is not well captured is the flexibility of the programming language (script) used by the AquaController. With it, the control possibilities are endless. For example, I can simulate the rise of the sun from east to west based on the photoperiod in Hawaii with my VHOs and Metal halides configuration. If the temperature gets too high, I can selectively turn off some heat generating equipment. If the power goes out, I can delay the restart of my equipment and avoid extreme inrush current. Etc, etc, ...

I can be away from my tank, and still monitor and control it via internet. There's a built-in web server that lets me turn on/off devices, display probe values and even graph the datalogs. If I receive an alarm on my phone (SMS via email) I can connect (with my phone) and check the status off my tank. I can remotely correct the problem or make sure it does not get worse by overriding the state of some devices to ManualOn or ManualOff. I can also modify the program remotely.

[RobbyG]

1) Thats covered in the Expansion section for the unit and requires a separate PX1000 dedicated for that purpose. It should be noted that you would have to purchase seven (7x) PX1000's to obtain the numbers you mentioned but like other controllers it is something that can be acheived if you have the money.

2) If it's not listed as a feature on Neptunes page it's not on the Chart. I can tell you that from what I have read, I think that controllers such as the Elos Biotopus only require that you input a Location and the controller does the rest. I have not used one but that is what I believe it does.

3) If Neptune sells a leak detector I will List it. All the third party items that one could buy and Modify to work with any of the controllers on the list is beyond the scope of this Chart and may void your warranty if something goes wrong.

4) Make sure you have the Fire Department outside when you plug in that 120 Amp / 14,000+ Watts of load. I think you need to reread what you saw on the Neptune website

5) Yes it's very flexible and for some people including me that is very appealing, for other people, they might say that the chart does not reflect the difficulty of learning how to program the controller properly, versus other models that are much simpler to use and most times give the same results.

6) Pseudo SMS can be done wih most controllers that have an ethernet hookup and can send emails, I do not list a controller as SMS capable unless it has a true SMS module. The reason is that a real SMS module has the major benefit of not being tied to an ISP to deliver the message, this offers a layer of redundancy and an almost instantaneous delivery of the message, with SMS via email you sometimes see delays in message delivery that in a few cases I have seen can be 30 minutes to an hour, depending on the load and speed of your Cell phone companies internet servers. IMO its not nearly as reliable as true SMS.
With regards to controlling the Tank Via SMS are you saying that the controller receives Emails\text messages and decodes them? That would seem unlikely to me as emails have a lot of header information that could potentialy send your controller into a nose dive. Please clarify

Originally posted by laurentm
I own an ACIIIpro so here's my feedback on that controller:

1) The ACIIIpro can monitor 8 temperature, 15 pH and 8 ORP probes. The ACIII (non-pro) can do 16, 8 and 8 respectively. It can monitor the state of up to 42 switches. I think the lines 16, 17, 18 and 25 should read: Yes/Yes/15(16), Yes/Yes/8, Yes/Yes/8 and Yes/Yes/42.

2) The AC has a season table that can be programmed to reflect the photoperiod as well as lunar phases of any place in the world. Is that what you meant by 'Regional Settings'.

3) For the leak detector, since you can connect a regular water detector (waterbug for example) to an I/O breakout box, it should be Yes/42.

4) The power bar maximum rating is 15A for the bar itself or 15A for each of the 8 outlets (4 for the DC4) when using a socket expansion box. One socket expansion box per outlet would allow you control up to 120A perpower bar (60A for the DC4).

5) One thing that is not well captured is the flexibility of the programming language (script) used by the AquaController. With it, the control possibilities are endless. For example, I can simulate the rise of the sun from east to west based on the photoperiod in Hawaii with my VHOs and Metal halides configuration. If the temperature gets too high, I can selectively turn off some heat generating equipment. If the power goes out, I can delay the restart of my equipment and avoid extreme inrush current. Etc, etc, ...

6) I can be away from my tank, and still monitor and control it via internet. There's a built-in web server that lets me turn on/off devices, display probe values and even graph the datalogs. If I receive an alarm on my phone (SMS via email) I can connect (with my phone) and check the status off my tank. I can remotely correct the problem or make sure it does not get worse by overriding the state of some devices to ManualOn or ManualOff. I can also modify the program remotely.

[laurentm]

1) Thats covered in the Expansion section for the unit and requires a separate PX1000 dedicated for that purpose.

Yes, it is covered in the expansion section but my understanding is that you are listing capabilities of the main unit. The Aquacontroller is capable of handling 8,16,8 probes and to connect those probes, you need PX1000s. Just like the Aquatronica is capable of handling 2,6,6 but you need the power bars to connect the probes. Therefore you should list the ACIII as 8,16,8 if the Aquatronica is 2,6,6. - Does that make sense to you?

2) If it's not listed as a feature on Neptunes page it's not on the Chart. I can tell you that from what I have read, I think that controllers such as the Elos Biotopus only require that you input a Location and the controller does the rest. I have not used one but that is what I believe it does.

Same for the AC, you enter the longitude, latitude and it does the rest. It is covered in the section "Seasonal Temperature Variation" p31 and "Seasonal Lighting Variation" p38 of the ACIIIpro manual (http://neptunesys.com/AquaController3Pro.3_2_web.pdf).

3) If Neptune sells a leak detector I will List it. All the third party items that one could buy and Modify to work with any of the controllers on the list is beyond the scope of this Chart and may void your warranty if something goes wrong.

Same goes for X10 then. If the vendor does not sell the X10 transmitter, it cannot be listed as a feature. Right? There's no modification required do connect a water detector to a Neptune breakout box.

4) Make sure you have the Fire Department outside when you plug in that 120 Amp / 14,000+ Watts of load. I think you need to reread what you saw on the Neptune website

You can use 8 socket expansion boxes on a DC8. Each socket expansion is rated at 15A max with negligible power draw on the DC8. Each power bar can allow you to control up to 120A.

No need to call the Fire Department if you do this right . All you need is the appropriate electrical service (say a 200-amp residential service) from your power company and dedicated lines to the socket expansions.

Not that most Reef setups would require such power consumption, but if we are talking about capabilities, then this information needs to be included.

5) Yes it's very flexible and for some people including me that is very appealing, for other people, they might say that the chart does not reflect the difficulty of learning how to program the controller properly, versus other models that are much simpler to use and most times give the same results.

A feature of a given controller should not be omitted because you think that most users will find it difficult to use. I think it is important to mention the unique programming capabilities of the Neptune Systems controllers.

With regards to controlling the Tank Via SMS are you saying that the controller receives Emails\text messages and decodes them? That would seem unlikely to me as emails have a lot of header information that could potentialy send your controller into a nose dive. Please clarify

To clarify, I meant that the controller can be accessed through its web interface using a mobile phone.

[RobbyG]

I already had this conversation via email with Curt at Neptune so why are you asking the exact same questions again two days later?

I think I answered all the questions in the emails and have given good reasons 6 or 7 times already, if Neptune wishes they can write their own chart and put in whatever numbers they want and leave it at that.

I get the point, you would like to destroy the credibility of the comparison chart if it's not the way you want it, so please go ahead and post what a biased chart you think it is, possibly you can find a few other users to pitch in and help prove your point.

I think I have already changed as many things as you wanted and at this point you will not be satisfied unless every number shows the AC3 Pro as number one in every category.

[laurentm]

Originally posted by RobbyG
I already had this conversation via email with Curt at Neptune so why are you asking the exact same questions again two days later?

I think I answered all the questions in the emails and have given good reasons 6 or 7 times already, if Neptune wishes they can write their own chart and put in whatever numbers they want and leave it at that.

I get the point, you would like to destroy the credibility of the comparison chart if it's not the way you want it, so please go ahead and post what a biased chart you think it is, possibly you can find a few other users to pitch in and help prove your point.

I think I have already changed as many things as you wanted and at this point you will not be satisfied unless every number shows the AC3 Pro as number one in every category.

A quote from your original post:

Originally posted by RobbyG

I almost did not post it because I did not feel the Data was accurate enough, but as time passed I realized that something like this cannot be made accurate without Constructive feedback from actual users.

Chill out. I thought you were actually interested in the feedback from users like me. Sorry if I offended you or your chart.

[Newreeflady]

Hi,

Do any of them monitor Alkalinity by chance?

Also, i'm not sure which line corresponds to Remote Monitoring and Control of the unit (from anywhere in the world.)

thanks,
Angela

[RobbyG]

Hi Angela
None of the units monitor Alkalinity as it refers to DKH. There are many new probes like that under development including Nitrate and Calcium but the technology is still not ready for continual submergence in an Aquarium and it requires daily recalibration, so most companies have opted to wait until better probes come out.


The Line that refers to Remote control is listed as "Web Server Control".

[laurentm]

Seriously RobbyG,

To connect my probes to the Aquatronica controller, I would need to purchase these parts, right?

4x Connection Cables P/N ACQ402
1x Active Hub P/N ACQ215-TL
1x Temp & Level Interface P/N ACQ210-TL
1x pH Interface P/N ACQ210-PH
1x Redox Interface P/N ACQ210-RX

With the Neptune controller, I need a PX1000 to connect more probes if the builtin connectors are already used.

So, why do you make a distinction between the Aquatronica and Neptune probe capabilities since BOTH require expansions to connect them?

[RobbyG]

AS I STATED BEFORE, NEPTUNE SYSTEMS WILL NOT STOP UNTIL THEY HAVE DESTROYED THIS CHART. THERE IS NO ANSWER TO ANY QUESTION THAT I CAN GIVE THEM THAT WILL NOT LEAD TO ANOTHER QUESTION.

THERE MAIN COMPETITOR AT THIS TIME IS AQUATRONICA AND THEY WILL NOT BE SATISFIED UNLESS EVERY SINGLE ITEM ON THE CHART PUTS THEM AHEAD OF AQUATRONICA.

I THINK THEY NEED TO SPEND MORE TIME MAKING A NEW CONTROLLER TO COMPETE WITH MORE MODERN UNITS LIKE THE PROFILUX, ELOS AND AQUATRONICA AND STOP TRYING TO SKEW THE NUMBERS ON A CHART SO THAT THEY ARE ALL IN THEIR FAVOUR.

[jdieck]

laurntm:

I think Robby's impression is that because your questions seem to match questions already rised by Neptune on e-mails (which we have not seen) he is assuming or implying that you are involved/biased toward or by Neptune and as such you might not be an honest user of the controller.

By the way, I am not an Aquacontroller III user so I can't comment on the specifics of that one but seems to me some of the questions you rised might be valid and I fail to see how your coments can or will destroy the credibility of the chart and on the contrary the idea is to enhance it.

IMO I think that if a controller has a feature (marketed or not) it should be included as the user will get it with the controller. If it has a feature that will require additional optional equipment it is already noted as such although not mentioning specifically what the add on is which I think will be great to know but may expand the size of the chart beyond being practical.

[bill9999992]

Great job RobbyG,

Im about to buy a controller and had a few questions. The ACIII and ACIIIPRO have made my short list of 5. The price difference of the 2 is about $300. Do you guys think the price difference is justified by extra features and performance?

Thanks


Bill

[RobbyG]

Most people who are choosing the IIIPro over the III seem to do it based on the ability to have a Salinty probe on the Pro and the better Display that it has. You might want to ask some of the guys on RC's Neptune forum for more info on that.

[invincible569]

Aquastar

[RobbyG]

External display for the IKS, Very Nice.
Keep that by my bedside and I would sleep better at night

[RobbyG]

I will soon be adding two new controllers to the Chart

[Newreeflady]

Hi again,

I'm seriously looking into the AC III (not the pro, it is out of my price range.)

I am needing something that will e-mail me in the case of power failure, and/or can be monitored and modified from anywhere in the world using my laptop and/or any other internet connection. Preferrably this will use wireless, but ethernet is also accpetable.

Is the ACIII the cheapest thing that will do the job? I know, money hasn't come into the chart here, but i'm assuming people know which is why I ask. I am completely opened to other units, but the ACIII is already very expensive so i'm really not looking to spend much more money unless the extra money goes into components that I need.

Thanks for any help!
Angela

[TandN]

Robby great job here and also to everyone that is helping him I wonder if something like this will wind up gettin a company to make a insane controller that has all the bells and whistles

[jdieck]

Originally posted by tanya72806
Robby great job here and also to everyone that is helping him I wonder if something like this will wind up gettin a company to make a insane controller that has all the bells and whistles

Well it will make them better competitors

[RobbyG]

I have included basic package prices in the chart. Just look at the prices near the bottom. The chart is sorted into alphabetized price categories. Just make sure the unit you pick is listed as web server capable.

Originally posted by Newreeflady
Hi again,

I'm seriously looking into the AC III (not the pro, it is out of my price range.)

I am needing something that will e-mail me in the case of power failure, and/or can be monitored and modified from anywhere in the world using my laptop and/or any other internet connection. Preferrably this will use wireless, but ethernet is also accpetable.

Is the ACIII the cheapest thing that will do the job? I know, money hasn't come into the chart here, but i'm assuming people know which is why I ask. I am completely opened to other units, but the ACIII is already very expensive so i'm really not looking to spend much more money unless the extra money goes into components that I need.

Thanks for any help!
Angela

[RobbyG]

Originally posted by jdieck
Well it will make them better competitors

And better competitors are bound to make better and cheaper controllers, a win win situation for us

[TandN]

I have a lighthouse and LOVE it i still havent gotten it online yet but once I do im sure ill love it even more

[RobbyG]

Hi Tanya
I am having massive problems with RC tonight. Seems like all the bandwidth is used up, or maybe something is wrong with my ISP.

Thank you for the compliment, it is really good to know that the chart is making peoples ability to compare and choose a little easier. I am sure that when you get that Lighthouse connected to the net you will really love it, the webpage capabilities of that controller are very good. Please let us know what you think of it when you have it setup.

[TandN]

I will

[JG24]

Great Job RobbyG.

I was wondering if you looked at this controller?
http://www.biomatixsystems.com/index.htm

I didn't see it mentioned anywhere. Or, maybe it was one that did not want to participate. I don't currently own one, but they do look interesting. They had a pretty nice display at MACNA last Sept.

They are also based in Texas.

Thanks