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Unread 07/31/2007, 07:31 PM   #426
melev
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Definitely contact AO. They made offer you an equitable solution, such as repairing it for a fee.

Perhaps that silicone was bad, and AO did everything right.

I think I'd fix the tank myself if it was me and the company couldn't help me.


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Unread 08/01/2007, 07:58 AM   #427
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Is this making me think about my tank. 500g, all that water on the floor.


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Unread 08/01/2007, 08:31 AM   #428
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after seeing the pictures i would say it is the fault of aquarium obssessed. alot of tank that i have see custom built have the braces in the corner cross each other to give the corners better support. it may not look as nice but the seams never pull apart like that. the only other thing i can think of is the guys that put the tank together didnt clean the edges with acitone before they siliconed it together. dirt and oil form your hands can make for a poor bonding surface. the silicone will stick for a while but its not the greatest bond. if aquarium obsessed does not go good for this that you need to spread the word about there warrantee. that is a bunch of poo poo. 1 year on an aquarium is not the standard in this industry. oceaniac and all glass have life time warrantees. they should at least have a 5 year warrantee.
in my mind if they only warrantee there aquariums for 1 year then they make below standard aquariums and people should be informed about this. im sure you paid them a lot of money for there product. now they should back up thet product.
good luck with this. in the end im sure you will redo the tank and it will be alot better. i have helped in the cutting apart of a starfire tank and resiliconeing it. if you need any pointers let me know.


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Unread 08/01/2007, 11:09 AM   #429
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It might be the fault of the manufacturer, but it could easily be related to something else, like a deflecting or unleveled stand or floor. Until Shawn finds out for sure, I don't think it's a good idea to blame AO in this public forum.


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Unread 08/01/2007, 11:22 AM   #430
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Quote:
Originally posted by cward
Until Shawn finds out for sure, I don't think it's a good idea to blame AO in this public forum.
Agreed. There is a long, long list of possible factors or combination of factors that may have caused this. We could speculate all day long....


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Unread 08/01/2007, 11:52 AM   #431
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Quote:
Originally posted by tomasz
Is this making me think about my tank. 500g, all that water on the floor.
i think all of us thought the same thing


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Unread 08/01/2007, 11:59 AM   #432
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Any updates? I'm sure we're the last people on your mind but I know I wasn't the only one with a huge pit in my stomach (and who checked their silicone well last night!)

Well, there still is the question of why a company would only warrantee a tank for one year. We're talking serious home damage, fire damage, even electrocution ... seriously. A pool of water and ballast should never meet. And of course livestock, time, cost ... Or should the 12 month warrantee be a subtle hint? I've seen LIFETIME warrantees from other builders.

IMO if it was an uneven stand or something like that its one thing. But if it were bad silicone, that falls back on the builder. And I don't buy the stress from moving bit either. Every tank gets moved to some extent and it would always be my word against theirs with this line of thinking. Tanks are hoisted, rolled, tilted ... all the time. I'm no tank builder but how can the silicone not be strong enough to handle a tank ... moving. Water pressure has to be stronger than that - I'd think glass would break before silicone gave. By that thinking, no builder would EVER be liable for a tank failing. "Its the movers fault". I'm sure Arnar's monster Deltec tank would already be out of warrantee before water was even put in.

I'm not blaming anyone, just amazed at standing behind such an important piece of equipment for only 12 months. It still could be a bad stand, bad floor, who knows. But the other reasons just seem like excuses to me.


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Unread 08/01/2007, 12:29 PM   #433
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I agree that a 1 year warranty is weak.


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Unread 08/01/2007, 12:32 PM   #434
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didn't ao mess up on sanjay's big tank also?


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Unread 08/01/2007, 12:47 PM   #435
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I think the AGE warranty is only 1 year also. Unless you buy their stand, then its 5 year....


I think.


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Unread 08/01/2007, 01:32 PM   #436
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Quote:
Originally posted by tomasz
Is this making me think about my tank. 500g, all that water on the floor.
I know what you mean I just order a 300 from Glass Cages. I went with low iron for the 2 viewable sides.. Glass Cages does use that black steel trim around the corners.

Hopefully they work something out with you.


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Unread 08/02/2007, 12:34 AM   #437
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It isn't just AO either, all manufacturers have their problems. They put out lots of tanks. They can't all be perfect. IMO it's how they take care of the ones that aren't that counts the most. We will see how LeeMar takes care of theirs. I know how they've taken care of it for the last 2 years!



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Unread 08/02/2007, 07:01 AM   #438
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Well obviously this is very bad news. We are always very sorry for anyone's loss. Very hard to say what has caused the problem in this case but the bottom line is we need to get this fixed asap.

Shawn please give us a call and we will figure out a way to help you.

(705) 719-9111

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Unread 08/02/2007, 09:51 AM   #439
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Shawn one thing you may want to look into before resetting your tank are the vertical supports of you stand. IMHO the vert. supports should always be under supporting the horizontals. When the stand settles. which they all do to some extent, the trick is for it to do this in an evenly. With the vert extending up past the horizontals they are essentially separate surfaces that may not move in unison with the rest of the stand top. This could create pressure points even with foam under the tank since your dealing with 5,000+ pounds. Not saying this was the cause but definately something worth checking in your process of trying to figure out why the tank failed.



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Unread 08/02/2007, 11:11 AM   #440
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now thats what i call customer service.


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Unread 08/02/2007, 03:36 PM   #441
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Quote:
Originally posted by Treg
I think the AGE warranty is only 1 year also. Unless you buy their stand, then its 5 year....


I think AGE is the only company who can say they have never had a tank leak on them.


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Unread 08/02/2007, 09:38 PM   #442
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Dont get me wrong Ed, That wasnt to knock on AGE.
I was just pointing out that AO isnt doing anything all that different from other "Well Respected" tank builders...


Who has had tanks leak or has not is pretty irrrelavant here, We all know there is a whole lot more AO tanks on RC then AGE tanks.
Not to mention, there is no real good indication so far that it was an actual problem from the tank manufacture.
AO is probably the only one here that can answer that question.



This fear is one we all share. Its a risk we all take with keeping a glass box full of water in our homes.
The bigger the box, the bigger the risk.

Hopefully Shawn can get his tank fixed and back on track in a mannor that satifies both parties.


I've delt with AO on more then one occasion and know for fact that Will is a stand up guy.
And I'm pretty sure I am not the only one that can say that.


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Unread 08/02/2007, 10:07 PM   #443
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I've read where some are saying silicone failure, and AO should be responsible for it even under those circumstances. I would have to say I don't agree with that. That would fallback on the manufacture of the silicone. IMO
But I also think that before any us really knows what happened or why it happened, it was wrong for most of you to automatically jump on the band wagon of it being AO's fault and pretty much forcing them into a situation that is really no concern of any one other than the parties involved.(slam me if you want)

I also agree with szwab, I would consider making some changes to that stand. I think I would use nothing less that 4x4 in the corners and middle support areas and under the horizontal supports.
Also curious when you leveled it, what length level did you use.

Again I'm sorry it as turned out the way it as for you and I hope it all works out in the long run.


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Unread 08/03/2007, 06:24 AM   #444
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Quote:
Originally posted by jnarowe
Contact NexDog about his experience with the denitrifier. I seem to remember that it did not produce the results he expected. When I built my Multi-Media reactor, I left room for various media and figured I might run sulfur in it, but my research so far doesn't support the practice. I am a bit shy of putting something so caustic as sulfur into my system in the first place. And you are about right with regards to the reactor...it is a lot like a CA reactor.
Used to follow this thread and as I'm back to reading RC regularly I'm catching up on all my old and favourite threads. So just started on this thread from the crrent split when I saw this post by Jonathan.

Anyhow, I've had around 10 months I think and it doesn't work. I know I've been really neglectful of my husbandry practices this year but my nitrates are off the chart. I expected the Denitrator to somehow offset my abuse but not so it seems. So big thumbs down for this product.

I'm already thinking about JapanReef 2.0 as this was my first attempt at a big system and all the issues I've experienced really started taking the joy out of it. A reefers biggest enemies (IME) are space (or lack of it) and convenience (or inconvenience of equipment access). If I had teh space I'd design a push button water change system (one of my pet hates) and a Remote DSB. I think a Remote DSB is the only answer to nitrate issues - but only if you have the space to set one up.

Anyhow going to catch up on the rest of this thread now.


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Unread 08/03/2007, 07:51 AM   #445
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nexdog:
so as not to rub salt into a wound,you might want to skip to this part:

Well I got up today to get ready for work and my wife said there was a rotten fishy smell in the basement a few minutes before when she went down to check on some clothes... I got up and went to check and sure enough water was on the floor and the frag tank water it almost white... and maybe close to 10" if water was missing from the display... I was keep thinking about any power issues or anything since Sat because I was down there and everything was fine... so it happened from Sat night on to this morning... After calling into work and telling them I was not able to make it in today I went back down and it looks like the seam gave way, from the way looks of it right now it seems to have been kinda a fast drain, not a burst or anything... But right now I am pretty much ******... I think my fish days are vastly coming to an end... I can't deal with this crap... If it was not for bad luck, I would not have any luck at all...

Pics to follow...


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Unread 08/03/2007, 08:50 AM   #446
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Damn, that hurts. Sorry to hear about that.

I can't remember the rest of the thread but I can't recall too many major issues. Lets face it, we are keeping animals in an artificial environment. Fish die, corals die, equipment dies. You seem to have gotten really depressed over the loss of the fish and this is understandable on some scale but to the point of throwing in the towel?

Reefkeeping, and especially Large Tanks requires a huge amount of things many have in short supply. I'm talking time, money, and stamina (in terms of motivation). All of these I have in short supply for sure. I'm good at building things but my problem in anything has always been in sustaining it. In the last 18 months I probably spent $2k on coral and it's pretty much all dead now. Last year I couldn't fix my temp issues without opening the access doors and keeping the air con on in my office 24/7. This resulted in lots of mildew in my office and wallpaper peeling etc. And I designed the system to be enclosed! Never been able to fix the microbubbles. RODI system never pumped out 50GPD and when the weather started cooling down last winter it trickled out at maybe 10GPD. So barely enough to top-off and not enough for water changes. Then my lights started breaking, more expense, nitrates rising, bought a denitrator, didn't work, more expense. The Vortechs simply fell apart. Are we seeing a trend here?

So issues combined with expense started to make me resent the tank. The last thing I did was around last November which was installing an industrial extractor fan and ducting to canopy and made a duct box over the ballasts. Of course this cost more money. So I didn't order a new RODI unit or cartridges. I just didn't do any water changes. And in the end it didn't put out enough to cover top-off so I used tap water. I cleaned the tank every two months, fed the fish, did the bare minimum and now with PO4 and NO3 off the chart only a hammer and mushrooms are surviving.

Point I'm making is that there will always be issues and you haven't really started on the main display yet. I'm now getting back it into it as I feel I spent all this money so a couple of grand here and there is really necessary in order to maintain this thing I have created. Now if my tank was to crack or seal to break I have to ask myself what would I do. After all the issues and if the tank manufacturer didn't want to look after me I think it would be the end because even a free tank means something ridiculous in shipping to Japan. In my case I think I'd take a hiatus from the hobby until I could start again but then again maybe not?

I guess you have some big decisions to make and it comes down to how much you want that tank.


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Unread 08/03/2007, 09:02 AM   #447
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Quote:
Originally posted by Aquarium Obsessed
Well obviously this is very bad news. We are always very sorry for anyone's loss. Very hard to say what has caused the problem in this case but the bottom line is we need to get this fixed asap.

Shawn please give us a call and we will figure out a way to help you.

(705) 719-9111

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after seeing this i think all will be well in the end. dont give up hope shawn. there is light at the end of the tunnel.
this is just another one of lifes little tests.


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Unread 08/03/2007, 09:15 AM   #448
asnatlas
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Quote:
Originally posted by cbui2
that is crazy, only one year warranty for large display. for the eurobrace, how many sides came apart?
If you are looking at the front of the tank (8ft side) the top of the back/right corner is where the eurobracing came apart along with that corner, so just the one area... I would say I lost atleast 200gal of water, prob a little more...


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Unread 08/03/2007, 09:18 AM   #449
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Quote:
Originally posted by jnarowe
Unfortunately that looks like a manufacturer defect. Now don't all start flaming me, but seriously, if that had happened from the move, it would have burst a lot sooner, like when he first filled it. And since he is not in earthquake country, it's not like the tank took a big enough hit to cause the silicone to come loose.

Now we all know that you can cut the silicone with a metal scraper, but that wouldn't explain why the eurobracing split open.
I would think that if it was due to the move it would have happened alot sooner, but I can't say for sure... I just think with over 2 tons of water the seam gave way for some reason... I don't know... I have contacted AO and waiting to hear back...


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Unread 08/03/2007, 09:20 AM   #450
asnatlas
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fliger
OMG! Man, I totally feel for you. Search for "Troll" in the Vendor feedback forum, eerily similar. I have only read this last page and will read more in a few. I don't even know what to say, you are way too nice of a guy for this to happen to. Regardless of one year, two years, whenever you set it up .... its COMPLETELY the builder's responsibility to get this taken care of. Wow, and there was just a thread about rimless tanks and how eurobracing is SO much better. Yet the last the splits like this I remember on RC were all eurobraced tanks.
Thanks for your post Fliger... I was really hoping I would never have to deal with something like this, but I guess it could have been worse... But like I said before each time it just seems to be getting worse and worse each time something does happen...


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