Rebuild and recovery of a dead tank

[jason2459]

Got a little water change in this morning again. Probably wont get a chance to do a full slew of tests until Sunday. Getting the house ready for visitors. Looks like we're going to have the next 2000000 weekends taken up with family coming to stay with us to see our new addition.

Did get a new addition to the tank today. The wife was going stir crazy and decided to get out of the house. She ended up at Petco to get our pup some rawhides and got talked into getting a Scarlet Skunk Cleaner shrimp and a Bicolor Blenny. She told the person there that our tank is new and has this green algae stuff everywhere. The person said the shrimp will help pick up small particles to reduce future algae and the fish will eat up the algae already there.

I do love blennies and was on my original list of desired fish but since that list I have of course changed my mind a million times and decided on a different blenny. Well, I guess it's right back on.

Already acclimated via a drip for about an hour in a bucket with both the fish and shrimp in there. Shrimp is already up in a cave and can't see it and the blenny has found several small holes he can wedge himself in and out of. Fun to watch. Will get a picture of them later when I don't have a sleeping baby on my chest.

2pm Quick Hanna Probe tests. (I absolutely love this thing.)
Temp: 79.8
pH: 7.95
ORP: 242

[jason2459]

Here's some recent shots.

FTS
[IMG]http://i31.*******.com/qnky1k.jpg[/IMG]

Here's the new maxijet 1200 replacing the bigger and noisier rio.
[IMG]http://i30.*******.com/2zz8b6c.jpg[/IMG]

Cleaner Shrimp
[IMG]http://i28.*******.com/e7z57n.jpg[/IMG]

My dismal attempt to catch the camera shy blenny.
[IMG]http://i26.*******.com/znmntu.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i26.*******.com/ippggj.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i30.*******.com/28r2o9k.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i29.*******.com/o85fnn.jpg[/IMG]

[jason2459]

BTW, I officially have a tank from the dead. I present to you Frankenskimmer.

I now have a sea clone maxijet 1200 pump, coralife super skimmer 65 body, drilled out overflow, and Lee's berlin 3" wood stone. You know I decided on the three BEST skimmers out there to make one ultimate best every skimmer in the world.

This final step of the air stone came about out of laziness and less maintenance. I had some foam in the refug to remove the microbubbles. Still had a few getting into the tank and realized I really didn't want to clean the foam every week because heaven forbid I ANOTHER nitrate factory going on. Instead of the air going into the pump the pump is just pumping water and using the whisper air pump to push air/ozone right into the stone into the skimmer. This allows the air bubbles to go straight up and never travels all the way down to where the water goes out of the skimmer. No micro bubbles and no foam necessary now. Just have to replace the air stone every couple months or so.


Has a small cost to it but much less maintenance. Worth it in my book. Plus the foaming output is a LOT more. Here's some pics to show what I'm talking about.

[IMG]http://i30.*******.com/35358vp.jpg[/IMG]

[img]http://i31.*******.com/2djp3eu.jpg[/img]

[IMG]http://i32.*******.com/33pgims.jpg[/IMG]

[jason2459]

Hair algae is absolutely loving my tank. It's in nice thick mats all over the place. Though I'm starting to see small peaces floating around. Either that's a good thing and it will be going away or it's just spreading even more.

The cleaner shrimp is pretty cool. I went into the tank to clean off the glass and he attacked my hand the entire time. I couldn't keep him off.

[IMG]http://i28.*******.com/oh3ae8.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i25.*******.com/wmo74.jpg[/IMG]


Original Video - More videos at *******


Tests from last night 7:30pm
Temp: 78.6
SG: 34
pH: 7.93
ORP: 148
Ammonia:0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 5

Nitrates finally moved down. It's not 0 but close enough for me to be happy. So, I'm assuming the algae is starting to break up.

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by jason2459
Hair algae is absolutely loving my tank. It's in nice thick mats all over the place. Though I'm starting to see small peaces floating around. Either that's a good thing and it will be going away or it's just spreading even more.

The cleaner shrimp is pretty cool. I went into the tank to clean off the glass and he attacked my hand the entire time. I couldn't keep him off.

[IMG]http://i28.*******.com/oh3ae8.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i25.*******.com/wmo74.jpg[/IMG]


Original Video - More videos at *******


Tests from last night 7:30pm
Temp: 78.6
SG: 34
pH: 7.93
ORP: 148
Ammonia:0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 5

Nitrates finally moved down. It's not 0 but close enough for me to be happy. So, I'm assuming the algae is starting to break up.

algae cycles too along with nitrates (and phosphates). As your live rock fully cures which could take a few months and the levels of nitrates and phosphates fall to zero then the algae will die off also. IMO the trick right now is to let it grow in places (other then on the live rock) because it is contributing to its own demise by consuming the nitrates and phosphates.

[jason2459]

Originally posted by capn_hylinur
algae cycles too along with nitrates (and phosphates). As your live rock fully cures which could take a few months and the levels of nitrates and phosphates fall to zero then the algae will die off also. IMO the trick right now is to let it grow in places (other then on the live rock) because it is contributing to its own demise by consuming the nitrates and phosphates.

Maybe I should start dosing cap'n morgans. I just don't get people throwing in all these chemicals and additives and trying to speed things up. I think the algae looks pretty neat. Though they are producing quite a bit of bubbles in the tank.


7pm Tests
Temp: 80.7
SG: 34
pH: 8
ORP: 170
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 5

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by jason2459
Maybe I should start dosing cap'n morgans. I just don't get people throwing in all these chemicals and additives and trying to speed things up. I think the algae looks pretty neat. Though they are producing quite a bit of bubbles in the tank.


7pm Tests
Temp: 80.7
SG: 34
pH: 8
ORP: 170
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 5

I used to keep algae in the tank simply to help with nitrates and phosphates---that was before my refugiums---now I let any kind of algae grow in there.

[Rae C.]

[B]

The cleaner shrimp is pretty cool. I went into the tank to clean off the glass and he attacked my hand the entire time. I couldn't keep him off. [B]

Maybe it's saying you need to wash your hands next time

I just bought a cleaner shrimp too but I haven't seen him since I let him loose last week. I hope he's just busy in the rocks in back.

[jason2459]

Cap'n that's the plan here too. Have the HOB refug and I really don't care what's going to grow back there. I do have some chaeto, gracliareiaoruaous (sp?), and some live rock. I just pulled the chaeto apart and put a small ball in the main tank for now too.

Rae that cleaner shrimp was pretty much hidden in a cave for the first few days but he's been super busy around the tank since then. Could be because I don't have any fish I need to feed yet so he's savaging everything he can.

But yeah, I probably should keep my hands a little cleaner. LOL He did give me a good manicure though.

Just ordered another 200g salt mix box of IO RC. The reviews on this site has just been SO positive about it recently. Also, added in a phosphate test kit for the heck of it. I think I'll start doing water changes and full tests weekly instead of daily now that the nitrates have calmed down.

I think my LFG will be going to pick up some fish in about 3-4 weeks or so. I'll probably see if he can pick me up a fish or two. I did break down and ordered a CUC today as well from reef cleaners. Just got 10 cerith snails and 10 nerite snails. Should be here pretty quickly.

[jason2459]

Water seems to be getting very clear looking now. Still has the microbubbles from the algae being flung all over the tank. I think the ozone is really helping with the clarity though. I'm not running any carbon or any other filtration besides the RUGF but I doubt that's it.

Probe tests 7pm
Temp: 80.5
pH: 8.11
ORP: 159

I'm really curious why the ORP hasn't gone up. I did bump the ozonizer to 75% yesterday just to see what would happen and the ORP went down a bit. I was scared I'd have to really watch it closely to make sure it didn't go over like 400 and kept reading that it was highly suggested to get the digital ozonizer with controller or certain disaster would happen. Glad I didn't waste the money on that. Just an easy to adjust dial for me and a hand held probe.

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by jason2459
Water seems to be getting very clear looking now. Still has the microbubbles from the algae being flung all over the tank. I think the ozone is really helping with the clarity though. I'm not running any carbon or any other filtration besides the RUGF but I doubt that's it.

Probe tests 7pm
Temp: 80.5
pH: 8.11
ORP: 159

I'm really curious why the ORP hasn't gone up. I did bump the ozonizer to 75% yesterday just to see what would happen and the ORP went down a bit. I was scared I'd have to really watch it closely to make sure it didn't go over like 400 and kept reading that it was highly suggested to get the digital ozonizer with controller or certain disaster would happen. Glad I didn't waste the money on that. Just an easy to adjust dial for me and a hand held probe.

PaulB may be able to help you on ozonizers

[jason2459]

Originally posted by capn_hylinur
PaulB may be able to help you on ozonizers

I might have to pop over and ask. It might have to do with the tank cycling and/or the large amount of algae right now. I was giong to wait and see what happens after the initial cycling is over.

[Paul B]

As long as there are organics like dying algae, ozone is being used up. Your orp will not go up until all that is oxidized.
My ORP is reading 371. I have no idea if that is correct but I add 100mg of ozone constantly. I always use the thing cranked up as high as I could. It has been like that forever so I don't think it is harmful. My water returns to the tank over a five foot algae tray so there is no chance of any residual ozone going into the tank. The controller goes up to 400 but it has never reached that.
I don't really pay much attention to it, it is just there.
Kind of like Waterkeper

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by Paul B
As long as there are organics like dying algae, ozone is being used up. Your orp will not go up until all that is oxidized.
My ORP is reading 371. I have no idea if that is correct but I add 100mg of ozone constantly. I always use the thing cranked up as high as I could. It has been like that forever so I don't think it is harmful. My water returns to the tank over a five foot algae tray so there is no chance of any residual ozone going into the tank. The controller goes up to 400 but it has never reached that.
I don't really pay much attention to it, it is just there.
Kind of like Waterkeper

why did you find it necessary to use ozone in the first place?

[Paul B]

It is not necessary, I just like it

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by Paul B
It is not necessary, I just like it

are we talking about ozone here

Seriously, what are the reasons for adopting the use of ozone in a tank---I'm ozone illerate.

[Paul B]

Ozone is the secret. It is one of the best things you can supply. It oxidizes anything organic and makes the water as pure as it can be. It raises the ORP which is the ability of the water to handle wastes. Go for it.

[jason2459]

Well, using the ozone really helped my skimmer work better then it did before not using it. I was starting to get some good skimmate without much of a bioload at all. In fact since using the air stone the skimmer has worked even better. Started about two weeks ago with some light to dark tea with the skimmer running wet. About a week ago adding the air stone it went completely black with thick film forming.

The past few days though it's turned a really dark green and the water in the tank is super polished looking. I think the GHA is starting to kill itself and the ozone is kicking in to polish the water even though the ORP keeps dropping again after peaking a week or so ago up in the 200's. The GHA is also starting to look brownish. I'm not sure what it's suppose to look like when it dies off. I'm also seeing more and more strands in the water column.

7:30p Quick Probe Tests

Temp: 80.3
pH: 8.19
ORP: 114

[Aquarist007]

Isn't running phosban and carbon reactors accomplishing the same thing with alot less problems?

[jason2459]

Have no idea Cap'n and hope Paul B steps in again. So far in my experience it seems to be doing the same as the set up I had before with the canister filter (w/ carbon and poly floss filter pad) and UV turbo twist. Benefit to me is that I don't have to break down the canister filter every week, cost of replacing media, cost of replacing UV bulbs, increased skimmer production, and a lot less equipment. Turns my skimmer into a 3-in-1 device. Skimmer/Ozone reactor/refuge prefilter. Which completely meets my goals for this tank which is easy low maintenances and low running costs.

Planned maintenance in the future
Run mag float on glass daily and razor as needed ((Possibly the most work I'll have to do. )

Clean skimmer collection cup/bucket as needed.

Fill ATO container once a week and possibly add kalk to it down the road once I start getting some corals. I might not even have to do that.

Check parameters every 2-3 weeks. Probe checks probably weekly or as I feel like it just because it's quick and easy.

3-6 week water changes depending on parameters (day before have ro/di fill mixing container and takes about 3m to perform change the next day. Probably a total of 5-10m of hands on work.)

Clean water pumps monthly. (Or at least I should but will probably be really bad about this and remember to do it about once a year.)

Replace air stone every 2-3 months. (Probably most expensive long term maintenance over time. $7 for two 3" wood stones locally.)

Diatom Filter every 3-4 months.

Replace Ozonizer and Diatom filter every 10-20 years.

Clean RUGF in 25 years lol


I think that's about it. Pretty easy and low cost. Almost forgot to mention that I went into a pool store today that happens to only be about three blocks away from me and got a bag of diatomite (DE) powder. Went in and asked if they had any diatom filter powder and the the guy called someone else there to bring up a bag of it for me. I then asked how much it was going to be and he told me $39!!!! I was about to say hell no I'm not paying $39 for a small bag of this stuff. Well, just before I said no way a guy comes in with this HUGE 50lbs bag of the stuff. I said okay. This will last for freaking ever.

[Paul B]

Isn't running phosban and carbon reactors accomplishing the same thing with alot less problems?

Not at all. Phosban is for phosphate but ozone will not remove phosphate. Ozone only removes organics like fish poop, food and all DOCs (disolved organic carbons)
OK being I am not Waterkeeper I have to quote from my aquarium chemistry book that was written before most of you were born.

"Ozone is very effective because the water is not being contaminated by chemicals. Since it raises the oxidation threshold of the water to it's limit, the highest potential.
Through Ozonation we reach the values which are otherwize only found in the purest waters on earth, the mountain brook and coral reef. All of the reducing compounds are oxidized at the quickest speed. Undesirable intermediate compounds, which often disturb the water for an uncomfortable long time and are the cause of critical complications, are soon made non-toxic, and the highly reductive reducing agents originating from many processes of decomposition and the very dangerous bacterial toxins are prevented from developing at all.
In other words, dangerous compounds do not develop.

Also Capn, the toxins that most corals use for defense will stay in the water for a long time unless removed. We can't measure these compounds but they are toxic to many corals.
The slime that sloughs off corals (and fish) is also oxidized.
Oxone also does not have to be maintained like carbon, it keeps working. I have used carbon as long as I have salt water and feel it is a very important thing to have.

Another interesting fact I have found in this book, which I have always agreed with

"It is a fact that seawater with green algae in it is surprisingly stable"

[jason2459]

Got a quick probe test in before the next wave of company gets here.

12:30p
Temp: 78.9
pH: 7.88
ORP: 159

I thought the hair algae was going away but it looks like my blenny is doing some house keeping himself. He keeps picking at the base and spitting the algae onto the ground. I was going to work on it on Sunday when the company left and get it off the rocks but looks like my blenny is doing it for me.

[reeferoo]

What an excellent thread. Subscribed for sure. Way to follow PaulB! Really love the stand and the baby is so cuuute!

Can't wait to watch this tank grow and mature

[Aquarist007]

Originally posted by Paul B
Not at all. Phosban is for phosphate but ozone will not remove phosphate. Ozone only removes organics like fish poop, food and all DOCs (disolved organic carbons)
OK being I am not Waterkeeper I have to quote from my aquarium chemistry book that was written before most of you were born.

"Ozone is very effective because the water is not being contaminated by chemicals. Since it raises the oxidation threshold of the water to it's limit, the highest potential.
Through Ozonation we reach the values which are otherwize only found in the purest waters on earth, the mountain brook and coral reef. All of the reducing compounds are oxidized at the quickest speed. Undesirable intermediate compounds, which often disturb the water for an uncomfortable long time and are the cause of critical complications, are soon made non-toxic, and the highly reductive reducing agents originating from many processes of decomposition and the very dangerous bacterial toxins are prevented from developing at all.
In other words, dangerous compounds do not develop.

Also Capn, the toxins that most corals use for defense will stay in the water for a long time unless removed. We can't measure these compounds but they are toxic to many corals.
The slime that sloughs off corals (and fish) is also oxidized.
Oxone also does not have to be maintained like carbon, it keeps working. I have used carbon as long as I have salt water and feel it is a very important thing to have.

Another interesting fact I have found in this book, which I have always agreed with

"It is a fact that seawater with green algae in it is surprisingly stable"

okay Paul I get it I was under the impression that carbon also removed coral toxins etc.
I just don't know if you need to run both carbon and ozone if ozone is doing a similar job??

[jason2459]

Good questions cap'n. I'm not currently running carbon but do have some in case I need it for some reason. I do plan on blending some up and adding with DE in the diatom filter when I use it though.