Aquarium on ledge above a recessed front door?

jsc0787 · 01/25/2018, 08:22 PM

Hi everyone. Out of all the places in my new to me house it seems like the space above my front door would be an awesome place for a simple freshwater aquarium without a sump. I've had a 90, 240, and 180 gallon full blown reefs in the past, but being sumpless with just the ability to place a hang on filter on the back sounds like an opportunity to bring back my high school days with freshwater.

I'm posting in Reefcentral because I have before and no one has imagination like the awesome tanks you might see on here. So for those that have built your own stands and such could you imagine somehow making this ledge proper to hold 1,000 pounds? I've stood up there multiple times and had a few drywall/window guys working up there at the same time with no issues. The drywall layer on the "floor" of the ledge does not even get dented from walking on it. I also know that there is a 4x4 at the front left of the ledge (where the A/V cabinet is cut in) but I don't know if it goes all the way up or stops at the level of the landing.

The dimensions are roughly 64" x 30" so I'm thinking around 120 gallons likely for the size.

Scrubber_steve · 01/25/2018, 08:37 PM

Cool!

Get an engineers opinion

jsc0787 · 01/25/2018, 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twinfallz

Cool!

Get an engineers opinion

I had four different engineers at my house when I first bought it when I was inquiring about knocking down what to them should have been obvious non-load bearing walls. None of them wanted to tell me anything for sure and I spent $500 between two of them just for the visits. I ended having to just knock holes in the drywall and examine the structures myself. I assume that's what I'll have to do here but wanted to see if anyone had any better opinions.

meklo · 01/25/2018, 10:51 PM

Just my opinion:

You're going to have to knock holes in the drywall and look. Unless you can contact the builder and inquire, no one is going to know. An engineer isn't going to know for sure how it was built and whether it will hold a tank. With ledges like this it could have plywood behind the drywall (I've done this before because I anticipated people standing or placing heavy plants in an area). I've seen builders build outcroppings with nothing but nailers. Meaning it would not have joists for support.

You could use a stud finder (I like the magnetic ones) to try and locate joists, but it is really going to give you an educated guess at best. Just my 2 cents.

Scrubber_steve · 01/25/2018, 11:00 PM

You could cut away a large section of drywall on top - where the tank will sit, to get a good look inside, & to re-enforce.

jsc0787 · 01/25/2018, 11:40 PM

Any idea on what would actually be needed? Would a 4x4 at each corner or alternatively doubled up 2x4s at each corner with 2x10s across the span seem reasonable? That's what I expect to find but even if that is there I'm wondering if that is proper for a "stand"?

Scrubber_steve · 01/25/2018, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsc0787

Any idea on what would actually be needed? Would a 4x4 at each corner or alternatively doubled up 2x4s at each corner with 2x10s across the span seem reasonable? That's what I expect to find but even if that is there I'm wondering if that is proper for a "stand"?

Looking at your middle photo, its quite obvious you'll have a door frame supporting the front of the tank.

But what support will there be for the back of the tank?

jsc0787 · 01/26/2018, 12:02 AM

The exterior framing appears to have a header as well. There is also a "lip" or ridge that looks the size of a 4x4 where a header would be. All the floor joists in the house are 2x10s so that's what I hope to find when I pop out that recessed can light during the day sometime.

Rjukan · 01/26/2018, 07:41 AM

I love the imagination and the idea of a tank up there, but something is telling me it's not going to work out that well even if you get the support situation handled.

My concerns are: the steep viewing angle, the sun/algae issues of being right in front of a window (frequent cleanings in a tough location as a result), and the look of it from the street. Not to mention the logistics of water changes, evap top off, and running an electric line up there.

With the viewing angle unless it's right on that inside edge you won't be able to see much of the aquascape, and little fish will go mostly unnoticed. Maybe a couple large fish would work out better. Also, how high of a tank were you going to go? Will the tank be seen through the front window, and even if it isn't, at night there will be an odd glow that might not compliment the look of your house from the street.

At any rate I wish you the best and look forward to seeing it happen if you do go through with it.

jsc0787 · 01/26/2018, 10:11 AM

I appreciate all those concerns. Other then the viewing angle all the others are thankfully aren't valid in this specific case. Tank height would be below the window and it is a north facing window. Won't get any sunlight from the window or be seen from the outside. There is already an electrical outlet at the back corner of the ledge. I've done plenty of electrical work already here and the can light below would have been a source to tap into anyway.

This would be more of a larger display wirh larger fish and not something I'd sit down in front of daily but more of something of a cool factor for the house and when walking up and down the stairs.

I'm just wondering what material would be safe for a "stand" of that height. Does the height of any stands built effect the support structure material?

FishD@ddy · 01/26/2018, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jsc0787

Any idea on what would actually be needed? Would a 4x4 at each corner or alternatively doubled up 2x4s at each corner with 2x10s across the span seem reasonable? That's what I expect to find but even if that is there I'm wondering if that is proper for a "stand"?

I agree, you should find 2x10 going front to back supporting the door and the exterior wall and once you pop the light you should see it.

But what about temperature swings? Even thought it’s big fish, It’s near a glass window and exterior wall. It will look cool, if all works out.

GOOD LUCK

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sk8r · 01/26/2018, 04:31 PM

You're in California. Slosh in a quake is more extreme the higher up you are. That is a potential problem.

rfgonzo · 01/27/2018, 11:13 PM

Even though it's on the north side sunlight will still cause algae.
Maintenance is going to be a major issue. Like cleaning the front of the tank you'll need to stand on a tall ladder, I guarantee that will become annoying.
I think it looks like a good spot but over time it probably won't get acknowledged as much as it should.
If you still want to take on the challenge first thing to do is rip that drywall out. You're going to want to replace it anyways with something that can handle water spills. Normal drywall you'll end up with moisture issues. Then reinforce whatever wood needs to be in place just like you would if building a stand. Good luck

01/25/2018, 10:51 PM	#4
meklo Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Juneau, Alaska Posts: 55	Just my opinion: You're going to have to knock holes in the drywall and look. Unless you can contact the builder and inquire, no one is going to know. An engineer isn't going to know for sure how it was built and whether it will hold a tank. With ledges like this it could have plywood behind the drywall (I've done this before because I anticipated people standing or placing heavy plants in an area). I've seen builders build outcroppings with nothing but nailers. Meaning it would not have joists for support. You could use a stud finder (I like the magnetic ones) to try and locate joists, but it is really going to give you an educated guess at best. Just my 2 cents. __________________ My build thread: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2651029 Current Tank Info: 180g GlassCages tank. 90 gallon sump with RO 10" SS skimmer and VarioS 6 return. Hamilton Cebu Sun 250w fixture

01/26/2018, 07:41 AM	#9
Rjukan Day Dreamer Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: SINY Posts: 625	I love the imagination and the idea of a tank up there, but something is telling me it's not going to work out that well even if you get the support situation handled. My concerns are: the steep viewing angle, the sun/algae issues of being right in front of a window (frequent cleanings in a tough location as a result), and the look of it from the street. Not to mention the logistics of water changes, evap top off, and running an electric line up there. With the viewing angle unless it's right on that inside edge you won't be able to see much of the aquascape, and little fish will go mostly unnoticed. Maybe a couple large fish would work out better. Also, how high of a tank were you going to go? Will the tank be seen through the front window, and even if it isn't, at night there will be an odd glow that might not compliment the look of your house from the street. At any rate I wish you the best and look forward to seeing it happen if you do go through with it. __________________ - Pete Current Tank Info: 60 gal Deep Blue cube, AquaC EV180, Kessil H80 fuge, A360WE TB

01/26/2018, 04:31 PM	#12
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	You're in California. Slosh in a quake is more extreme the higher up you are. That is a potential problem. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

01/27/2018, 11:13 PM	#13
rfgonzo Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,280	Even though it's on the north side sunlight will still cause algae. Maintenance is going to be a major issue. Like cleaning the front of the tank you'll need to stand on a tall ladder, I guarantee that will become annoying. I think it looks like a good spot but over time it probably won't get acknowledged as much as it should. If you still want to take on the challenge first thing to do is rip that drywall out. You're going to want to replace it anyways with something that can handle water spills. Normal drywall you'll end up with moisture issues. Then reinforce whatever wood needs to be in place just like you would if building a stand. Good luck __________________ 210 gal reef, 75 gal Refuge with 55 Gal sump mixed reef 100 gal Reef, 75 gal Refuge with 55 gal sump. SPS/LPS & 100 gal Japanese Dragon Moray eel tank with 40 gal sump 75 gal Brazilian Dragon Mor

01/25/2018, 08:37 PM	#2
Scrubber_steve I'm really very likeable Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Down Under Posts: 676	Cool! Get an engineers opinion

01/25/2018, 11:00 PM	#5
Scrubber_steve I'm really very likeable Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Down Under Posts: 676	You could cut away a large section of drywall on top - where the tank will sit, to get a good look inside, & to re-enforce.

01/25/2018, 11:40 PM	#6
jsc0787 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Newport Beach, CA Posts: 169	Any idea on what would actually be needed? Would a 4x4 at each corner or alternatively doubled up 2x4s at each corner with 2x10s across the span seem reasonable? That's what I expect to find but even if that is there I'm wondering if that is proper for a "stand"?

01/26/2018, 10:11 AM	#10
jsc0787 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Newport Beach, CA Posts: 169	I appreciate all those concerns. Other then the viewing angle all the others are thankfully aren't valid in this specific case. Tank height would be below the window and it is a north facing window. Won't get any sunlight from the window or be seen from the outside. There is already an electrical outlet at the back corner of the ledge. I've done plenty of electrical work already here and the can light below would have been a source to tap into anyway. This would be more of a larger display wirh larger fish and not something I'd sit down in front of daily but more of something of a cool factor for the house and when walking up and down the stairs. I'm just wondering what material would be safe for a "stand" of that height. Does the height of any stands built effect the support structure material?