Converting from durso to herbie in new 75g reef ready tank

GreatLakeReefer · 06/24/2017, 08:29 AM

I just picked up a reef ready 75g deep blue for a steal off craigslist. Problem is there is only two holes drilled behind overflow. It came with the 1" durso stand pipe and 3/4" return.

My question is,
1) if i want to make both holes drains for a herbie style over flow, which size should i use for full siphon vs emergency overflow? And..
2) what would be my best option for plumbing my return line? Is over the back my only option? And how would i do that best?

Thanks for helping out a new reefer!

Grimreaperz · 06/24/2017, 09:04 AM

Following

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Vinny Kreyling · 06/24/2017, 09:11 AM

The current thought is the larger should be the emergency.
Over the back is the way, running into a Sea Swirl or even 2 if you are ambitious.
Remember-- a gate valve for the drain, NOT a ball valve.

JTL · 06/24/2017, 09:36 AM

The emergency drain needs to be equal to or larger than the main drain to be totally safe. This comes into play with a total obstruction of the main. In a partial obstruction a smaller safety may be enough to compensate but it is risky.

GreatLakeReefer · 06/24/2017, 09:38 AM

Ok that makes sense.. And the gate valve is for fine tuning my siphon correct? The sea swirl looks pretty cool, but will it look chunky sitting on the back rim of the tank? Id like the over the back return to be as sleek and clean as possible. Thanks for the input Vinny!

Vinny Kreyling · 06/24/2017, 10:54 AM

Yes - gate valve tunes the drain.

Lsufan · 06/24/2017, 04:46 PM

Like vinny posted, u will want the 3/4" to be the syphon & the 1" to be the emergency. Depending on circumstances a 3/4" syphon can handle around 1000gph, so u would be fine using that for the syphon. Depending on what u want u should have between 300 to 700 gph through the drains.

As far as the return, if u are using a canopy u can keep it up high in the tank & not be able to see it. U can essentially combine 3 90's to enter the tank. Put two of the 90's back to back to make a U shape & let that hang on the back of the tank. Then put the other 90 to get it back to where it is facing the front glass. That would be a good setup if u plan on attaching locline, if no locline then installing a 45 instead of the last 90 would have it facing at more of a angle instead of at the front glass. I would keep it as high as possible in the tank so u get the least amount of drain down when u turn the return pump off

der_wille_zur_macht · 06/24/2017, 04:50 PM

Another option for the return is to put a bulkhead in the back wall of the tank, so you don't have to deal with a PVC line over the back. Keep it high to avoid a large drain down.

That said, if you're able and willing to drill, you might as well knock the 3/4" out to 1" and have two 1" bulkheads for a Herbie.

Blabomb · 06/25/2017, 01:22 AM

I wasn't comfortable drilling my tank so this is what I came up with. Full siphon on my 1" and a trickle into the .75". I have tested a failure on the 1" and the smaller pipe is able to keep up. Threw the overflow over the top of the tank for now. I may re-plumb and clean things up a little but for now it's fictionally sound.

Blabomb · 06/25/2017, 01:23 AM

*functionally sound* sorry about the fat fingers.

GreatLakeReefer · 06/25/2017, 07:20 AM

Thanks for the feedback! I think im going to use black PVC with the 3 90's and some locline i have lying around to complete the over the back return. Also will still leave the 1" as my emergency overflow, but good to know it works the other way for you blabomb. Still got to complete stand before plumbing can begin!

der_wille_zur_macht · 06/25/2017, 08:47 AM

Running the smaller bulkhead as the emergency only works if your larger siphon drain's gate valve is owed enough under normal operation that the flow is below the max for a 3/4" siphon. And in that case you are basically wasting the extra emergency capacity you'd have from running the bigger hole as the emergency.

If you can't find black fittings, just spray paint normal fittings with plastic-friendly spray paint. There's a recent trend towards using furniture grade pvc since it is available in lots of colors, too.

GreatLakeReefer · 06/25/2017, 02:44 PM

is there a special kind of paint i would need that would be aquarium safe?

JTL · 06/25/2017, 03:13 PM

No, the paint does not make contact with the water.

homer1475 · 06/25/2017, 03:15 PM

I just used krylon for plastic. As long as you let it dry thouroly, it'll be fine.

Also to note, you don't need those elbows on a herbie setup.

http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-...method-basics/

der_wille_zur_macht · 06/25/2017, 04:35 PM

Krylon for plastic has a long history of safe use in the hobby. Honestly, I wouldn't hesitate to use any common off the shelf spraypaint meant for plastics, as long as it was used correctly and fully cured.

djbetterly · 07/09/2018, 05:50 AM

@GreatLakeReefer how is this working out for you? I’m considering doing the same on my tank.

GreatLakeReefer · 07/10/2018, 04:09 PM

Working pretty well! definitely make sure you use the gate valve because i find myself tuning the syphon to keep the over flow quiet.. i keep a tiny trickle going into the emergency drain because i cant ever seem to get it just right

06/24/2017, 08:29 AM	#1
GreatLakeReefer Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Michigan Posts: 5	Converting from durso to herbie in new 75g reef ready tank I just picked up a reef ready 75g deep blue for a steal off craigslist. Problem is there is only two holes drilled behind overflow. It came with the 1" durso stand pipe and 3/4" return. My question is, 1) if i want to make both holes drains for a herbie style over flow, which size should i use for full siphon vs emergency overflow? And.. 2) what would be my best option for plumbing my return line? Is over the back my only option? And how would i do that best? Thanks for helping out a new reefer!

06/24/2017, 09:11 AM	#3
Vinny Kreyling Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Miller Place, NY Posts: 7,206	The current thought is the larger should be the emergency. Over the back is the way, running into a Sea Swirl or even 2 if you are ambitious. Remember-- a gate valve for the drain, NOT a ball valve. __________________ 250 gallon mixed reef, 2 Reefbreeder's Photon V 2, Deepwater BLDC 12, DAS EX-3 Skimmer, MTC mini cal, 2-3/4" Sea Swirls, Aquacontroller & 6 Tunze pumps.

06/24/2017, 09:36 AM	#4
JTL Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Venice Island, FL Posts: 2,532	The emergency drain needs to be equal to or larger than the main drain to be totally safe. This comes into play with a total obstruction of the main. In a partial obstruction a smaller safety may be enough to compensate but it is risky. __________________ John 100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium. Reefbreeders Photon V2+.

06/24/2017, 10:54 AM	#6
Vinny Kreyling Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Miller Place, NY Posts: 7,206	Yes - gate valve tunes the drain. __________________ 250 gallon mixed reef, 2 Reefbreeder's Photon V 2, Deepwater BLDC 12, DAS EX-3 Skimmer, MTC mini cal, 2-3/4" Sea Swirls, Aquacontroller & 6 Tunze pumps.

06/24/2017, 04:50 PM	#8
der_wille_zur_macht Team RC Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NY Posts: 17,749	Another option for the return is to put a bulkhead in the back wall of the tank, so you don't have to deal with a PVC line over the back. Keep it high to avoid a large drain down. That said, if you're able and willing to drill, you might as well knock the 3/4" out to 1" and have two 1" bulkheads for a Herbie. __________________ Inconveniencing marine life since 1992 "It is my personal belief that reef aquaria should be thriving communities of biodiversity, representative of their wild counterparts, and not merely collections of pretty specimens growing on tidy clean rock shelves covered in purple coralline algae." (Eric Borneman)

06/24/2017, 09:04 AM	#2
Grimreaperz Registered Member Join Date: May 2016 Location: British Columbia Posts: 518	Following Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

06/24/2017, 09:38 AM	#5
GreatLakeReefer Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Michigan Posts: 5	Ok that makes sense.. And the gate valve is for fine tuning my siphon correct? The sea swirl looks pretty cool, but will it look chunky sitting on the back rim of the tank? Id like the over the back return to be as sleek and clean as possible. Thanks for the input Vinny!

06/24/2017, 04:46 PM	#7
Lsufan Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: Baton Rouge Posts: 1,410	Like vinny posted, u will want the 3/4" to be the syphon & the 1" to be the emergency. Depending on circumstances a 3/4" syphon can handle around 1000gph, so u would be fine using that for the syphon. Depending on what u want u should have between 300 to 700 gph through the drains. As far as the return, if u are using a canopy u can keep it up high in the tank & not be able to see it. U can essentially combine 3 90's to enter the tank. Put two of the 90's back to back to make a U shape & let that hang on the back of the tank. Then put the other 90 to get it back to where it is facing the front glass. That would be a good setup if u plan on attaching locline, if no locline then installing a 45 instead of the last 90 would have it facing at more of a angle instead of at the front glass. I would keep it as high as possible in the tank so u get the least amount of drain down when u turn the return pump off

06/25/2017, 01:23 AM	#10
Blabomb Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Sarasota, Fl Posts: 39	functionally sound sorry about the fat fingers.

06/25/2017, 07:20 AM	#11
GreatLakeReefer Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Michigan Posts: 5	Thanks for the feedback! I think im going to use black PVC with the 3 90's and some locline i have lying around to complete the over the back return. Also will still leave the 1" as my emergency overflow, but good to know it works the other way for you blabomb. Still got to complete stand before plumbing can begin!

06/25/2017, 08:47 AM	#12
der_wille_zur_macht Team RC Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NY Posts: 17,749	Running the smaller bulkhead as the emergency only works if your larger siphon drain's gate valve is owed enough under normal operation that the flow is below the max for a 3/4" siphon. And in that case you are basically wasting the extra emergency capacity you'd have from running the bigger hole as the emergency. If you can't find black fittings, just spray paint normal fittings with plastic-friendly spray paint. There's a recent trend towards using furniture grade pvc since it is available in lots of colors, too. __________________ Inconveniencing marine life since 1992 "It is my personal belief that reef aquaria should be thriving communities of biodiversity, representative of their wild counterparts, and not merely collections of pretty specimens growing on tidy clean rock shelves covered in purple coralline algae." (Eric Borneman)

06/25/2017, 02:44 PM	#13
GreatLakeReefer Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Michigan Posts: 5	is there a special kind of paint i would need that would be aquarium safe?

06/25/2017, 03:13 PM	#14
JTL Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Venice Island, FL Posts: 2,532	No, the paint does not make contact with the water. __________________ John 100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium. Reefbreeders Photon V2+.

06/25/2017, 03:15 PM	#15
homer1475 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Upstate NY Posts: 5,313	I just used krylon for plastic. As long as you let it dry thouroly, it'll be fine. Also to note, you don't need those elbows on a herbie setup. http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-...method-basics/ __________________ 80G SCA Build: http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2560256 Originally posted by der_wille_zur_macht: "He's just taking his lunch to work"

06/25/2017, 04:35 PM	#16
der_wille_zur_macht Team RC Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NY Posts: 17,749	Krylon for plastic has a long history of safe use in the hobby. Honestly, I wouldn't hesitate to use any common off the shelf spraypaint meant for plastics, as long as it was used correctly and fully cured. __________________ Inconveniencing marine life since 1992 "It is my personal belief that reef aquaria should be thriving communities of biodiversity, representative of their wild counterparts, and not merely collections of pretty specimens growing on tidy clean rock shelves covered in purple coralline algae." (Eric Borneman)

07/09/2018, 05:50 AM	#17
djbetterly Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 284	@GreatLakeReefer how is this working out for you? I’m considering doing the same on my tank.

07/10/2018, 04:09 PM	#18
GreatLakeReefer Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Michigan Posts: 5	Working pretty well! definitely make sure you use the gate valve because i find myself tuning the syphon to keep the over flow quiet.. i keep a tiny trickle going into the emergency drain because i cant ever seem to get it just right