The Skimmer Comparison Chart

[RobbyG]

I think most of it came from websites and owners manuals, but Straegen was the one who gathered the data. so he's the best one to answer your question

Originally posted by FishAreFriends2
Where did you gather the info from for the actual size of the tank?

[happyface888]

Originally posted by FishAreFriends2
I think the octopus hob skimmer bh100/f are higher than 40gallons for actual ratings. Its more like 55gallons, I own a bh100 and I'm getting great skimmate any higher I wouldnt recommend. Theres one reefer who has the bh100 on a 90gallon which is too much but hes getting serious skimmate, so the actual rating should be a 55gallon. And the price of the BH100f is wrong. It cost 141.99 at reefstop average is 150. It also comes with a surface skimming box and pumps in the back chamber.
I don't see the rogue up there.

I agree with the above, I've owned a cpr bakpak2 and had it on a 30gallon and I never got any good skimmate most of the time tea colored. Than I upgraded my tank to a 45gallon and the cpr still continued with the green tea. After I switched to the octopus bh100f it skimmed like crazy brown skimmate. I would change the cpr it doesnt work...

[reef / aholic]

Missing from "The Skimmer Comparison Chart"

BK 160, 180, 200 mini and BK Super Marines 250. The pictures for the BK's are for older models. Also I do not see an entry got the KZ Revolution.

You will need to add some more columns for the diameter of the skimmer, amount of air pumped into the skimmer and water flow rate through the skimmer.

[lilred1995vette]

The chart is very helpful!

[davidryder]

As you all can probably tell there is A LOT of information in this chart. If you would like to suggest corrections or changes please try to be as specific as possible.

The tank size ratings were pulled straight from manufacturer staff or the manufacturers website. These ratings obviously vary greatly depending on factors such as bio-load and additional filtration but they are provided as a basic guideline.

If you have price corrections or corrected photos of skimmers a link or specific data would be awesomely appreciated as there are only 2 people working on this massive chart.

Thanks for all the input, and keep it coming!

[gojicraig]

Great chart! and kudos to you for all the work that must have gone into this project. I came to this thread actually looking to compare calcium reactors, and couldn't get off of it. Does anyone know where to get this info? Don't want to hijack the thread though. Thought, would that be a project that you may take on in the future?

[RobbyG]

As David said, specific information and links to pictures etc. would really help.
Some skimmers that are missing may simply be missing because we can find no information on them.

[luke33]

Originally posted by USC-fan
That wouldn't be a good idea. While one pump may pull the same amount of air, one could be pumping out twice the amount of water.

Now why on earth would you think showing a skimmers size, air pull and gph would be a bad idea? Unless Deltec, BK, BM and all high end skimmer companies are marketing wrong by showing this? To me its one of the most important decisions in buying a skimmer. Why do you think your Das is so nice? Not because of its small reaction chamber but because of the 500lph air it'll pull at such a log gph and size of the neck. That would be another one....neck diameter. Its like looking at an aquaeuro and seeing the classic 400 at 10" in diameter.......but you don't know its only got a 3" neck. It only pulls around 18-20scfh. Now that's pretty wasteful imo. The das ex1 will pull nearly that and the das ex2 will pull almost twice at 6" in diameter. There are so many different variables out there when making a skimmer choice. The most important one's to me are.

Type of skimmer
Reaction chamber height and diameter
neck diameter
total height
air pull
pump brand
Price

[RandyStacyE]

I do believe that air draw and dimensions would be a GREAT improvement to this list. I'm sure a LOT of time and effort went into creating this list because I've tried doing this myself. All I had to go by was the info I could find on manufacturer's sites, retailer's sites, PDFs, and such. The ONLY info I could never find was how much air these pumps drew on the skimmers and detailed dimensions. Some sites like www.euro-reef.com does show this info, but most do not.

I like knowing the dimensions of the reaction chamber, plumbing size (in and out), neck diameter (wish we knew the neck height), and I'm sure I could go on and on.

My point is that a full detail list like this would require MUCH help from people who actually own/sell these skimmers or have other means to find this info rather than 'just the internet'.

This list would be excellent for DIYers who want to build their own skimmers similar to the prefab skimmers.

This list is excellent, but (and no offence) lacks the technical info that many would wish to see. I have a ton of info that I've collected into Excel sheets and I'm missing a lot so understand that I'm not bashing this list at all. I'm glad someone put forth the effort.

[luke33]

I'd agree with that Randy. It would be great to see, but wow, that would be alot of work. The only skimmers i know that show all that info are the BM, ER, Deltec, BK, DAS, Tunze. Everything else would have to be user info.

[RobbyG]

Guys your pretty much hit the nail on the head. It took almost 4 weeks working 2 hours per day (LOL extended lunch breaks) just to get decent looking pictures. You would think it would be easy but you have no idea how many people will post the same wrong picture in forums, websites and even Catalogs. If you have never seen the unit before it takes about 20 minutes of detective work with each picture just to confirm that it really is a picture of the correct skimmer. I can't imagine the work that straegen did to get the dimensions! Unlike controllers you cant find any good manuals or PDF files on 90% of these skimmers.

I would not even want to attempt to add data like Air Draw into this, but if someone else want to do the work I will gladly add it.

[MarkPo]

Tunze 9010 comes with In Sump and In Tank mounting options, and uses a venturi. AFAIK, that's the same for all 90XX models. Waste Collection is availible, but optional and costs more, so "N" might be the right answer there.

Real world tank size would be hard, Roger recommends multipling rated by .6 for heavily stocked SPS tanks. If you go with that, the 9010 is recommended for no larger then a 150.

[USC-fan]

Originally posted by luke33
Now why on earth would you think showing a skimmers size, air pull and gph would be a bad idea? Unless Deltec, BK, BM and all high end skimmer companies are marketing wrong by showing this? To me its one of the most important decisions in buying a skimmer. Why do you think your Das is so nice? Not because of its small reaction chamber but because of the 500lph air it'll pull at such a log gph and size of the neck. That would be another one....neck diameter. Its like looking at an aquaeuro and seeing the classic 400 at 10" in diameter.......but you don't know its only got a 3" neck. It only pulls around 18-20scfh. Now that's pretty wasteful imo. The das ex1 will pull nearly that and the das ex2 will pull almost twice at 6" in diameter. There are so many different variables out there when making a skimmer choice. The most important one's to me are.

Type of skimmer
Reaction chamber height and diameter
neck diameter
total height
air pull
pump brand
Price

I think it a bad idea because it focuses just on one part too much. Now if you went into greater detail it would be okay.

Also i think it would be better off putting dwell time over air pull anyways....

Dwell time is really one of the most important factor in skimmer performance, IMO.

[luke33]

Sure dwell time is very important, but how in the world would you put that into writing! lol The whole point of skimming is foam fractionation by means of doc's bonding to "air" so yes, i would think air would be one of the main factors in determining what skimmer to choose.

For your comment you are saying its more important to have dwell time. Well what if you have the same dwell time for two skimmers the same size but you don't say what air they pull. One pulls 1000lph and the other 400lph, how would one know which would be a better performer or which to choose. See what i'm saying. Not trying to be rude : )

[USC-fan]

I really don't want to get into this debate in this thread.

Anyway dwell time is really easy to measure with recirc NW skimmers.

[RobbyG]

Question for both of you, can we even get figures like dwell time and air draw from the companies or would we have to depend on RC users? Seems to me that both would be needed to make any kind of rating system.

[RandyStacyE]

I assume that the manufacturers would know the skimmer's air draw, as for the dwell time ... I doubt it, but who knows.

Worth a shot, but I imagine that you will just recieve a duhhhhhh answer from some person who's just there for a paycheck if ya know what I mean

Worth a shot though.

[spazz]

i dont think you will get most companies to list there dwell times. but if you figure out the volume of the skimmer and then figure out the flow rates then you can get a better idea of the dwell time in the skimmer.
it would also be nice to see what the body holds for water but they dont list those numbers etiher. you cant expect these guys to call around or send emails to allthese companies to fid this information. they can get alot of it from r/c members who own these skimmers and are willing to help.


this is a great thread and in time there will be alot more information here for people to view. i really think this thread should be thread of the month. it needs to be knoticed by eveyone here on r/c . then it will have more information to look at.

[reef / aholic]

Where would we need to sent the information to be added to the chart?

[ThaNgBOm321]

yeah.. Thread of the month!! how do i vote!! ( this and the other charts with it) awsome work guys.. this one chart will answer soo many q?s alone... i really got to hand it to you guys/gals.. you guys/gals are friggin fish freeks !! ( in the best way possible of course)

Thanks for the hard work and contribution

YzGyz

[RandyStacyE]

I don't mean to be party pooper or the one that argues, but how on earth does one determine the dwell time based very limited information?

Honestly … pump gph ratings are based on the stock pump using a paddle wheel impeller in most cases. If the air draw is not give for the skimmer then it kind of leaves everyone with a dead end. This can become complex you see because in-sump skimmers (non recirc) differ by the depth of the water in the sump (due to head pressure). Needle wheels do decrease the gph rate in comparison to the given stock gph rate so you really can’t go by gph rate to begin with … even if an elaborate formula exists to determine the air volume displacement etc...

If the manufacturers do not supply this info (which is very easy) it leaves everyone else with this chore if this info is to be put to such a list. We also have to assume that the skimmer owner etc… has the skimmer running at the manufacturer’s specifications.

Most skimmers will skim … this is a given, but some skimmer differ greatly in price which makes us wonder what truly makes the difference? Air draw does and with that so does the skimmer’s dimensions.

This list is a very nice and WELL DONE. Changes have already been made as per some constructive criticism (title headings). Good work

[USC-fan]

Its really simple to find dwell time if you have the flow through rate of the skimmer and the volume.

Anyone can find the flow through rate of their skimmer by timing how long it takes to filled a gallon bag, for example. The volume is also really simple is you know the measurements of the skimmer.

Anyways that is why i said it is really easy to find dwell times for recirc skimmers because these values are all know and made available by the skimmer manufacturers most of the time.

[RandyStacyE]

Dwell time = reaction chamber volume ... ... ?

Air volume must be taken into consideration regardless of how long the said volume dwells. Even IF an elaborate formula exists there are also many variables to consider; like skimmer type. Different types rely on dwell time much less than others. Some types (based on their dimensions) rely more on how much air they induct rather than how long it lingers. More and much finer bubbles compensate for less larger bubbles that linger longer with much bigger skimmers.

I truly do not want a debate ... all my point is ... many if not most manufacturers will not list the most important data because the data is what distinguishes them.

Dwell time would be nice too on the list

[spazz]

Originally posted by RandyStacyE


Most skimmers will skim … this is a given, but some skimmer differ greatly in price which makes us wonder what truly makes the difference? Air draw does and with that so does the skimmer’s dimensions.

alot of what makes the high priced skimmers cost so much is the importing of them from europe. the price of everything comming from europe is going up the first of the year. watch the price of the tunze streams. i have heard from a friend of mine who owns a fish store that the prices are going up 12% the first of the year. alot of this has to due with the valuse of the dollar being low and the value of the euro being really high. the current exchange rate for the euro to dollar is 1 euro to 1.47019 US dollar so if somethig costs $1,000 in europe it will cost $1,470.19 here in the usa plus the cost of shipping it here. this is why deltec, bubble king, H&S so on and so on cost alot more than our american made skimmers do.
the only other thing that differes in a skimmer is its quality and its performance. the higher quality the higher the price. also the higher the performance the more involved it is to build a skimmer and the more parts that are involved in the building process. but in some ways a higher priced skimmer can save you money in the long run by saving energy. it cost alot to run a big skimmer and the more you can save in energy the less money you pay in the long run. i know some people say its not a big enough energy savings to pay for itself. but if you look at the cost of energy in california or florida, this is just a couple of the places where energy effecient skimers can pay for themselves in a couple of years over the cost to run other skimers.
you also have to look atthe water change inervals when your using a top of the line skimmer. you dont need to do as many water changes and they dont need to be as big of a water change if your skimmer is doing it job properly. this will save you money in salt costs, filter changes, and di resen expenses.

[melev]

This is another great idea, guys! I loved the entire AquariumControllers comparison site, and this is just as important. At some tpoing, I think you just need a new site called Aqua-Gear-Comparisons.com and have comparison pages for all kinds of products.

I can build you a list, whenever you are ready.

Very nice addition - and a very good idea.