Brook, velvet?

[02tts]

Can anyone tell me what this is. It has wiped out my tank whatever it is.




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[02tts]

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[farfromsea]

Wiped out you mean everyone dead or everyone infected? When did it start /how long has it been? How many fish?

[02tts]

Originally Posted by farfromsea

Wiped out you mean everyone dead or everyone infected? When did it start /how long has it been? How many fish?

He is the only one left. I had about 20-25 fish, eventually they old died showing the same exact symptoms as this guy. Treated for flukes using PraziPro, treated for velvet/brook using CP, which seemed to restore health right away on all fish only to come back (whatever it is/was) after about 1.5 months or so. This is all on a display tank with live rock in it so I'm sure the live rock aided in sucking up some of the medicine.

At this point I'm no longer treating and waiting or the last guy to go before I go fishless for almost 3 months.

As for water quality, it's fine.

Ph - 8.19-8.21
Alk - 10.4
Calcium - 400-420
Salt - 1.024
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 0 (I dose vinegar)
Ammonia - 0

Could it bacteria and not parasite...I have no idea and give up.

Turn to the experts on the matter.



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[Triggerfish]

Flavobacterium columnare?

[farfromsea]

I thought velvet usually kills within 24H onset of symptoms so if it was really fast could be the cause. CP I did not think was the drug of choice for velvet or brook but someone will reply soon I'm sure. Sorry to hear about such a massive loss that is pretty bad. I presume you have FOWLR since you treated in the display tank?

[02tts]

Originally Posted by farfromsea

I thought velvet usually kills within 24H onset of symptoms so if it was really fast could be the cause. CP I did not think was the drug of choice for velvet or brook but someone will reply soon I'm sure. Sorry to hear about such a massive loss that is pretty bad. I presume you have FOWLR since you treated in the display tank?

Thanks. Yes it's a fowlr. The clown which was alive this am from the video is dead now when I got home. The rapid development as well as symptoms is what leads me to either of the two causes.

Need a disease expert to jump in but to me it's seems like one of the two.

If so, I'm guessing 72 days without any fish?


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[02tts]

Any thoughts folks?


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[02tts]

Originally Posted by Triggerfish

Flavobacterium columnare?

Hmmm. Description fits based on what I read up on it. So it's possible. Do you know if going fishless for 72 days will cause bacteria die off or does this need to be treated with copper sulfate or other medication?


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[Khazmodain]

I suspect brook over velvet. Velvet is a quicker killer and doesn't look stringy like it appeared in the video. You mentioned that you treated with CP which seemed to alleviate symptoms but eventually they returned... what level did you dose at?

[Deinonych]

Looks like brook to me: heavy respiration and a sloughing of the slime coat. Sorry for your losses. If you have a microscope you can confirm with a skin scrape.


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[Deinonych]

By the way, how old is this tank? The rock doesn't seem to have any coralline growth on it.

[02tts]

Originally Posted by Khazmodain

I suspect brook over velvet. Velvet is a quicker killer and doesn't look stringy like it appeared in the video. You mentioned that you treated with CP which seemed to alleviate symptoms but eventually they returned... what level did you dose at?

CP was treated at 40mg per gallon.


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[02tts]

Originally Posted by Deinonych

By the way, how old is this tank? The rock doesn't seem to have any coralline growth on it.

7 month old tank.


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[02tts]

Will going fishless for 72-90 days cause any of the brook or velvet to die off, assuming it's either.


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[Khazmodain]

Originally Posted by 02tts

CP was treated at 40mg per gallon.


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I think that's your issue. 40mg/g is more of a prophylactic dose for quarantine, 80mg/g is for treating an active outbreak.

Fallow periods are:
ich: 72-76 days depending on who you ask
velvet: 8 weeks
brook: 6 weeks

After a velvet outbreak I let my display go fallow for 76 days.. I figured there wasn't too much of a difference between waiting an additional 3 weeks at that point with the added benefit of eliminating any ich that was in the system.

[tassod]

Drain, sterilize, refill - done in one weekend.

Why bother wasting time waiting weeks? At least this way you will have piece of mind whatever caused this will be killed where as with going fallow it is never 100% certainty.

[jah hoeva]

^I agree. If its a FOWLR and they all passed, I'd just sterilize and reset.

[Deinonych]

Originally Posted by tassod

Drain, sterilize, refill - done in one weekend.

Why bother wasting time waiting weeks? At least this way you will have piece of mind whatever caused this will be killed where as with going fallow it is never 100% certainty.

I agree. The key is to make sure everything is thoroughly dry for a minimum of 24 hours. Nothing can survive complete desiccation.

[02tts]

Ok what's the sterilization process for the rocks...take them out and bleach them?

Damn, that's going to be a lot of water...500G worth


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[Khazmodain]

My system is also 500g. That's why I didn't go the sterilizing route. I assume you also have cycled rocks and maybe a cleanup crew? On a small tank I absolutely agree that sterilizing is quick and easy and would recommended that approach. On 500g I think it's too much work. I took the fallow approach when I was in this situation. While waiting I set up quarantine tanks and was able to start acquiring livestock and began prophylactic treatments in qt tanks. To give yourself some peace of mind with the fallow method you could also hit the tank with a heavier CP dose as well.

[Deinonych]

Since it was most likely Brooklynella, I would dose the tank with formalin instead of CP if going the fallow route. Formalin is easier to come by, and it's the gold standard for eliminating Brook. By the way, 6 weeks is the standard fallow period for Brook. Brooklynella hostilis does not have a complex life cycle like Cryptocaryon or Amyloodinium; it reproduces by binary fission only.

[02tts]

Originally Posted by Deinonych

Since it was most likely Brooklynella, I would dose the tank with formalin instead of CP if going the fallow route. Formalin is easier to come by, and it's the gold standard for eliminating Brook. By the way, 6 weeks is the standard fallow period for Brook. Brooklynella hostilis does not have a complex life cycle like Cryptocaryon or Amyloodinium; it reproduces by binary fission only.

Perfect, where can I get some formalin and what's the dosage?

Emptying the tank, removing the rocks, live sand, etc...too much work and way too much water and salt mix


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[02tts]

Originally Posted by Khazmodain

My system is also 500g. That's why I didn't go the sterilizing route. I assume you also have cycled rocks and maybe a cleanup crew? On a small tank I absolutely agree that sterilizing is quick and easy and would recommended that approach. On 500g I think it's too much work. I took the fallow approach when I was in this situation. While waiting I set up quarantine tanks and was able to start acquiring livestock and began prophylactic treatments in qt tanks. To give yourself some peace of mind with the fallow method you could also hit the tank with a heavier CP dose as well.

What issue did you run into with your tank?


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[Deinonych]

Originally Posted by 02tts

Perfect, where can I get some formalin and what's the dosage?

Emptying the tank, removing the rocks, live sand, etc...too much work and way too much water and salt mix


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https://www.petsolutions.com/C/Exter...rmalin-MS.aspx

Just follow the dosing directions on the package.