let's build the ultimate 500gal reef tank... - Page 4

H20ENG · 06/03/2009, 04:46 PM

Troylee,
Nice work there. I agree about the overflow teeth though. I'd open it up or use a removable comb.

Whenever I spec a tank, I ask that the teeth do NOT go to the top of the tank, just in case they get clogged. I always leave a 1/2-1" from the top.

Dont you wish you would have cut those overflow slots before you glued it all up, so you could have roundover-ed the inside too? I hate when I do stuff like that!

Oh, well, you will build another tank I'm sure. Like chips, cant just do one

Oh, and on your false wall for the pump idea, just make up a box that you can wedge in there. This way its not permanent and you can play with it til you get what you want. Yes, I've glued in stuff that I wish I hadnt

Try to leave it as removeable as possible in case you want to change it later.

Lookin good,
Chris

troylee · 06/03/2009, 05:01 PM

I thought about no teeth but was afraid of kamakazi creatures...lol.. how do you prevent this problem????I couldn't get any feed back so I just did it lol.....I can still trim them down no biggie with a router from the back if needed......once the overflow box is on thou its pretty much a done deal....

H20ENG · 06/03/2009, 05:17 PM

10-4. I use egg crate covered with 1/4" mesh, or the gutter guard bolted to a pre fit piece of acrylic. I like to drill holes and use nylon bolts to mount them. If you get real fancy you can mount brackets to the back side that the strainers slide into. Bolts are much easier to fab and take about 10 seconds longer to service.

H20ENG · 06/03/2009, 05:20 PM

Didnt catch what solvent you are using to actually build the tank. Or are you using that 42 gun?

I know they changed the formulation of 3 and 4 awhile back, but havent had to buy any for awhile, so not sure how different it works from the old stuff...

Thought about getting bulk MC and glacial acid like James, but I go through phases of fabrication, then none for awhile. Not sure of the shelf life. Easier right now for me to buy solvent. Custom mixes are incredible to work with though!!

troylee · 06/03/2009, 05:25 PM

Hmm..... I thought about using the enka mat I mesh my skimmers with......no biggie I will route the tops of the teeth off tomorrow........as for doing the slots first ya it would have been easier to route but I was still debating the overflow and was stuck for a week lol.....my tank just sat there while I read and read and finnaly I just gave up and starting builing and figured it would come to me like it did....... as for the false wall I was thinking about just gluing in four blocks of 1/2 acrylic like 1" long and drilling and tapping them to hold the false wall with 4 nylon screws that way down the road if I get some vortech's or tunze or something I can make a new piece to cover them nicely and just swap it out in the tank with 4 screws...hmm dunno......lol

troylee · 06/03/2009, 05:42 PM

I used weldon#3 solvent for gluing the four sides together then I chickened out on the eurobrace and used the 42 on it.....hope it holds lol...I have never used 42 on a tank build yet I was gonna use it for the bottom 2 since its to much of a run for one guy around a 24ft perimeter with solvent......I have done numerous test and have found the solvents to be the best for strength by far.......I know they build them huge musem tanks and such with 42 so we will see how it goes....fingers crossed...lol...I don't have a big oven to bake the glue so I can't get the full strength of it.....I talked to beverly over at ips. And she said just clean it good with denature alcohol and glue it up there won't be any problems she said.......I hope not....

troylee · 06/03/2009, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by customcolor
now i see that you cut your surface skimming to about 1/4 of what it could be with out those teeth in there. if you took those teeth out then you can have a really thin layer of water going over smoothly and beable to have more flow coming from your sump.

The reason for the teeth was I wanna have as close as possible to 2000gph threw my sump....I originally planned just a 1/4" slit down the back but I figured this wouldn't provide enough flow so I went the route I did.......thanks for the heads up thou.....tomorrow the mods will begin lol.....I will slice a 1/2" off the top....

H20ENG · 06/03/2009, 06:20 PM

I dont think you will be sorry cutting the teeth down.

At least you used the 42 on the top and not the bottom. I'm sure it will be fine, you are not using thin material.

Have you noticed a change in the way #3 works since the reformulation? You use enough of it that you could probably tell moreso than most DIYers. I've used up several gallons over many years, but you probably use it every day.

troylee · 06/03/2009, 06:32 PM

I wanns use the 42 on the bottom to

lol....its one of those things ya know beauty over strength lol.......I'm not confortable using the solvent on the bottom because I'm pretty sure by the time I get around the whole tank and set it in place I will get bubbles and they drive me nuts even thou there is just a few here and there and the strength isn't really jepordized by it just looks.......so I'm really leaning towards the 42 to glue it on.... the tank is 3/4" all the way around except the 2 ends are 1" thick so solvents get real hard to use.......as for the change in the solvent I haven't really noticed any difference in it the number3 anyways......

uncleof6 · 06/03/2009, 10:12 PM

Troylee, I would cut those teeth out completely, the teeth are going to kill your flow. The water really won't start flowing till over the top of the teeth, and then you have defeated the purpose in the first place. Kamakazi fish sometimes, but not usually with a thin film of water over the weir. and jumpers will hit the top OUCH, snickers.

Jim

troylee · 06/03/2009, 10:21 PM

Ok let me ask you this thou.....let's say I make the slit a 1/4" wide and 5ft long will this provide me around 2000gph of flow?????it don't seem like it will but I have no clue that's why the cut outs are 1.25 wide.......if I leave those slits open everything will go out the back lol........

H20ENG · 06/03/2009, 10:57 PM

You cant round up a few guys in the shop to help shoot the solvent? I'll have my wife help me out when doing the bottom of a tank, or a large sump. Checking the edges and making sure I dont forget a pin

I use a bigger needle most of the time. I forget the size .020 maybe, but its a yellow base. Makes a huge difference when time is a factor

I even have a really big one for really laying it on, purple based needle. I use this bottle for mixing shavings and solvent for a little thicker mix. Not 16 thick but it helps lay in the corners for tiny gaps and whatnot.

Like I said, you are using good thick material, and prepping it well, the 42 should be fine. I'd try to solvent it if you can though.

uncleof6 · 06/03/2009, 10:57 PM

Hummmm well let me see, that slit would have 15 sq. in. area, and a 1.5" pipe has around 1.77 sq. in area. The 1.5" will flow 2100 gph. maybe more depending on various factors. 1/4" might be cutting it a bit close, maybe a half inch.... My weir is 1" down on a rimless tank. ( I trust the drain design.) I don't put jumpers in the tank. The weir is 58" long.

Ehhhh FWIW,

Jim

troylee · 06/03/2009, 11:03 PM

Sounds good jim...I apreciate the help man.......ill see what I can whip up tomorrow to cure the problem and make it still look good....

troylee · 06/04/2009, 07:21 AM

ok this was what i came up with and need to know if this is good before i route the teeth out......i made a fully adjustable wier via 2 blocks i glued on top of the wier and drilled and tapped half way through then i drilled the top of the tank and tapped it so can i adjust the wall up and down by tightening or loosening the bolts on top of the tank should this do the trick for surface skimming?????

troylee · 06/04/2009, 09:21 AM

Waiting for answers jim, h20, or custom color is this ideal?????

uncleof6 · 06/04/2009, 09:43 AM

Don't know, never did an adjustable weir. But to show you twisted minds think alike, the thought crossed my mind. I suspect you are breaking new ground here......at least on this scale. current aquapods 7051 and 7052 have "adjustable" weirs, never looked at one.

Jim

troylee · 06/04/2009, 09:47 AM

so will this serve me better than the teeth????? should i run with it???

for surface skimming anyways?????

troylee · 06/04/2009, 10:09 AM

do we all least agree a wier is better than teeth???? if so i got to get to chopin lol...........

uncleof6 · 06/04/2009, 11:56 PM

we agree that a weir is better than teeth yes. was not knockin your adjustable weir idea, never used one, never tried it. dunno. Sorry to leave you hangin like that.

Jim

troylee · 06/05/2009, 06:46 AM

Never said you did or felt that way bud....

thanks for your help again jim.......it seems really hard to get any feedback these days I got close to 5000 views and 1 person in for the ride and 2 who stoped by for a min..lol.....

dunno

troylee · 06/05/2009, 10:05 AM

well the tank will ofically hold water now....

all thats left on the tank is sanding and polishing

.......getting close.....

vegaskid11 · 06/05/2009, 10:21 AM

Lookin good Lee...

dtech · 06/05/2009, 10:42 AM

Lookin good, I missed the weir discussion but I would say it is better, when I had the Aquapod the adjusting was a pain but when you got it set it was ok. But it gave alot of surface area for stuff to grow on that needed cleaned periodicly.

troylee · 06/05/2009, 10:59 AM

Well the teeth are still there for now.......I run the exact same setup on my current display and I have never had to really clean it off.....it stays clean for the most part since I am very anal about my tank being clean and flawless the first 6 months was a pita since I didn't know what I was doing when I jumped in head first.....let's just say I made a trip to a lfs after I built it and spent 1200$ on a ugf. With 3 powerheads to run it and a cannister filter per there recomendations.....@#$$%^&&^%$$#@! That's the last time I went there....

then I added a sump and skimmer and all the crap after it was stocked I even drilled it for the overflow full lol......that's why I have been going slow motion on this tank and doing tons of research so I only got to do it once.....

06/03/2009, 10:12 PM	#85
uncleof6 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: AWOL Posts: 12,013	Troylee, I would cut those teeth out completely, the teeth are going to kill your flow. The water really won't start flowing till over the top of the teeth, and then you have defeated the purpose in the first place. Kamakazi fish sometimes, but not usually with a thin film of water over the weir. and jumpers will hit the top OUCH, snickers. Jim __________________ "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." (oft attributed to Einstein; most likely paraphrasing by Roger Sessions; compactly articulates the principle of Occam's Razor) Current Tank Info: 325 6' wide Reef

06/03/2009, 10:57 PM	#88
uncleof6 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: AWOL Posts: 12,013	Hummmm well let me see, that slit would have 15 sq. in. area, and a 1.5" pipe has around 1.77 sq. in area. The 1.5" will flow 2100 gph. maybe more depending on various factors. 1/4" might be cutting it a bit close, maybe a half inch.... My weir is 1" down on a rimless tank. ( I trust the drain design.) I don't put jumpers in the tank. The weir is 58" long. Ehhhh FWIW, Jim __________________ "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." (oft attributed to Einstein; most likely paraphrasing by Roger Sessions; compactly articulates the principle of Occam's Razor) Current Tank Info: 325 6' wide Reef

06/04/2009, 09:43 AM	#92
uncleof6 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: AWOL Posts: 12,013	Don't know, never did an adjustable weir. But to show you twisted minds think alike, the thought crossed my mind. I suspect you are breaking new ground here......at least on this scale. current aquapods 7051 and 7052 have "adjustable" weirs, never looked at one. Jim __________________ "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." (oft attributed to Einstein; most likely paraphrasing by Roger Sessions; compactly articulates the principle of Occam's Razor) Current Tank Info: 325 6' wide Reef

06/04/2009, 11:56 PM	#95
uncleof6 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: AWOL Posts: 12,013	we agree that a weir is better than teeth yes. was not knockin your adjustable weir idea, never used one, never tried it. dunno. Sorry to leave you hangin like that. Jim __________________ "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." (oft attributed to Einstein; most likely paraphrasing by Roger Sessions; compactly articulates the principle of Occam's Razor) Current Tank Info: 325 6' wide Reef

06/05/2009, 06:46 AM	#96
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	Never said you did or felt that way bud.... thanks for your help again jim.......it seems really hard to get any feedback these days I got close to 5000 views and 1 person in for the ride and 2 who stoped by for a min..lol.....dunno

06/03/2009, 04:46 PM	#76
H20ENG Pro builder/aquarist hack Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: NORCAL (Vacaville, CA) Posts: 5,125	Troylee, Nice work there. I agree about the overflow teeth though. I'd open it up or use a removable comb. Whenever I spec a tank, I ask that the teeth do NOT go to the top of the tank, just in case they get clogged. I always leave a 1/2-1" from the top. Dont you wish you would have cut those overflow slots before you glued it all up, so you could have roundover-ed the inside too? I hate when I do stuff like that! Oh, well, you will build another tank I'm sure. Like chips, cant just do one Oh, and on your false wall for the pump idea, just make up a box that you can wedge in there. This way its not permanent and you can play with it til you get what you want. Yes, I've glued in stuff that I wish I hadnt Try to leave it as removeable as possible in case you want to change it later. Lookin good, Chris

06/03/2009, 05:01 PM	#77
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	I thought about no teeth but was afraid of kamakazi creatures...lol.. how do you prevent this problem????I couldn't get any feed back so I just did it lol.....I can still trim them down no biggie with a router from the back if needed......once the overflow box is on thou its pretty much a done deal....

06/03/2009, 05:17 PM	#78
H20ENG Pro builder/aquarist hack Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: NORCAL (Vacaville, CA) Posts: 5,125	10-4. I use egg crate covered with 1/4" mesh, or the gutter guard bolted to a pre fit piece of acrylic. I like to drill holes and use nylon bolts to mount them. If you get real fancy you can mount brackets to the back side that the strainers slide into. Bolts are much easier to fab and take about 10 seconds longer to service.

06/03/2009, 05:20 PM	#79
H20ENG Pro builder/aquarist hack Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: NORCAL (Vacaville, CA) Posts: 5,125	Didnt catch what solvent you are using to actually build the tank. Or are you using that 42 gun? I know they changed the formulation of 3 and 4 awhile back, but havent had to buy any for awhile, so not sure how different it works from the old stuff... Thought about getting bulk MC and glacial acid like James, but I go through phases of fabrication, then none for awhile. Not sure of the shelf life. Easier right now for me to buy solvent. Custom mixes are incredible to work with though!!

06/03/2009, 05:25 PM	#80
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	Hmm..... I thought about using the enka mat I mesh my skimmers with......no biggie I will route the tops of the teeth off tomorrow........as for doing the slots first ya it would have been easier to route but I was still debating the overflow and was stuck for a week lol.....my tank just sat there while I read and read and finnaly I just gave up and starting builing and figured it would come to me like it did....... as for the false wall I was thinking about just gluing in four blocks of 1/2 acrylic like 1" long and drilling and tapping them to hold the false wall with 4 nylon screws that way down the road if I get some vortech's or tunze or something I can make a new piece to cover them nicely and just swap it out in the tank with 4 screws...hmm dunno......lol

06/03/2009, 05:42 PM	#81
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	I used weldon#3 solvent for gluing the four sides together then I chickened out on the eurobrace and used the 42 on it.....hope it holds lol...I have never used 42 on a tank build yet I was gonna use it for the bottom 2 since its to much of a run for one guy around a 24ft perimeter with solvent......I have done numerous test and have found the solvents to be the best for strength by far.......I know they build them huge musem tanks and such with 42 so we will see how it goes....fingers crossed...lol...I don't have a big oven to bake the glue so I can't get the full strength of it.....I talked to beverly over at ips. And she said just clean it good with denature alcohol and glue it up there won't be any problems she said.......I hope not....

06/03/2009, 06:20 PM	#83
H20ENG Pro builder/aquarist hack Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: NORCAL (Vacaville, CA) Posts: 5,125	I dont think you will be sorry cutting the teeth down. At least you used the 42 on the top and not the bottom. I'm sure it will be fine, you are not using thin material. Have you noticed a change in the way #3 works since the reformulation? You use enough of it that you could probably tell moreso than most DIYers. I've used up several gallons over many years, but you probably use it every day.

06/03/2009, 06:32 PM	#84
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	I wanns use the 42 on the bottom to lol....its one of those things ya know beauty over strength lol.......I'm not confortable using the solvent on the bottom because I'm pretty sure by the time I get around the whole tank and set it in place I will get bubbles and they drive me nuts even thou there is just a few here and there and the strength isn't really jepordized by it just looks.......so I'm really leaning towards the 42 to glue it on.... the tank is 3/4" all the way around except the 2 ends are 1" thick so solvents get real hard to use.......as for the change in the solvent I haven't really noticed any difference in it the number3 anyways......

06/03/2009, 10:21 PM	#86
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	Ok let me ask you this thou.....let's say I make the slit a 1/4" wide and 5ft long will this provide me around 2000gph of flow?????it don't seem like it will but I have no clue that's why the cut outs are 1.25 wide.......if I leave those slits open everything will go out the back lol........

06/03/2009, 11:03 PM	#89
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	Sounds good jim...I apreciate the help man.......ill see what I can whip up tomorrow to cure the problem and make it still look good....

06/04/2009, 07:21 AM	#90
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	ok this was what i came up with and need to know if this is good before i route the teeth out......i made a fully adjustable wier via 2 blocks i glued on top of the wier and drilled and tapped half way through then i drilled the top of the tank and tapped it so can i adjust the wall up and down by tightening or loosening the bolts on top of the tank should this do the trick for surface skimming?????

06/04/2009, 09:21 AM	#91
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	Waiting for answers jim, h20, or custom color is this ideal?????

06/04/2009, 09:47 AM	#93
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	so will this serve me better than the teeth????? should i run with it??? for surface skimming anyways?????

06/04/2009, 10:09 AM	#94
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	do we all least agree a wier is better than teeth???? if so i got to get to chopin lol...........

06/05/2009, 10:05 AM	#97
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	well the tank will ofically hold water now.... all thats left on the tank is sanding and polishing.......getting close.....

06/05/2009, 10:21 AM	#98
vegaskid11 vegasreefers.com Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 742	Lookin good Lee...

06/05/2009, 10:42 AM	#99
dtech Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Englewood, co Posts: 519	Lookin good, I missed the weir discussion but I would say it is better, when I had the Aquapod the adjusting was a pain but when you got it set it was ok. But it gave alot of surface area for stuff to grow on that needed cleaned periodicly.

06/05/2009, 10:59 AM	#100
troylee Moved On Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: here. Posts: 2,509	Well the teeth are still there for now.......I run the exact same setup on my current display and I have never had to really clean it off.....it stays clean for the most part since I am very anal about my tank being clean and flawless the first 6 months was a pita since I didn't know what I was doing when I jumped in head first.....let's just say I made a trip to a lfs after I built it and spent 1200$ on a ugf. With 3 powerheads to run it and a cannister filter per there recomendations.....@#$$%^&&^%$$#@! That's the last time I went there.... then I added a sump and skimmer and all the crap after it was stocked I even drilled it for the overflow full lol......that's why I have been going slow motion on this tank and doing tons of research so I only got to do it once.....