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Old 06/16/2019, 03:27 AM   #251
ThRoewer
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Originally Posted by McPuff View Post
I have not seen the bumblebee snails go after any other types of snails. They are MUCH smaller in my tank so I don't know if that matters or not. I assume they will go after some other fan worms, etc. Maybe not. I'll have to check those as I know I've got some patches of those tiny fan worms, etc.

The bumblebee snails are super slow. I rarely see them move at all. Guessing the larger snails would easily escape them or at least not get killed by them.
One LFS told me that bumblebees go after corals. Did you notice them do that?

In my tank, the vermetid snails are likely the better food source because I have the rocks covered with little ones and I'm just starting with corals.

BTW, has anyone ever tried small puffers like the figure-8 puffer (Dichotomyctere ocellatus)? Are they going after vermetid snails?


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Old 06/16/2019, 06:24 AM   #252
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I tried the Toby,was good until one day he started to like
Ps and zoos and lps
But where do you find the figure 8 puffer?


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Old 06/16/2019, 12:17 PM   #253
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Originally Posted by Isayso View Post
...
But where do you find the figure 8 puffer?
I would think Petco, PetSmart, LiveAquaria, or many LFS with freshwater department might have them.
They are usually sold as freshwater or brackish fish but they are actually saltwater fish.

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Pairs: 4 percula, 3 P. kauderni, 3 D. excisus, 1 ea of P. diacanthus, S. splendidus, C. altivelis O. rosenblatti, D. janssi, S. yasha & a Gramma loreto trio
3 P. diacanthus. 2 C. starcki

Current Tank Info: 200 gal 4 tank system (40x28x24 + 40B + 40B sump tank + 20g refugium) + 30x18x18 mixed reef + 20g East Pacific biotop + 20g FW +...
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Old 06/17/2019, 07:29 AM   #254
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Originally Posted by ThRoewer View Post
One LFS told me that bumblebees go after corals. Did you notice them do that?

In my tank, the vermetid snails are likely the better food source because I have the rocks covered with little ones and I'm just starting with corals.

BTW, has anyone ever tried small puffers like the figure-8 puffer (Dichotomyctere ocellatus)? Are they going after vermetid snails?
No, I've never seen them on a coral. Haven't heard of them eating corals before either but I suppose it's possible if they don't have the preferred food source... possibly someone bought them because they liked the look but didn't actually have vermetids in the tank.


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Old 06/17/2019, 10:47 AM   #255
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No, I've never seen them on a coral. Haven't heard of them eating corals before either but I suppose it's possible if they don't have the preferred food source... possibly someone bought them because they liked the look but didn't actually have vermetids in the tank.
Well, I'm gonna give bumblebees a shot.
Right now I certainly have far more vermetids than corals in my tank. I fear most of the vermetids in my tank are babies of the really large kind, so I want to fight them while they are still small. I actually spent a good deal of time to go over the rocks and snap all the large ones off but the small ones were just too many and it too secluded spaces.


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3 P. diacanthus. 2 C. starcki

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Old 06/17/2019, 12:36 PM   #256
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I have seen a few different type of Vermetid snails so I wonder if bumblebee snails only can eat certain types or size? I have seen Vermetid snails with very small tubes while others are very large.


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Old 06/18/2019, 06:09 AM   #257
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Good luck with all of this..These things are terrible. I had to nuke a tank because of all of them. Was so tired of them being EVERYWHERE!


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Old 06/18/2019, 06:29 AM   #258
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I have seen a few different type of Vermetid snails so I wonder if bumblebee snails only can eat certain types or size? I have seen Vermetid snails with very small tubes while others are very large.
Correct. I haven't seen them go for the large vermetids and I assume they won't unless supply of small guys becomes quite low. Good thing is that the large ones are easy to kill by hand and are not as numerous. I believe they are a different species.


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Old 06/25/2019, 04:31 PM   #259
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i think i might give the 8line puffer a go. rock and tank jist sitting there in my basement

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Old 06/27/2019, 01:31 PM   #260
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Originally Posted by McPuff View Post
... Good thing is that the large ones are easy to kill by hand and are not as numerous. I believe they are a different species.
They are Ceraesignum maximum (formerly Dendropoma maximum) and by my experience they can get quite numerous and are not as easy to kill as you may think, at least not in a fully stocked tank.
It seems they are affected by a pathogen that kills them very targeted. Unfortunately it's nothing you could easily get.

I've employed a few bumble bee snails for the little ones and plan on training a couple of figure 8 puffers to go after the large ones.


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Pairs: 4 percula, 3 P. kauderni, 3 D. excisus, 1 ea of P. diacanthus, S. splendidus, C. altivelis O. rosenblatti, D. janssi, S. yasha & a Gramma loreto trio
3 P. diacanthus. 2 C. starcki

Current Tank Info: 200 gal 4 tank system (40x28x24 + 40B + 40B sump tank + 20g refugium) + 30x18x18 mixed reef + 20g East Pacific biotop + 20g FW +...
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Old 07/19/2019, 12:56 PM   #261
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You can tell that you need do dose more when algae starts growing on your glass again.

My experiences are with commercial and personal tanks. In all cases, these are ULN systems and the filtration is able to keep up with the die off. with that in mind, you donít want to hit your tank hard with a strong dose up front. Rather, you want to slowly introduce this medication. It will absolutely work provided you donít do this too quickly. Your first sign that the CP is working is that you stop having to clean the glass so often. All algae dies off, snails and worms die off too. If you have a mature tank with lots of worms, then they are going to increase your risk of an ammonia spike.

Now if you detect ammonia with a test kit, then dose amquel. Both products are compatible.

So the truly difficult part is taking this slow while knowing it will work as long as the die off doesnít all happen overnight. Since I donít know your tank, I would advise to go ultra slow with 10% of the typical dose added to your tank once per week over a period of up to 10 weeks. The first three weeks you will know if your filtration system can handle the snail the die off. Just keep dosing 10% per week eventually it will kick in. You probably wonít even need to get up to go the full 10 weeks. When all the snails are dead, just leave the med in the tank for another month and enjoy the algae free and snail free look of you new tank. Then introduce carbon and water changes.

To minimize risk, I would not turn off your skimmer at any point and I would also plan to change out your filter socks every couple of days.

Note that the commercial (LFS) tanks and personal tank are all relatively new tanks where CP was planned for from the beginning. The LFS tanks are given small maintenance doses every two weeks or so when the glass starts to show an algae haze. If your tank is mature with lots of worms then you could have die off just like if you dosed prazipro in your DT. Both are safe with caution but you have to go slowly. Both will kill all the worms in your tank and ammonia may become an issue so tastyfishís story is something to be concerned about. Manually remove all the regular snails and worms you can find with a fish net going through the sand.
Per the Ick-shield powder instructions it suggests that reef lights should be off during dosing, if it's dosed over such a long period is it ok to keep lights on as normal?

Just waiting on amquel delivery next week, then the nuking will begin, moving my corals this weekend to QT tank along with shrimp will post picks on progress as this is the only way I see this vermin being eliminated.


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Old 07/22/2019, 04:41 PM   #262
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Okay i only skimmed the thread but has the use of lasers been talked about? I have a 445nm 5mw cheap ebay laser i have successfully used to kill many many vermetid's.

It obviously does not wipe out the entire population but keeps in check and also keeps them from spreading when you cook them with the laser.

For a while i had several dozen and after using the laser have not seen any in months but i do expect to need to zap more in the future.


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Old 07/23/2019, 06:29 AM   #263
giz1007
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Update:
My tank is free of them as I can see. Once my tank started showing no ammonia again I ran carbon and started a couple of larger water changes. This was at about 9 -10 days after initial treatment. I put a sacrificial monti frag in after about 3 days of running carbon. 3 days after that i noticed no I'll affects so I started adding the rest of my frags. All frags have been returned to the DT and all are doing great. I've continued to run carbon throughout just to be safe.

Once water changes started and carbon was added algae came back fast. Lots of nutrients available now. Just seems to be a green film type. Thankfully no hair algae yet. I've yet to add any snails back as I've given all a scrub with a wire brush and have them in quarantine to make sure there is no more vermetid growth. My two maxima clams have been scrubbed and await their return to the DT as well.

So far so good. Hopefully things continue on the right track.
Hey RC, Did you get rid of the vermetid's and what did you take enough precaution to prevent they're reentry to the cleaned DT?


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Old 07/24/2019, 12:35 PM   #264
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Hey RC, Did you get rid of the vermetid's and what did you take enough precaution to prevent they're reentry to the cleaned DT?
Unfortunately it did not eliminate the vermetid snails. They are still present to this day but are much less in number. Not sure if this is due to tank maturity or if something else has played a role in their decline.


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Old 07/25/2019, 07:57 AM   #265
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Unfortunately it did not eliminate the vermetid snails. They are still present to this day but are much less in number. Not sure if this is due to tank maturity or if something else has played a role in their decline.
Thanks


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Old 07/25/2019, 09:37 AM   #266
giz1007
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Originally Posted by ReefKeeper64 View Post
You can tell that you need do dose more when algae starts growing on your glass again.

My experiences are with commercial and personal tanks. In all cases, these are ULN systems and the filtration is able to keep up with the die off. with that in mind, you donít want to hit your tank hard with a strong dose up front. Rather, you want to slowly introduce this medication. It will absolutely work provided you donít do this too quickly. Your first sign that the CP is working is that you stop having to clean the glass so often. All algae dies off, snails and worms die off too. If you have a mature tank with lots of worms, then they are going to increase your risk of an ammonia spike.

Now if you detect ammonia with a test kit, then dose amquel. Both products are compatible.

So the truly difficult part is taking this slow while knowing it will work as long as the die off doesnít all happen overnight. Since I donít know your tank, I would advise to go ultra slow with 10% of the typical dose added to your tank once per week over a period of up to 10 weeks. The first three weeks you will know if your filtration system can handle the snail the die off. Just keep dosing 10% per week eventually it will kick in. You probably wonít even need to get up to go the full 10 weeks. When all the snails are dead, just leave the med in the tank for another month and enjoy the algae free and snail free look of you new tank. Then introduce carbon and water changes.

To minimize risk, I would not turn off your skimmer at any point and I would also plan to change out your filter socks every couple of days.

Note that the commercial (LFS) tanks and personal tank are all relatively new tanks where CP was planned for from the beginning. The LFS tanks are given small maintenance doses every two weeks or so when the glass starts to show an algae haze. If your tank is mature with lots of worms then you could have die off just like if you dosed prazipro in your DT. Both are safe with caution but you have to go slowly. Both will kill all the worms in your tank and ammonia may become an issue so tastyfishís story is something to be concerned about. Manually remove all the regular snails and worms you can find with a fish net going through the sand.
Do u keep reef lights off for total period, (ie) looks like 3 1/2 months?
how do the fish cope in black out situation for so long?
I've read about CP not being good for certain types of fish - Hippo's and Anthias / 6 line rasses etc.. of course all the types I have in my display!!!

great thread, planning to do a dose of ICk shield powder but worried it won't work?


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Old 07/25/2019, 03:07 PM   #267
ThRoewer
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Bacteria will degrade CP (and many other medications) rather quickly as this study on Praziquantel (the active ingredient of PraziPro) shows: Praziquantel degradation in marine aquarium water
Similar observations have been made with CP, so its use in an established tank is rather questionable.


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Pairs: 4 percula, 3 P. kauderni, 3 D. excisus, 1 ea of P. diacanthus, S. splendidus, C. altivelis O. rosenblatti, D. janssi, S. yasha & a Gramma loreto trio
3 P. diacanthus. 2 C. starcki

Current Tank Info: 200 gal 4 tank system (40x28x24 + 40B + 40B sump tank + 20g refugium) + 30x18x18 mixed reef + 20g East Pacific biotop + 20g FW +...
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