Need advice, tiny emperor angel

frankie33 · 04/12/2007, 12:53 PM

I just received an emperor angel from liveaquaria. I know I ordered a small, but this guy is TINY, like 1.5". Right now he's in a 10gal quarantine. I was wondering if you guys think after the quarantine period i should add some more live rock and keep him in there until he gets a bit bigger. The main tank is 150gal community, with a yellow tang, purple tank, coral beauty and a pair of false percs. Also, there are some hermits and a reef lobster about 4" long. I'm a little worried about him being so small and being eaten by the lobster or bullied by the other much larger fish. I've taped pic.'s of emp's around the tank, with little reaction from the other fish... any advice is much appreciated!

jim48 · 04/12/2007, 01:34 PM

You could keep him in the quarantine tank until he grows a bit, but if you add live rock to the tank the live rock will most likely raise the ammonia levels temporarily until it cures properly. That could be dangerous in a 10 gallon tank.

frankie33 · 04/12/2007, 01:42 PM

even rock from the main tank?

jim48 · 04/12/2007, 01:50 PM

No, if you have rock that is already cured you would be fine.

thor32766 · 04/12/2007, 05:48 PM

I dont think he will have a problem, they are called emperors for a reason. they are a tough fish.

DamnPepShrimp · 04/12/2007, 08:21 PM

They are tough fish. But being that small it may be a problem. They like to be the boss fish. I've read that if they aren't it is very stressful to them. My emperor isn't the biggest fish in the tank but he is definitely boss. I would maybe add him to the display, see how he gets along with the others. If there is a problem, use eggcrate to divide the aggressors away from the emperor until everyone gets used to each other. Also before adding, rearrange some live rock to disturb everyone's territory. I would be most worried about the tangs, although being that small, every fish may pose a threat. I don't know what to say about the lobster, I've had a freshwater lobster kill a baby peacock bass once. Didn't think it would happen, but I guess I was wrong. Maybe move the lobster to your sump or something.

Oh yeah, DON'T keep him in the 10g, only for QT purposes. Even though he is small, he needs room to swim and grow.

Jerry W · 04/12/2007, 10:00 PM

I think quarantining this fish is a good idea, and would suggest against adding it to the display tank. Tiny angels such as this are often poor risks. Buying them in the 3-4 inch range is safer, but it is what it is. If the 10 gallon is well established and stable, adding some small pieces of LR for shelter and grazing would be fine. Get the fish eating a variety of foods, keep up with water changes, etc.. These are not fast growing fish so you may do well to keep the angel in QT for several months. At some point, the tank divider might workwell, simply to allow the angel to adjust to the DT unmolested. You could cordone off maybe 1/4 of the tank just for the angel. Given the fish you're keeping, I'd suggest upgrading your QT to at least a 20 long or even a 40 breeder. If you ever need to quarnatine a large angel or tang, a 10 isn't going to cut it.

techigirl78 · 04/13/2007, 12:46 PM

If you do add the angel to the main in the near future, I'd definitely move the lobster until the fish gets bigger.

jnc914 · 04/13/2007, 11:50 PM

Your Emp. is too at risk of injury or death at that size. He will grw relatively quick, but you have several well established semi-aggressive specimens will not be happy by the new addition. Your CBA will definately harrass the new addition. Even though they are a less aggressive species, every CBA I have owned has been aggressive to fish similar in size and color. I bought my Emp. at around the 3" and he was one of the first fish in the tank. He is now 5.5 " and going through his color change. He is the boss of the tank, and keeps the other fish in line if there is show of agression. Good Luck with you new Emp., try to find a larger stock tank 20-30 gallons if you are going to keep him separated until he grows. A 10 gallon QT s too small, even with established live rock, etc

frankie33 · 04/16/2007, 11:26 AM

Thanks for all of the advice! He's not eating out of the water column yet. But he will eat any frozen food put in the nori clip. He's very active as well. I'm liking the idea of seperating the main display.

danorth · 04/16/2007, 01:46 PM

Those little dudes are bullet proof in my experiences. I would do a 20 gallon tank at least for month, 10 is too dramatic in change. Just get some good live rock in there and a cleaner shrimp. I love cleaner shrimps, they are like a baby blanket to fish it seems.....makes them feel at home.

frankie33 · 04/16/2007, 02:10 PM

yeah, it seems he's expecting one. i put a hermit crab in there and he was begging it to clean him! wouldn't leave it alone so i took it out!

markandkristen · 04/22/2007, 08:49 AM

i put my tiny emperor in my 90 before i had upgraded to the 150. he was like 1/12 inches as well. i had three tangs as well. the tangs never even looked at him. thats a good idea of doing the quarantine. you could also plumb the 10-20 gallon into your 150 for stability.

ralphie16 · 04/23/2007, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by markandkristen
thats a good idea of doing the quarantine. you could also plumb the 10-20 gallon into your 150 for stability.

defeats the purpose of a QT

LisaD · 04/23/2007, 12:15 PM

but it does NOT defeat the purpose of a grow out tank, and can help maintain better water quality. I'm thinking the suggestion was to plumb the tank in to the big system AFTER a QT period.

04/12/2007, 12:53 PM	#1
frankie33 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: mid-no-where, NY Posts: 102	Need advice, tiny emperor angel I just received an emperor angel from liveaquaria. I know I ordered a small, but this guy is TINY, like 1.5". Right now he's in a 10gal quarantine. I was wondering if you guys think after the quarantine period i should add some more live rock and keep him in there until he gets a bit bigger. The main tank is 150gal community, with a yellow tang, purple tank, coral beauty and a pair of false percs. Also, there are some hermits and a reef lobster about 4" long. I'm a little worried about him being so small and being eaten by the lobster or bullied by the other much larger fish. I've taped pic.'s of emp's around the tank, with little reaction from the other fish... any advice is much appreciated!

04/12/2007, 05:48 PM	#5
thor32766 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Chuluota, FL Posts: 6,072	I dont think he will have a problem, they are called emperors for a reason. they are a tough fish. __________________ "Live your life so no one has to lie about who you were at your funeral" click on my red house to see my tang compound! Current Tank Info: 29 gallon in Wall!

04/12/2007, 10:00 PM	#7
Jerry W Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: PA. Posts: 2,873	I think quarantining this fish is a good idea, and would suggest against adding it to the display tank. Tiny angels such as this are often poor risks. Buying them in the 3-4 inch range is safer, but it is what it is. If the 10 gallon is well established and stable, adding some small pieces of LR for shelter and grazing would be fine. Get the fish eating a variety of foods, keep up with water changes, etc.. These are not fast growing fish so you may do well to keep the angel in QT for several months. At some point, the tank divider might workwell, simply to allow the angel to adjust to the DT unmolested. You could cordone off maybe 1/4 of the tank just for the angel. Given the fish you're keeping, I'd suggest upgrading your QT to at least a 20 long or even a 40 breeder. If you ever need to quarnatine a large angel or tang, a 10 isn't going to cut it. __________________ Americans sleep peacefully in their beds at night because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. Current Tank Info: 37 gal; pair of mocha clowns, ywg and tiger pistol shrimp

04/13/2007, 11:50 PM	#9
jnc914 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 2,008	Your Emp. is too at risk of injury or death at that size. He will grw relatively quick, but you have several well established semi-aggressive specimens will not be happy by the new addition. Your CBA will definately harrass the new addition. Even though they are a less aggressive species, every CBA I have owned has been aggressive to fish similar in size and color. I bought my Emp. at around the 3" and he was one of the first fish in the tank. He is now 5.5 " and going through his color change. He is the boss of the tank, and keeps the other fish in line if there is show of agression. Good Luck with you new Emp., try to find a larger stock tank 20-30 gallons if you are going to keep him separated until he grows. A 10 gallon QT s too small, even with established live rock, etc __________________ "Great things are not accomplished by those who yield to trends and fads and popular opinion." -Jack Kerouac 13 years strictly salty Current Tank Info: 180 gallon FOWLR Angel dedicated tank

04/23/2007, 12:15 PM	#15
LisaD That's not a salmon Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: central North Carolina Posts: 6,986	but it does NOT defeat the purpose of a grow out tank, and can help maintain better water quality. I'm thinking the suggestion was to plumb the tank in to the big system AFTER a QT period. __________________ Keeping saltwater tanks since the late '70s Current Tank Info: tankless at the moment

04/12/2007, 01:34 PM	#2
jim48 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Williamstown, Pa. Posts: 293	You could keep him in the quarantine tank until he grows a bit, but if you add live rock to the tank the live rock will most likely raise the ammonia levels temporarily until it cures properly. That could be dangerous in a 10 gallon tank.

04/12/2007, 01:42 PM	#3
frankie33 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: mid-no-where, NY Posts: 102	even rock from the main tank?

04/12/2007, 01:50 PM	#4
jim48 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Williamstown, Pa. Posts: 293	No, if you have rock that is already cured you would be fine.

04/12/2007, 08:21 PM	#6
DamnPepShrimp Moved On Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Delaware Posts: 5,152	They are tough fish. But being that small it may be a problem. They like to be the boss fish. I've read that if they aren't it is very stressful to them. My emperor isn't the biggest fish in the tank but he is definitely boss. I would maybe add him to the display, see how he gets along with the others. If there is a problem, use eggcrate to divide the aggressors away from the emperor until everyone gets used to each other. Also before adding, rearrange some live rock to disturb everyone's territory. I would be most worried about the tangs, although being that small, every fish may pose a threat. I don't know what to say about the lobster, I've had a freshwater lobster kill a baby peacock bass once. Didn't think it would happen, but I guess I was wrong. Maybe move the lobster to your sump or something. Oh yeah, DON'T keep him in the 10g, only for QT purposes. Even though he is small, he needs room to swim and grow.

04/13/2007, 12:46 PM	#8
techigirl78 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 1,739	If you do add the angel to the main in the near future, I'd definitely move the lobster until the fish gets bigger.

04/16/2007, 11:26 AM	#10
frankie33 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: mid-no-where, NY Posts: 102	Thanks for all of the advice! He's not eating out of the water column yet. But he will eat any frozen food put in the nori clip. He's very active as well. I'm liking the idea of seperating the main display.

04/16/2007, 01:46 PM	#11
danorth Moved On Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: roseville, CA Posts: 3,701	Those little dudes are bullet proof in my experiences. I would do a 20 gallon tank at least for month, 10 is too dramatic in change. Just get some good live rock in there and a cleaner shrimp. I love cleaner shrimps, they are like a baby blanket to fish it seems.....makes them feel at home.

04/16/2007, 02:10 PM	#12
frankie33 Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: mid-no-where, NY Posts: 102	yeah, it seems he's expecting one. i put a hermit crab in there and he was begging it to clean him! wouldn't leave it alone so i took it out!

04/22/2007, 08:49 AM	#13
markandkristen Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Winterhaven, fl Posts: 4,081	i put my tiny emperor in my 90 before i had upgraded to the 150. he was like 1/12 inches as well. i had three tangs as well. the tangs never even looked at him. thats a good idea of doing the quarantine. you could also plumb the 10-20 gallon into your 150 for stability.