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Old 10/15/2015, 06:57 PM   #8776
jason2459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaternoobie View Post
Not to sound stupid but will ask anyways ! Do I need to drill another hole in the glass tank and add a bulkhead and return nozzle ?
You can but I didn't. I just have the PVC go over the top of the rim.


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Current Tank Info: 180g mixed reef w/ a beananimal overflow to a dolomite RRUGF. | 20g long G. Smithii Mantis Tank
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Old 10/15/2015, 06:57 PM   #8777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaternoobie View Post
Not to sound stupid but will ask anyways ! Do I need to drill another hole in the glass tank and add a bulkhead and return nozzle ?
If that is what you want. I went up and over the rim, but this isn't an option to some. I used schedule 80 to go up and over to be more discreet.


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Old 10/15/2015, 07:14 PM   #8778
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Schedule 40 here and used 45 elbows every where
Return on the far left with union





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Old 10/15/2015, 08:37 PM   #8779
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Thanks for all the info ! I appreciate that ! I was only asking as the bean animal is all on drains and not on returns ....granted its simple enough ! One less hole to drill is good in my mind !


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Old 10/15/2015, 11:30 PM   #8780
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Originally Posted by saltwaternoobie View Post
Thanks for all the info ! I appreciate that ! I was only asking as the bean animal is all on drains and not on returns ....granted its simple enough ! One less hole to drill is good in my mind !
Good luck and I hope you have better plumbing skills then I. HA!

As you can see I was very liberal with solvents and miss cut a few times needing couplers and didn't get angles right so had to get another elbow in there... etc. It works and now I'm happy.


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Current Tank Info: 180g mixed reef w/ a beananimal overflow to a dolomite RRUGF. | 20g long G. Smithii Mantis Tank
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Old 10/16/2015, 07:11 AM   #8781
saltwaternoobie
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Originally Posted by jason2459 View Post
Good luck and I hope you have better plumbing skills then I. HA!

As you can see I was very liberal with solvents and miss cut a few times needing couplers and didn't get angles right so had to get another elbow in there... etc. It works and now I'm happy.
I saw that with the solvent , that stuff can be hard to work with once it's assembled you can't turn it ! And really it's underneath so one doesn't see it anyways


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Old 10/17/2015, 10:00 AM   #8782
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Originally Posted by saltwaternoobie View Post
have read lots on this setup and havent found anything on returns , whats the best way to mount a return line from sump to main tank ?
Over the top is fine if you do not want to drill more holes.

I am still a big fan of Oceans Motions wave makers.
http://oceansmotions.com/

As far as I know, Paul is still making and shipping these devices.


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Old 10/17/2015, 10:04 AM   #8783
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I would run the refugium off of an independent pump.
It could also be easily run from a tap off of the return pump. I have used both methods over the years, but to be honest, am not a refugium fan. My lasting impression was that it turned out to be nothing more than a detritus trap and something else to clean and maintain.

Elevate some live rock on your sump so that it can be EASILY cleaned under. Plenty of macro and micro fauna will live there, even in "high" flow. If you want macro algae export, then add a turf scrubber. Just my two cents.


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Old 10/17/2015, 03:27 PM   #8784
saltwaternoobie
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Over the top is fine if you do not want to drill more holes.

I am still a big fan of Oceans Motions wave makers.
http://oceansmotions.com/

As far as I know, Paul is still making and shipping these devices.
Thanks for the advice ! Might drill was wondering how everyone did it with the overflow box !

Will check out the wave makers !


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Old 10/18/2015, 05:52 AM   #8785
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tap, tap, tap

Hello?

Is this thing on?




Quote:
Originally Posted by Rybren View Post
I'm putting together a 120G build with a basement sump. Drop from the tank to the sump will be about 12' and the return pump (Jebao DCS-12000) can deliver ~1100 gph at this height.

From Bean's calculator, I see that a 1" siphon can easily handle this flow. My question relates to the open channel and emergency; I'm not overly concerned about noise, but would 1" handle the flow? I know that I'd be okay with 1 1/2", but I'm trying to keep the hole in the floor to 4"x10" (so that if I move the tank, I can cover it with a hot air return vent) and the return pipe needs to be 1 1/2" or preferably 2"

Thoughts?

Thanks
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As it turns out, I only have a 9" width to play with - the joists are laying on a steel beam and they are doubled-up; one going in each direction. There's no way 4 x 1 1/2" pipe fittings will fit in the space and give me any wiggle room, so I'll be using a 1" siphon line and 1 1/2" open channel, emergency and return.

I've been thinking about using 1 1/2" pvc electrical conduit sweeping elbows to bring the piping through the floor. It should minimize the disruption to the flow and would be a lot easier to plumb in the confined space than a bunch of 45* elbows. I've had one of these elbows in use for 6 years on my current tank, so I think it's safe to say that they are safe.

I guess the other option is to use a short section of spa-flex under the floor, but that stuff really isn't all that flexible.

Ideas/comments/concerns?



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Old 10/18/2015, 07:38 AM   #8786
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Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rybren View Post
tap, tap, tap



Hello?



Is this thing on?




I have a 40b with a 40b basement sump. First I don't think the 12000 will give you the flow you desire at 12'. I'm running that pump and it's sufficient for me but I wish I had more and it's only a 40b! Go with the 15000. As to your question, will 1" plumbing handle it? Yes! It will handle even the 15000 with ease. I have my main siphon closed about 2/3 in order to keep adequate water level in the overflow box and stable tuning. Good luck with your build! Post a link to your thread so I can watch

Also, I came down tight to the outer wall and had a funny jog as soon as I cleared the floor... I used spaflex to remedy this and it worked fine...


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Old 10/18/2015, 09:38 AM   #8787
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Thanks.

Are you running the new DCS-12000 or the older DCT/DC? The flow and energy consumption is supposedly much better and the max head is 6M. According to the Jebao flow charts, the flow at 3.5M is 4800 L/hr. Of course, I do expect it to be somewhat lower in real life. I haven't seen anyone selling a 15000.

No build thread yet, but I'll be tanking down my 75G



and my 10G



and moving everything into the 120G


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Last edited by Rybren; 10/18/2015 at 09:44 AM.
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Old 10/18/2015, 10:59 AM   #8788
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Originally Posted by Rybren View Post
tap, tap, tap

Hello?

Is this thing on?

The pump is likely to be very undersized....

That said, 1" pipe will work, but is not ideal in context to the open channel. The drop is likely to cause lensing as the water drops through the vertical pipe. This will create noise and/or a partial vacuum that may cause instability. For such a small flow, you should be fine. Larger pump... you need a larger open channel for that drop.

The adjustment valve for the siphon should be at the sump end of the standpipe.


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Old 10/18/2015, 01:14 PM   #8789
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Thanks Bean.

My plan is to stick with 1 1/2" for the open channel and emergency and 1" for the siphon. I built a mock-up of my floor and area leading to the sump area. I really struggled with trying to get 4 x 1 1/2 pipes in the space.

Guess I'll need to start looking at a different pump - I haven't purchased anything yet.


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Old 10/18/2015, 01:30 PM   #8790
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Originally Posted by jason2459 View Post
You can but I didn't. I just have the PVC go over the top of the rim.
+1. You can see them on my 40 breeder. I went this route because I wanted to personally control how much water is lost due to back siphon when the power goes out. I figured my 20 long would not be able to hold all the water if it were far enough under water to go through a bulkhead.




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Old 10/18/2015, 06:39 PM   #8791
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Originally Posted by Rybren View Post
Thanks.

Are you running the new DCS-12000 or the older DCT/DC? The flow and energy consumption is supposedly much better and the max head is 6M. According to the Jebao flow charts, the flow at 3.5M is 4800 L/hr. Of course, I do expect it to be somewhat lower in real life. I haven't seen anyone selling a 15000.

No build thread yet, but I'll be tanking down my 75G



and my 10G



and moving everything into the 120G

Mine is the Newer DCT. The 15000 can be ordered on Amazon.com for under $150. Beans next comment about keeping 1.5" is good though! My setup of dead silent upstairs but I do get some minor sound and bubbles at the sump...


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Old 10/18/2015, 07:53 PM   #8792
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Thanks for the info.

I'll take a look at amazon.


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Old 10/19/2015, 06:34 PM   #8793
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Silent and Failsafe Overflow System

So something happened that has been happening recently and wanted to get some opinions.

My bean drain is set so I have just a smidge of water going down the open channel. It's silent.

When I wake up in the mornings the water level is at the top of the open elbow and water is rushing down that drain.

When I shut off the pump the water level rarely, if ever goes back to the level it was prior to the power shutoff. It's mostly always higher.

The outputs are roughly 1" below the water level in the sump with the emergency being about 4" above the water line.

1" bulkheads with 1.5" pvc drains


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Old 10/20/2015, 07:21 AM   #8794
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So something happened that has been happening recently and wanted to get some opinions.

My bean drain is set so I have just a smidge of water going down the open channel. It's silent.

When I wake up in the mornings the water level is at the top of the open elbow and water is rushing down that drain.

When I shut off the pump the water level rarely, if ever goes back to the level it was prior to the power shutoff. It's mostly always higher.

The outputs are roughly 1" below the water level in the sump with the emergency being about 4" above the water line.

1" bulkheads with 1.5" pvc drains
Not sure what happened, but this morning it was fine. last night, shut it off to feed. upon restart, opened valve all the way, then closed all the way, and about 1/4 open found the level, and it just takes some time to purge the air since it's very constricted with the gate valve being 3/4 closed (if not more). I know if a snail gets in there, the water level rises, which usually tells me there's a snail in there.


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Old 10/20/2015, 07:27 AM   #8795
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It could also be easily run from a tap off of the return pump. I have used both methods over the years, but to be honest, am not a refugium fan. My lasting impression was that it turned out to be nothing more than a detritus trap and something else to clean and maintain.

Elevate some live rock on your sump so that it can be EASILY cleaned under. Plenty of macro and micro fauna will live there, even in "high" flow. If you want macro algae export, then add a turf scrubber. Just my two cents.
I feel the same. I removed the fuge from my current re-build.


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Old 10/23/2015, 11:52 AM   #8796
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So, with a Sicce Syncra 5.0, 1" drains, and 1.5" drain piping, the gate valve is about 7/8 of the way closed in order to keep the Sicce and the drain in balance.

Is this normal?

Should I look into a stronger return pump that will allow me to open the gate valve more on the siphon pipe?


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Old 11/08/2015, 01:06 AM   #8797
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How long is the drop? @ 24" the max-theoretical capacity of a 1" bulkhead is 1660gph, with a practical limit of ~ 1500gph in 1.5" pipe. That sicce is not putting out near its max of 1321gph. This would tend to make for a small opening at the valve. Cleaning up the plumbing (reducing the friction losses) could help a bit.

What you should do depends on the size of the tank... I can tell you that a 7/8 closed valve is not exactly something I would want in my system. The capacity drops to ~1200gph with 1" pipe (assuming a 24" drop) and wide open valve. That could get your valve opened a bit more. On a tank larger than 120 gallons, I would bump the pump size up, as the 5.0 is not enough pump.


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Old 11/08/2015, 05:41 AM   #8798
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Anyone have an online source for the 1" to 1.25" street elbows that are supposed to be used on the tank side of the bulkheads? I've searched and come up with nothing.


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Old 11/08/2015, 06:36 AM   #8799
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Anyone have an online source for the 1" to 1.25" street elbows that are supposed to be used on the tank side of the bulkheads? I've searched and come up with nothing.

I got mine at home depot locally if that is an option for you. May try Savko otherwise though if prefer shipping.


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Old 11/08/2015, 03:19 PM   #8800
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Local HD and lowes both came up dry for me. I'll check out savko. Thanks.


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