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Old 11/02/2010, 06:13 PM   #1
Dee12Dee12
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Coral/Emperor angel...any luck or advice? Thanks!

I'm upgrading from 55g to a 210g and im in love with the emperor angel, but I also want to keep a reef tank. Am I doomed for failure? Has anyone had any success keeping this angel with their corals. If not which angel whould be best suited for a reef system? Thanks guys.


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Old 11/06/2010, 11:49 PM   #2
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welcome to reef central!

if you do your homework it's possible but you MUST get informed before attempting this IMO- use search engine.

research compatibility, imperator etc.

if not well fed any captive Emperor can become stunted. (Not pretty!)

210 is minimum size aquarium for an adult Emperor IMO.




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Old 11/07/2010, 07:51 AM   #3
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Thank you so much for your reply and picture! I've been doing some research lately. I would have went a little bigger on the tank but I got an unbelievable deal on the 210g. I guess minimum is better than not big enough. Thanks Gary!


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Old 11/07/2010, 09:04 AM   #4
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I have a juvi 4" emperor angel in my 180 with a bunch of leathers, euphilias, and an RBTA. so far, so good, hasn't even touched zoas yet. I did clear out all my acans, open brains, and other fleshy non - stinging LPS.

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Old 11/07/2010, 12:18 PM   #5
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I've had Emperors in my RT for years. IME as long as they are well fed you should be ok with SPS. Mine have nibbled on occasion but only rarely. They are more inclined to try LPS than any other from my experience.


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Old 11/07/2010, 04:30 PM   #6
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Thanks for the reply illwill


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Old 11/07/2010, 05:19 PM   #7
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So far so good. I really wish it would eat the anthelia Nips at some SPS but no real damage.



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Old 11/07/2010, 06:15 PM   #8
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At the end of the day, IMO the best way to limit coral nipping is keep it well fed and to purchase a juvenile.


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Old 11/08/2010, 06:50 AM   #9
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Quote:
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So far so good. I really wish it would eat the anthelia Nips at some SPS but no real damage.
Nice tank. What size is it and what kind of lighting are yoy using?


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Old 12/15/2010, 07:33 AM   #10
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Does the length of the tank matter? Would a 5'x30" tank be OK or do they need at least a 6' tank?


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Old 12/15/2010, 10:29 AM   #11
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I'd say bigger then a 6ft tank. A full grown emperor will be too big for a 210g. I think a 8x3 foot print is needed.


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Old 12/17/2010, 07:09 PM   #12
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Quote:
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Does the length of the tank matter? Would a 5'x30" tank be OK or do they need at least a 6' tank?
60" x 30" could work IMO.

Keep in mind there's more to the equation than aquarium size- I've seen this species stunt in 1,000 gallon aquariums as well as 6 x 2 180's.
Diet and water quality is extremely important!


"Junior's Reef"


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Old 12/17/2010, 07:32 PM   #13
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Beautiful specimen!


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Old 12/17/2010, 10:37 PM   #14
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To be on the safe side, I would say expect any large angel to wipe out a couple corals, but it is possible to have them in a reef.


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Old 12/18/2010, 05:01 AM   #15
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I'd like to remind people that my posts in this thread are in regards to one specific Angelfish species: the Emperor.

Very important:

Always conduct research down to specific species. Avoid generalizations if possible.


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Old 12/18/2010, 05:32 AM   #16
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Quote:
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I'd say bigger then a 6ft tank. A full grown emperor will be too big for a 210g. I think a 8x3 foot print is needed.
I agree. I wouldn't keep them in anything below 300g. But I prefer to keep a fish in a tank double the size they need, then in just the minimum.


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Old 12/18/2010, 05:50 AM   #17
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in a reef aquarium

with the associated surface water flow and aquascape Pomacanthus imperator tends not dwell in the top 1/3 of the aquarium but rather down near the bottom.
This is why aquarium footprint is more important than total gallonage of the aquarium when giving a recommendation for the species.
Imps aren't the swimmers that many fishes (such as Naso spp. Tangs) are.

A 'bolt hole' (or cave) should be provided.

If fed properly this species will rapidly outgrow a small aquarium so (for many reasons) it's best to have a large enough aquarium prior to purchasing the fish.




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Old 12/18/2010, 07:09 AM   #18
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I apologize for my generalization. I own a adult emp about the size of yours. I keep him very well fed, my footprint is 8ft by 2ft. I have seen him enjoy several zoas, and his behavior is very similar to the other large angels I have, Blueface, majestic and regal. I am just saying, there is certainly some corals you can keep, and some you cant. Every single individual fish is different, you certainly cannot make generalizations that one emperor will be exactly the same as another. Have you ever lost any coral to yours?


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Old 12/18/2010, 07:17 AM   #19
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I haven't lost any corals to this particular fish.

I have lost corals to different Angelfish species in the past so I somewhat learned what to avoid: especially the fleshy "open brain" type corals (Cynarina, Scolymia, etc.) although there's been a Symphyllia in my aquarium with "Junior" (my Emperor) since day one. (I aquired this fish as a late stage juvenile/emerging adult).

I have zooanthids. I've never seen Junior even bat an eye at them. (The shrimp's cleaning station is directly above patches of zooanthids in my aquarium.) My Emperor (and all Angelfish in general IME) are prone to pick at unhealthy corals, although if mine gets overly hungry he'll go straight for terminal polyps on my healthy stag Acropora. He'll also nip at my gigantea carpet anemone if the Clownfish's guard goes down.




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Old 12/18/2010, 07:56 AM   #20
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My blueface just stares at my RBTA until the maroon notices! LOL


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Old 12/18/2010, 08:30 AM   #21
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My emp is in a 210. I don't have corals in that tank at this time. I QT'd him in a 55 gallon reef several years ago when I first got him. (Lets you know where the corals come in on my priority list. ) As a changing subadult, the emp ate every single zoanthid in the tank - probably well over 200 polyps. It didn't bother any leathers, Turbinaria, gorgonian or mushrooms. (The dogface puffer ate all the mushrooms.)

Gary, your tank is gorgeous! Do you still have that set-up? In your opinion, is your emp okay in that tank for life? Not to hijack, but if you still have that tank going, what are the tankmates with Junior? I'd be willing to devote my 210 almost exclusively to my emperor (Elvis).

Here are a couple old pics (sorry, I'm no photographer):





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Old 12/18/2010, 09:36 AM   #22
Gary Majchrzak
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Hi, Lisa. Thanks for the kind words.
The aquarium shown in my pix is still in full operation and receives regular updates on RC under the thread entitled

Junior's Reef

I completely understand where you're coming from- the Emperor Angelfish is one of the original reasons I was attracted to having a marine aquarium.
It's difficult for me to judge if Junior is still growing. At one point I believed that he had stopped but I was wrong. (I'm also still unsure whether "he" is actually a male!)
Even if "he" grows another couple of inches I believe this aquarium is large enough to provide him enough room to live a healthy and happy life

Elvis is a looker!


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Old 12/18/2010, 09:53 AM   #23
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My Emps name is Elvis too! He had that name when I bought him, LOL.




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Old 12/22/2010, 08:46 PM   #24
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Has anyone had success with keeping a changing emperor angelfish with some lps
hammer torch frogspawn bubble pearl open brain closed brain lots of zoos (black fire and ice,purple abyss,pink and green) elegance chili's yellow toadstool and most imp. a large 22 polyp blue/orange florida ricordea mushroom coral ? i have a 150 gallon RT tank with lots of caves and LR maybe a good 110 lbs. with very mature LR with sponges all over the LR in the caves and i feed the emperor 2x a day a diet of mysis shrimp, formula 1 and 2 frozen prepared foods, sometimes pellets formula 2 and 1, and marine algae or nori- not all in 1 day but i mix it up. I added the emperor- 4 inches last to a tank of 3 yellow tangs small,pair of ocellaris clownfish,tuxedo damselfish,orange and yellow neon dottyback,powder blue tang small.I also have some SPS Montipora encrusted corals- thats have been fine so far after 1 month i havent seen any issues since i keep him well fed, but i know its a risk and i monitor carefully.I ocassionally see him nip at some sponge growth thats on the ricordea rock, and nip rarely at some zoos but haven't seen him touch the elegance hammer tourch brain bubble corals- my concern is i have a 240 gallon FOWLR tank but I love this fish and i would love to keep it at least until he/she is an adult or larger in the reef tank. I see and monitor him carefully nipping at the LR all the time which has sponge growth and coraline algae on it and after a month mostly hes in caves and hiding until he wants some food and even then the yellow tangs are way more active. The emperor has let the cleaner or skunk shrimp clean him and doesnt seem that aggresive even to other tankmates, but he is in the process of changing from juvy to adult.He does snap at very small nasarius snails if they come on the glass during the day, but only very tiny ones. So my question is can this be done if monitored and kept well fed will the emperor angelfish not eat my very expensive Aussie LPS corals, i do monitor him and feed him alot. I have an excellent Custom wet/dry (i use LR) for a tank up to 500 gallons, and an Aquamedics Protein Skimmer thats very good also for a tank up to 400+ gallons.So even with feeding alot the nitrates are in the RT less than 2.5.
I keep the Temp at 78F and the Salinty 1.023 the PH-8.2 the Ammonia -0 Nitrites 0.1 (trying to get that to 0 as soon as i do another mini water change) i keep the Calcium at 550 and ALk a bit high, 10-12 dkh. The fish look great really bold colors and the corals seem to be thriving under 1 250W HQI MH lighting with a 14k Phoenix lamp, and 4x65 PC lighting. I have a Koraliya PH i think its around 1400 GPH and a Mag 18 return pump. the run across the top of the tank and to some degree create a wavemaking like current/flow. I have a 4 inch SB of premium Florida keys sand. I'm new so i would appreciate any advise or anyones success with this kind of situation, I'm sorry if i put too much info- wasn't sure what to add or not so i put in my setup.Thanks everyone for advice/help and experiences.


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Old 12/23/2010, 06:16 AM   #25
Gary Majchrzak
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fwiw

I introduced an Emperor into my reef aquarium when the fish was a late stage juvenile. Around 80% of the corals now in my tank were added and grown out after Junior was in the aquarium.
In what might be an exception to the rule, my Emperor has become increasingly less "picky" towards corals as it's matured.
Oddly enough, I very rarely (if ever) see Junior go after LPS or Zooanthids.
If he becomes ornery he'll chomp on the terminal polyps (ends) of my stag Acropora.
I saw him sample my Goniopora once and that coral must taste extremely nasty judging from the fish's reaction.
He will nip at my gigantea carpet anemone once in a great while when the clownfish aren't paying attention.
He'll eat algae and certain sponges growing in the aquarium.
I've had several other (smaller) Angelfish that were much more destructive than this Emperor.

The "Junior's Reef" link I posted will take you to a thread containing a lot more info and pictures. That thread will also link you to my older "New Canvas" thread when I first introduced Junior into my reef aquarium.


April 2007


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