Reef Central Online Community

Home Forum Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences View New Posts View Today's Posts

Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Reefkeeping ...an online magazine for marine aquarists Support our sponsors and mention Reef Central

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > General Interest Forums > The Reef Chemistry Forum
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

Reply
Thread Tools
Old 11/16/2010, 11:05 PM   #1
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Looking for cheap soda lime for my CO2 scrubber

I installed a CO2 scrubber last night and it worked pretty well. My pH used to be 7.8 (as low as 7.6 has been observed) and tonight (after roughly 24 hours in use), the pH is holding steady in ~8.06 which is great. The problem is that 1/4 of the soda lime in the container is already purple.

I am looking for a cheaper way to refill the media. Any idea where I can purchase this stuff for bulk?


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/16/2010, 11:28 PM   #2
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Sorry just to clarify when I say cheap soda lime, I really mean inexpensive; not that I am looking for inferior / cheaply made soda lime.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/17/2010, 07:10 AM   #3
Genetics
Registered Member
 
Genetics's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Ontario, Ohio
Posts: 4,912
Quote:
Originally Posted by dzhuo View Post
Sorry just to clarify when I say cheap soda lime, I really mean inexpensive; not that I am looking for inferior / cheaply made soda lime.
It shouldn't be hard to find it cheaply, especially if you look at the composition. Sorry I don't know where to find it though.


__________________
Nate

Current Tank Info: Planning phase.
Genetics is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/17/2010, 12:40 PM   #4
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Is this skimmer media fine for the CO2 scrubber?


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/17/2010, 01:44 PM   #5
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
This website sells 3 lbs of soda lime for $7.50. Does anyone know it's good quality and can be used in CO2 scrubber?


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/17/2010, 07:33 PM   #6
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
No one?


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/17/2010, 08:39 PM   #7
Boomer
Bomb Technician (EOD)
 
Boomer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Duluth, Minnesota
Posts: 11,883
Is this skimmer media fine for the CO2 scrubber?

Yes, and about the best there is as I found it for him


Your other link is fine stuff also.


Do a Google search for " rebreather soda lime "


__________________
If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up

Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile



An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.
Boomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/17/2010, 09:08 PM   #8
teesquare
Coral Curmudgeon
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: western NC
Posts: 1,688
Boomer - is it feasible to re-charge the soda-lime?
T


__________________
No....really honey, it was a gift!

Current Tank Info: 700 gallon combined reef/frag systems - 650gal Cichlid system
teesquare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/17/2010, 11:04 PM   #9
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boomer View Post
[b]Do a Google search for " rebreather soda lime "
Any chance you know where I can find the cheapest?


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/18/2010, 12:23 PM   #10
Boomer
Bomb Technician (EOD)
 
Boomer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Duluth, Minnesota
Posts: 11,883
Not really T, as


Ca(OH)2 (granular Kalk) + CO2 --- > CaCO3 Calcite solid ( think Aragonite), which is not an easy task to take say a coral skeleton and convert it back to Ca(OH)2 Kalk.


dz
http://northeastscubasupply.com/stor.../prod_617.html

$149.99 for 44lbs = $3.41 / lb and the link you posted is $2.50 / lb and that is really cheap


__________________
If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up

Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile



An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.
Boomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 12:40 AM   #11
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
I have been using the soda lime from the link I posted for a few days now and it does seem to work. The weird thing is that the media stays white (and I know it didn't go through a reverse phrase from violet because I checked it twice a day. I would not have missed the reversal). The original media came with the CO2 scrubber turned to purple / violet in a matter of 3 days. If the soda lime I am currently using is the same grade, I would expect the same color changing to happen by now. In fact, it should be complete violet and should be discarded. I notice the pH has gone down from 8.06 to 7.96 now (night time) so I wonder:

1. If the media I got don't change color despite its claim.
2. If the media I got has a significantly longer absorbent capacity.
3. If the first batch of media (that came with the CO2 scrubber itself) has an incredibly low absorbent capacity. It only lasted about 4 days.

I also notice the link I posted above sells this soda lime in different shape. For example, BRS sells this media more or less in sphere shape while mine appear larger in size and like a cylinder as far as shape goes.

Any thoughts on this? I wonder if I should replace my media or buy from somewhere else.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 12:54 AM   #12
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Also, what about this media. Any good? What are the different grade means?


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 02:21 AM   #13
saltywet
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Milky Way
Posts: 230
Quote:
Also, what about this media. Any good? What are the different grade means?
I have used the airgas sodalime. It worked really well for me. My PH with it was 8.2-8.4.

It starts running out in about 3 weeks where it changes color. My PH without sodalime is 7.9-8.1.

HTH


saltywet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 10:49 AM   #14
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Did you order directly from airgas? If so, how much do you pay for? I sent them an email last night but haven't heard back yet.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 11:32 AM   #15
tmz
ReefKeeping Mag staff

 
tmz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: West Seneca NY
Posts: 27,622
It takes a week or two or three for mine to show any color change. The air gas product is fine, I use it. It came to about $90 for 5 gallons ( only size they carry) of it around 30lbs.They have locations throughout the country so if one is near you you can pick it up and save shipping. Don't think you can beat the 3 lbs fofr 7.50 though


__________________
Tom

Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals.
tmz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 11:46 AM   #16
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
The weird thing is the original media came with my CO2 scrubber exhausted in less than 7 days but this new one I use now hasn't shown any color change in a week. Obviously the CO2 concentration in the basement hasn't change much and air pull from my ATB is still roughly the same so I would have expected the media to at least show some purple which I am not seeing. Maybe I just wait a little longer and see how the pH react. I forget to check it this morning.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 02:00 PM   #17
Boomer
Bomb Technician (EOD)
 
Boomer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Duluth, Minnesota
Posts: 11,883
There are a number of things to look at.

1. Moisture: Affects the media and lowers its capacity. You first batch may have dropped in capacity as it was pulling out to much moisture from the air ( but I do not buy into this). This should be less on the second batch refill. Basements are more of a good thing as they usually have higher humidity. Getting dried out, from storage or when used, as the air passes over it in the CO2 unit is the biggest concern as the media is suppose to have moisture to operate. Most are around 10 - 20 % moisture. Many companies have give a rather large range for their product, i.e., 12 - 18 % on at data sheet. Media moisture should be ~ 18 % and during operation the moisture should never get below 2 %. When I see these CO2 media with zeolites or adding water to the bottom of the canister it tells me one thing, the media is low in moisture to begin with.

2. Shape: Different shapes affect the adsorption capacity. It has been shown the cylinders are better than spherical or granular. Even manufactures that sell different grain shapes tell you that.

3. Grain size: This can get tricky as one does not what it to small or to big. Grains in the 8-12 ( 2.5 - 5 mm) mesh will last ~ 1.3 times longer than 4 - 8 mesh ( 1.0 - 2.5) or about 4 % more adsorption. But this is for re-breathers and IMHO 4-8 mesh is better for us. One issue here is the smaller the GS the greater the pressure drop. Something you do not want.

4. Grain porosity: Some media are more pours which gives more surface area and more or quicker adsorption.

5. Dust and Harness : You want about the lowest dust and highest hardness you can get.

For all practical purposes most are about same, i.e., there are no leaps and bound differences. Any media would have lost adsorption capacity in the first use if there are humidly problems in the basement.

The media sold by thefilterguys is about the best there its. It is # 1 in hospitals and re-breathers.

I'm one that does not believe in claims unless it is backed up by a data sheet. I have seen TFG data sheet on grain size/shape, moisture, adsorption capacity,etc.


__________________
If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up

Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile



An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.
Boomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11/30/2010, 08:45 PM   #18
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Thx for the info Boomer. I will see what my pH tonight. Still haven't heard back from airgas.com yet.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/01/2010, 01:35 AM   #19
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
Checked the pH and it's at 7.88 now so it seems like the media isn't doing much anymore. Time line wise, it's similar to what I see from the first batch original soda lime I got from BRS except the color doesn't change at all. I am going to change the media to see if pH goes back up. If it does, then it's pretty clear that these media does not change color (despite what the manufacturer claims).


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/01/2010, 10:45 PM   #20
Boomer
Bomb Technician (EOD)
 
Boomer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Duluth, Minnesota
Posts: 11,883
Yah, I would expect the media is shot with a pH like 7.88


__________________
If you See Me Running You Better Catch-Up

Seawater Chemistry, Geology, ID Marine Life, Collecting Science Books, Explosives Technology, Audiophile



An explosion can be defined as a loud noise, accompanied by the sudden going away of things, from a place where they use to be.
Boomer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/01/2010, 11:46 PM   #21
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
I changed out the media today and notice they are in fact light purple. It's just very hard to see from the media container but once out, it's clearly changing color. The first batch I use just have a deeper purple so it's a lot easier to see. I put in a new batch tonight. With the rate I am going, I will need a lot of sodalime year long.

airgas called me today and said they are putting together an order for me. I am going to get 5lbs to test their stuff out.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/02/2010, 12:30 PM   #22
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
airgas called again and they are actually putting together a 36lbs sodalime for me for $65. This comes out to less than $2 per lb. I am going to pick up the order next week (they happen to have a retail store 10 minutes from where I live). Let's see how their stuff works. The price definitely beats everything I have found so far by a large margin.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/05/2011, 12:14 AM   #23
Mike1918
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by dzhuo View Post
airgas called again and they are actually putting together a 36lbs sodalime for me for $65. This comes out to less than $2 per lb. I am going to pick up the order next week (they happen to have a retail store 10 minutes from where I live). Let's see how their stuff works. The price definitely beats everything I have found so far by a large margin.
Any update? Just curious cause I am looking to purchase some soda lime. I was going to get the 3 lb. bag from shopmedvet.com but I also have an Airgas store close by.


Mike1918 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/05/2011, 01:11 AM   #24
dzhuo
Registered Member
 
dzhuo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,551
I picked up the soda lime a couple of weeks ago from an Airgas office near where I live. The media works similar (as far as size and absorbing capacity goes) to the others I purchased from 2 other different companies. I plan to continue use their media for as long as I can (since they offer the best price).

My CO2 scrubber is able to keep my tank's pH between 8.0 and 8.2 without a problem.


dzhuo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01/06/2011, 01:22 PM   #25
HiggyBrew
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Michigan, USA
Posts: 51
For 4 years now my pH ranged from 7.78 - 8.10 in all 4 saltwater tanks, (my family must blow off a lot of CO2 in air tight house - I guess).

Last night I finally fired some BRS soda lime into my empty phos reactor, and then plugged the IN-280 skimmer air intake hose to the soda lime reactor output. The pH rose overnight from about 7.80 to 8.21! Usually my pH bottoms out overnight at 7.80 and stays there until the light come on, (despite constant kalkwasser drip while lights are out). I also pump in set amounts of CaCl2 and Na2CO3 throughout the day.

I will definitely be checking this thread regularly for the best deal on soda lime.

I may look into bringing in outside air to the skimmer to see if I can eliminate the need for the soda lime trick, but (knowing myself) this may take a while...


HiggyBrew is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Last Chance if you want Soda Lime Tonight! coralfragger101 Florida Marine Aquarium Society (FMAS) - Miami/Ft. Lauderdale 1 02/24/2010 05:11 AM
Lime Water CO2 scrubber greenmonkey51 The Reef Chemistry Forum 6 10/06/2009 02:00 PM
The CO2 Scrubber tastingSalty Lighting, Filtration & Other Equipment 11 08/13/2009 01:06 AM
Ever Consider Using SCUBA Rebreather CO2 Scrubber For Aquarium Use? szhttm Do It Yourself 14 04/14/2009 10:59 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:15 AM.


TapaTalk Enabled

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2017 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright 1999-2014