Reef Central Online Community

Home Forum Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences View New Posts View Today's Posts

Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Reefkeeping ...an online magazine for marine aquarists Support our sponsors and mention Reef Central

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > General Interest Forums > Reef Discussion
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

Reply
Thread Tools
Old 12/03/2017, 11:48 AM   #1
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Rimless vs Euro brace - pros and cons with maintenance?

I'm looking for feedback from hobbyists with personal experiences owning/maintaining rimless tanks.

I took a break from the hobby for about a 1.5yrs after a 2nd tank fail (2nd time was a Marineland 300DD silicone seam fail). I have finally decided to give it one more go! I have purchased a brand new custom 74" x 34" x 22" - 3/4" glass rimless. I like the way the rimless tank looks. But at this point in my hobby I am more concerned with practicality. I plan on covering the top with a screen (as I have done with all my tanks - keeps my fish in). I'm really concerned about rimless tanks creating a constant mess with splash over...I usually run a SPS dominated mixed reef tank with lots of flow. I still have a opportunity to have a 2" euro brace lip which will act as a functional splash guard. Is this a good move?


Please comment on your personal experience with rimless tanks and the overall pros vs cons with maintenance?

Thanks!
Jason


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/03/2017, 12:12 PM   #2
DesertReefT4r
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Mesa Az
Posts: 183
Rimless pros are it looks very clean and elegant imo, gives you tons of access room to get into the tank for maintenance. Cons are rimless is not as strong if made by a quality tank builder you will b3 fine but there have been issues with rimless tanks bowing or having panels fail completely. Euro braced pros are it provides a strong upper and lower support to the tank, looks better than the black plastic braces on AGA and Aqueon tanks. Cons are depending on how the euro brace is made and big it is access can be limited.


DesertReefT4r is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/03/2017, 06:01 PM   #3
DDon
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Brentwood,CA
Posts: 772
I have a 50 cube rimless and a 270g eurobraced. I much prefer eurobracing as I splash water out of the rimless tank what time I do anything to it. Also the eurobracing provides greater support. I had the eurobracing on my tank recessed to allow the screen to sit on the eurobrace and still be below the rim of the tank.


DDon is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/03/2017, 07:46 PM   #4
rishma
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 1,300
Quote:
Originally Posted by DDon View Post
I have a 50 cube rimless and a 270g eurobraced. I much prefer eurobracing as I splash water out of the rimless tank what time I do anything to it. Also the eurobracing provides greater support. I had the eurobracing on my tank recessed to allow the screen to sit on the eurobrace and still be below the rim of the tank.
I have my first rimless after many many years of eurobraced. I find the splashing over the edge a real aggravation.


__________________
Reefing since Ď96

Current Tank Info: Silence is golden
rishma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/03/2017, 09:21 PM   #5
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by DesertReefT4r View Post
Rimless pros are it looks very clean and elegant imo, gives you tons of access room to get into the tank for maintenance. Cons are rimless is not as strong if made by a quality tank builder you will b3 fine but there have been issues with rimless tanks bowing or having panels fail completely. Euro braced pros are it provides a strong upper and lower support to the tank, looks better than the black plastic braces on AGA and Aqueon tanks. Cons are depending on how the euro brace is made and big it is access can be limited.
It was constructed originally to be a rimless tank as a final product with the thicker glass. The Euro brace edging I would have installed would at most be 2" wide (giving a ~1 1/4" splash guard lip) which wouldn't adversely affect accessibility too much...no cross beams. It seems the rimless tanks placed in a 'show room' at a frag event give that 'wow' factor when you see it. Once you get it home and have to work on it...as I have my hands in my tanks...I could only imagine the mess it would be with salt water splashing over. Plus, the added strength it would give would also give me a piece of mind that will not give out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDon View Post
I have a 50 cube rimless and a 270g eurobraced. I much prefer eurobracing as I splash water out of the rimless tank what time I do anything to it. Also the eurobracing provides greater support. I had the eurobracing on my tank recessed to allow the screen to sit on the eurobrace and still be below the rim of the tank.
That's kind of what I am thinking how can the water not splash out putting your hands in there for even the simplest task. Plus, I always run SeaSwirls for my returns which give lots of surface agitation which alone could cause spillage.

I like the idea of having the Euro bracing recessed. Hmmm. I was trying to figure out how to install a screened cover with ease of use and still functional.
I'll have to talk that one over.

~~~~


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/03/2017, 09:23 PM   #6
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by rishma View Post
I have my first rimless after many many years of eurobraced. I find the splashing over the edge a real aggravation.
Interesting. If you had to do it over again, would you go with a rimless? Seems to me the splashing over edge would be deal killer for me.


~~~~


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/03/2017, 10:24 PM   #7
DesertReefT4r
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Mesa Az
Posts: 183
Yes splashing can be an issue with rimless tanks for sure. You would need to have water level a little lower in the display and use care with wave makers. I like the look of rimless but would never own one. Oh another con to euro bracing on glass tanks, I have seen algae get bewteen 2 peices on glass used on the brace.


DesertReefT4r is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/03/2017, 11:52 PM   #8
moondoggy4
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: menifee So cal
Posts: 10,554
A problem with euro bracing they do not work well with the new ghost overflows, you will a traditional type of overflow. Another problem is catching fish it is hard to bring the net up to top and capture a fish.

Euro bracing is popular here in Ca due to earthquakes,like DDon state get the euro bracing recessed so the screen is not visible.

Euro bracing is good with canopies so cheaper lighting as well.


moondoggy4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 04:53 AM   #9
Ron Reefman
Registered Member
 
Ron Reefman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Cape Coral, FL
Posts: 10,570
I wanted a rimless 125g tank like a Red Sea. But due to cost, I saved 30% or more, and got a euro braced Cadlight 125g. In no time at all I was happy with the look of the tank. I have no issues with access to work in the tank. And I love having the euro brace as a small 'shelf' to set stuff on when I am putting things in or getting things out of the tank. I really though I wouldn't like the euro brace but was willing to live with it for the cost savings, now I wouldn't do a tank without a euro brace! sometimes trying new things is a good idea!


__________________
The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson)
Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017
Ron Reefman is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 06:14 AM   #10
rishma
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 1,300
Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by jc-reef View Post
Interesting. If you had to do it over again, would you go with a rimless? Seems to me the splashing over edge would be deal killer for me.


~~~~
Probably not. Itís a small tank and eurobraced would negatively affect appearance. I am learning to be more careful.


__________________
Reefing since Ď96

Current Tank Info: Silence is golden
rishma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 08:48 AM   #11
JTL
Registered Member
 
JTL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Venice Island, FL
Posts: 2,230
I am not a fan of euro braced tanks and would personally not own one but it is definitely a personal choice. My wife is messing with the corals and other tank issues on a daily basis and splashing water has not been a problem providing you use a little common sense.


__________________
John

100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium.
JTL is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 09:00 AM   #12
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by moondoggy4 View Post
A problem with euro bracing they do not work well with the new ghost overflows, you will a traditional type of overflow. Another problem is catching fish it is hard to bring the net up to top and capture a fish.

Euro bracing is popular here in Ca due to earthquakes,like DDon state get the euro bracing recessed so the screen is not visible.

Euro bracing is good with canopies so cheaper lighting as well.
This tank was already constructed with a center overflow. My original preference was to go with a ghost overflow, but I'm getting this tank at a really good deal, so beggars cant be choosers. This tank will also be sitting on a 4' stand (I'm 6'5") so most people would never see any covers. I will have to see if installing them recessed is even an option as the glass thickness may interfere with the overflow. I could always silicone a few tabs on the corners to keep a cover in place.

I only plan on having a small width brace installed (2" - giving an effective 1 1/4" lip), so catching fish should not be too difficult...plus it is a large tank 6' x 3' with plenty of room to maneuver an net.


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 09:52 AM   #13
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTL View Post
I am not a fan of euro braced tanks and would personally not own one but it is definitely a personal choice. My wife is messing with the corals and other tank issues on a daily basis and splashing water has not been a problem providing you use a little common sense.

Hi JTL - Do you find say cleaning the glass more time consuming having to take the extra care not splash water with magnet? Do you run a high flow tank?


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 09:55 AM   #14
JTL
Registered Member
 
JTL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Venice Island, FL
Posts: 2,230
Cleaning with the magnet does not splash any water you just have to be a little diligent when you have your arm in the tank and remove it, but I suspect that is also the case with a euro braced tank. I have moderate flow, 2 tunze powerheads and dual return nozzles.


__________________
John

100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium.
JTL is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 09:55 AM   #15
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Reefman View Post
I wanted a rimless 125g tank like a Red Sea. But due to cost, I saved 30% or more, and got a euro braced Cadlight 125g. In no time at all I was happy with the look of the tank. I have no issues with access to work in the tank. And I love having the euro brace as a small 'shelf' to set stuff on when I am putting things in or getting things out of the tank. I really though I wouldn't like the euro brace but was willing to live with it for the cost savings, now I wouldn't do a tank without a euro brace! sometimes trying new things is a good idea!
I can definitely see the advantage to use the brace as a shelf to place something on when messing with the tank...especially since my tank will be higher than average on a 4' stand and me always having to climb on a ladder.


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 10:03 AM   #16
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTL View Post
Cleaning with the magnet does not splash any water you just have to be a little diligent when you have your arm in the tank and remove it, but I suspect that is also the case with a euro braced tank. I have moderate flow, 2 tunze powerheads and dual return nozzles.
I know water will drip everywhere regardless of style of tank after pulling arm out...that's kind of unavoidable. I will be running 2 SeaSwirl returns which create vast surface agitation and rippling as it sways back and forth. If I stick with rimless, I would more than likely have to point the nozzle at a lower angle into the tank. Even with braced stock tanks (like my prior Marineland 300DD) I would get salt creep on the front corner/side lips of brace area from the agitation from the SeaSwirl returns. This will be a high flow tank.


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/04/2017, 10:07 AM   #17
JTL
Registered Member
 
JTL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Venice Island, FL
Posts: 2,230
Quote:
Originally Posted by jc-reef View Post
I can definitely see the advantage to use the brace as a shelf to place something on when messing with the tank...especially since my tank will be higher than average on a 4' stand and me always having to climb on a ladder.
I use the top of the overflow or occasionally I put a small cutting board on the corner. My custom stand is also higher than normal so I use a ladder.


__________________
John

100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium.
JTL is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/05/2017, 06:24 AM   #18
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by JTL View Post
I use the top of the overflow or occasionally I put a small cutting board on the corner. My custom stand is also higher than normal so I use a ladder.
Are you using a ghost overflow that is covered? I like the cutting board idea.


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/05/2017, 07:36 AM   #19
JTL
Registered Member
 
JTL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Venice Island, FL
Posts: 2,230
The tank has a built in center overflow.


__________________
John

100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium.
JTL is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/05/2017, 02:05 PM   #20
smatter
Registered Member
 
smatter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 1,937
You guys are a bunch of rookies if you're splashing water out of your tanks . I don't find splashing the problem with rimless tanks. For me it's the build up at the waterline that I can't stand. Looks great when it's clean though.


smatter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/05/2017, 02:11 PM   #21
JTL
Registered Member
 
JTL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Venice Island, FL
Posts: 2,230
Quote:
Originally Posted by smatter View Post
You guys are a bunch of rookies if you're splashing water out of your tanks . I don't find splashing the problem with rimless tanks. For me it's the build up at the waterline that I can't stand. Looks great when it's clean though.
Those deposits come off pretty easy but our tank get cleaned weekly so they don't have much of chance to build up.


__________________
John

100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium.
JTL is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/05/2017, 02:47 PM   #22
smatter
Registered Member
 
smatter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Madison, WI
Posts: 1,937
Yes it does come off easily, and I clean it daily. It's also the glass above the waterline. I see smears and whatnot and it drives me nuts. Maybe I'm just hypercritical.


smatter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/05/2017, 03:37 PM   #23
JTL
Registered Member
 
JTL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Venice Island, FL
Posts: 2,230
I am also pretty anal. My acrylic top is recessed and goes almost to the waterline so I don't see that.


__________________
John

100 gallon DT and 50 gallon sump with refugium.
JTL is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12/07/2017, 03:13 PM   #24
jc-reef
Registered Member
 
jc-reef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Treasure Coast, Florida
Posts: 965
Quote:
Originally Posted by smatter View Post
You guys are a bunch of rookies if you're splashing water out of your tanks . I don't find splashing the problem with rimless tanks. For me it's the build up at the waterline that I can't stand. Looks great when it's clean though.
smatter - What size display you running? You mentioned the scum buildup at the waterline being annoying. That would drive me nuts too. The more I think about it, even if I put a brace lip around the top, I will still have the same "scum buildup" at water line and the bottom of the brace lip will need cleaning too.

I'm liking the feedback and still haven't pulled the trigger fully on the euro brace. My tank will be over 6' long...not sure how splash out will affect it.


__________________
My Little Hobby
FMAS - Member

Current Tank Info: 300gal DD upgraded from 90 gal Mixed Reef Powered by T5 / LED
jc-reef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12/08/2017, 05:00 AM   #25
Ron Reefman
Registered Member
 
Ron Reefman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Cape Coral, FL
Posts: 10,570
With the eurobrace it's so easy to wipe the 'scum' away that is above the waterline. I have 3 rimless tanks and 1 with a eurobrace. It's not a huge deal, but I like the eurobrace tank better because it is easier to clean without splashing over the edge.


__________________
The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson)
Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017
Ron Reefman is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:52 AM.


TapaTalk Enabled

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2017 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright ©1999-2014