Looking for cheap soda lime for my CO2 scrubber

[dzhuo]

I installed a CO2 scrubber last night and it worked pretty well. My pH used to be 7.8 (as low as 7.6 has been observed) and tonight (after roughly 24 hours in use), the pH is holding steady in ~8.06 which is great. The problem is that 1/4 of the soda lime in the container is already purple.

I am looking for a cheaper way to refill the media. Any idea where I can purchase this stuff for bulk?

[dzhuo]

Sorry just to clarify when I say cheap soda lime, I really mean inexpensive; not that I am looking for inferior / cheaply made soda lime.

[Genetics]

Sorry just to clarify when I say cheap soda lime, I really mean inexpensive; not that I am looking for inferior / cheaply made soda lime.

It shouldn't be hard to find it cheaply, especially if you look at the composition. Sorry I don't know where to find it though.

[dzhuo]

Is this skimmer media (http://www.thefilterguys.biz/skimmer_media.htm) fine for the CO2 scrubber?

[dzhuo]

This website sells 3 lbs of soda lime for $7.50 (http://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag/anesthesia-products?r=gmc-feed-mvi&gclid=gmc-feed-mvi). Does anyone know it's good quality and can be used in CO2 scrubber?

[dzhuo]

No one? :)

[Boomer]

Is this skimmer media fine for the CO2 scrubber?

Yes, and about the best there is as I found it for him :)


Your other link is fine stuff also.


Do a Google search for " rebreather soda lime "

[teesquare]

Boomer - is it feasible to re-charge the soda-lime?
T

[dzhuo]

[b]Do a Google search for " rebreather soda lime "

Any chance you know where I can find the cheapest? :)

[Boomer]

Not really T, as


Ca(OH)2 (granular Kalk) + CO2 --- > CaCO3 Calcite solid ( think Aragonite), which is not an easy task to take say a coral skeleton and convert it back to Ca(OH)2 Kalk.


dz
http://northeastscubasupply.com/store/store/Rebreathers-CCR-Accessories/Absorbent/44lb-Keg-Sofnolime-8-12/prod_617.html

$149.99 for 44lbs = $3.41 / lb and the link you posted is $2.50 / lb and that is really cheap

[dzhuo]

I have been using the soda lime from the link I posted for a few days now and it does seem to work. The weird thing is that the media stays white (and I know it didn't go through a reverse phrase from violet because I checked it twice a day. I would not have missed the reversal). The original media came with the CO2 scrubber turned to purple / violet in a matter of 3 days. If the soda lime I am currently using is the same grade, I would expect the same color changing to happen by now. In fact, it should be complete violet and should be discarded. I notice the pH has gone down from 8.06 to 7.96 now (night time) so I wonder:

1. If the media I got don't change color despite its claim.
2. If the media I got has a significantly longer absorbent capacity.
3. If the first batch of media (that came with the CO2 scrubber itself) has an incredibly low absorbent capacity. It only lasted about 4 days.

I also notice the link I posted above sells this soda lime in different shape. For example, BRS sells this media (http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/store/medical-grade-co2-absorbent-low-dust.html) more or less in sphere shape while mine (http://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag/anesthesia-products?r=gmc-feed-mvi&gclid=gmc-feed-mvi) appear larger in size and like a cylinder as far as shape goes.

Any thoughts on this? I wonder if I should replace my media or buy from somewhere else.

[dzhuo]

Also, what about this media (http://www.airgas.com/content/products.aspx?id=9002003007007). Any good? What are the different grade means?

[saltywet]

Also, what about this media. Any good? What are the different grade means?

I have used the airgas sodalime. It worked really well for me. My PH with it was 8.2-8.4.

It starts running out in about 3 weeks where it changes color. My PH without sodalime is 7.9-8.1.

HTH

[dzhuo]

Did you order directly from airgas? If so, how much do you pay for? I sent them an email last night but haven't heard back yet.

[tmz]

It takes a week or two or three for mine to show any color change. The air gas product is fine, I use it. It came to about $90 for 5 gallons ( only size they carry) of it around 30lbs.They have locations throughout the country so if one is near you you can pick it up and save shipping. Don't think you can beat the 3 lbs fofr 7.50 though

[dzhuo]

The weird thing is the original media came with my CO2 scrubber exhausted in less than 7 days but this new one I use now hasn't shown any color change in a week. Obviously the CO2 concentration in the basement hasn't change much and air pull from my ATB is still roughly the same so I would have expected the media to at least show some purple which I am not seeing. Maybe I just wait a little longer and see how the pH react. I forget to check it this morning.

[Boomer]

There are a number of things to look at.

1. Moisture: Affects the media and lowers its capacity. You first batch may have dropped in capacity as it was pulling out to much moisture from the air ( but I do not buy into this). This should be less on the second batch refill. Basements are more of a good thing as they usually have higher humidity. Getting dried out, from storage or when used, as the air passes over it in the CO2 unit is the biggest concern as the media is suppose to have moisture to operate. Most are around 10 - 20 % moisture. Many companies have give a rather large range for their product, i.e., 12 - 18 % on at data sheet. Media moisture should be ~ 18 % and during operation the moisture should never get below 2 %. When I see these CO2 media with zeolites or adding water to the bottom of the canister it tells me one thing, the media is low in moisture to begin with.

2. Shape: Different shapes affect the adsorption capacity. It has been shown the cylinders are better than spherical or granular. Even manufactures that sell different grain shapes tell you that.

3. Grain size: This can get tricky as one does not what it to small or to big. Grains in the 8-12 ( 2.5 - 5 mm) mesh will last ~ 1.3 times longer than 4 - 8 mesh ( 1.0 - 2.5) or about 4 % more adsorption. But this is for re-breathers and IMHO 4-8 mesh is better for us. One issue here is the smaller the GS the greater the pressure drop. Something you do not want.

4. Grain porosity: Some media are more pours which gives more surface area and more or quicker adsorption.

5. Dust and Harness : You want about the lowest dust and highest hardness you can get.

For all practical purposes most are about same, i.e., there are no leaps and bound differences. Any media would have lost adsorption capacity in the first use if there are humidly problems in the basement.

The media sold by thefilterguys is about the best there its. It is # 1 in hospitals and re-breathers.

I'm one that does not believe in claims unless it is backed up by a data sheet. I have seen TFG data sheet on grain size/shape, moisture, adsorption capacity,etc.

[dzhuo]

Thx for the info Boomer. I will see what my pH tonight. Still haven't heard back from airgas.com yet.

[dzhuo]

Checked the pH and it's at 7.88 now so it seems like the media isn't doing much anymore. Time line wise, it's similar to what I see from the first batch original soda lime I got from BRS except the color doesn't change at all. I am going to change the media to see if pH goes back up. If it does, then it's pretty clear that these media does not change color (despite what the manufacturer claims).

[Boomer]

Yah, I would expect the media is shot with a pH like 7.88

[dzhuo]

I changed out the media today and notice they are in fact light purple. It's just very hard to see from the media container but once out, it's clearly changing color. The first batch I use just have a deeper purple so it's a lot easier to see. I put in a new batch tonight. With the rate I am going, I will need a lot of sodalime year long. :(

airgas called me today and said they are putting together an order for me. I am going to get 5lbs to test their stuff out.

[dzhuo]

airgas called again and they are actually putting together a 36lbs sodalime for me for $65. This comes out to less than $2 per lb. I am going to pick up the order next week (they happen to have a retail store 10 minutes from where I live). Let's see how their stuff works. The price definitely beats everything I have found so far by a large margin.

[Mike1918]

airgas called again and they are actually putting together a 36lbs sodalime for me for $65. This comes out to less than $2 per lb. I am going to pick up the order next week (they happen to have a retail store 10 minutes from where I live). Let's see how their stuff works. The price definitely beats everything I have found so far by a large margin.

Any update? Just curious cause I am looking to purchase some soda lime. I was going to get the 3 lb. bag from shopmedvet.com but I also have an Airgas store close by.

[dzhuo]

I picked up the soda lime a couple of weeks ago from an Airgas office near where I live. The media works similar (as far as size and absorbing capacity goes) to the others I purchased from 2 other different companies. I plan to continue use their media for as long as I can (since they offer the best price).

My CO2 scrubber is able to keep my tank's pH between 8.0 and 8.2 without a problem.

[HiggyBrew]

For 4 years now my pH ranged from 7.78 - 8.10 in all 4 saltwater tanks, (my family must blow off a lot of CO2 in air tight house - I guess).

Last night I finally fired some BRS soda lime into my empty phos reactor, and then plugged the IN-280 skimmer air intake hose to the soda lime reactor output. The pH rose overnight from about 7.80 to 8.21! Usually my pH bottoms out overnight at 7.80 and stays there until the light come on, (despite constant kalkwasser drip while lights are out). I also pump in set amounts of CaCl2 and Na2CO3 throughout the day.

I will definitely be checking this thread regularly for the best deal on soda lime.

I may look into bringing in outside air to the skimmer to see if I can eliminate the need for the soda lime trick, but (knowing myself) this may take a while...

[Palancarpets]

Here is a link to Soda Lime under the name of Sodasorb HP works out to $2.14 a pound before shipping.
Sodasorb HP (http://www.diverssupplyinc.net/browse.cfm/4,1386.html)

[dzhuo]

Thx Louis. The link you posted is more expensive (a lot more if factor in shipping) than the company I found. I wonder the Sodasorb HP stuff really has higher capacity or not tho? If it does, how much?

We need Boomer! :)

@HiggyBrew, have you notice any increase or decrease in skimmate production since installing the CO2 scrubber? Have you notice any air restriction?

[HiggyBrew]

@HiggyBrew, have you notice any increase or decrease in skimmate production since installing the CO2 scrubber? Have you notice any air restriction?
___________________________________________

I have not noticed any increase in skimmate yet. Tonight I will clean the skimmer and see how it performs compared to normal operation.

When I cut the air intake line to the skimmer I was watching the skimmer foam closely and it did not change much if at all. The line was attached near the top of the outflow tube (which is capped with a small hole on top). So far I have not had to adjust the skimmer at all.

The pH bottomed out last night about 0.24 pH units higher than normal, I love it! :lolspin:

[BlueCoast]

I just ordered a few lbs to test out. I won't be able to use the window once the tank gets moved.

I wanted to get some thoughts on a potential setup.
I have read about running your skimmer exhaust into the skimmer intake to cut down on skimmate smell.

What would be the implications of running the skimmer in a closed / semi-closed loop to preserve the sodalime media? Is there sufficient gas exchange in the sump and display to off-gas buildups other than co2? If there are successful tanks without skimmers, I would guess there is sufficient gas exchange.

Any thoughts on recirculating the skimmer air through the soda lime? Do you think the skimmer air might be too humid for the media?

[HiggyBrew]

My alk has been steady at 132 ppm for weeks, suddenly it dropped 12 ppm the day after starting the CO2 scrubber. Why is this? Could the pH rise have caused the corals to jump start their growth? That's the only thing that I can think of right now...

Any ideas?
____________________________

Bluecoast:

I would think the humidity would shorten the life of the soda lime.

I would think it best to remove the odor (and the nasty molecules that cause it) from the tank.

[pencil3]

Happens on my tank as well, as PH increases/decreases due to the soda lime my alkalinity would bounce all over. What I did is install a T with a ball valve after the CO2 scrubber to allow some ambient air to mix in so the PH never jumps up to 8.4 or higher when the soda lime is changed out. In addition I use a Apex controller for my 2 part dosing. I figured out what the alk/calcium consumption was at the different PH levels and then programmed it so the correct amount is added based off the PH of the tank.


My alk has been steady at 132 ppm for weeks, suddenly it dropped 12 ppm the day after starting the CO2 scrubber. Why is this? Could the pH rise have caused the corals to jump start their growth? That's the only thing that I can think of right now...

Any ideas?
____________________________

Bluecoast:

I would think the humidity would shorten the life of the soda lime.

I would think it best to remove the odor (and the nasty molecules that cause it) from the tank.

[HiggyBrew]

I am in Michigan. Airgas in Kalamazoo never called me back with a price for the 5 gallon pail of Sofnolime after I talked to them yesterday, I called them today 4 times and no one ever answered the phone.... The Battle Creek store told me that it is $100.05 for a 5 gallon pail. Anyone know of a better deal near me?

[soulsigma]

I am in Michigan. Airgas in Kalamazoo never called me back with a price for the 5 gallon pail of Sofnolime after I talked to them yesterday, I called them today 4 times and no one ever answered the phone.... The Battle Creek store told me that it is $100.05 for a 5 gallon pail. Anyone know of a better deal near me?

Tagging along as I need some too.

[dzhuo]

My transaction with Airgas was pretty smooth. However, I never called them. I simply send them an email at customer.service@airgas.com and tell them my location. The next day, one of their sales manager routed my ticket directly to their district office where the transaction was followed up. See if you have better luck with email.

[truebeliever71]

My transaction with Airgas was pretty smooth. However, I never called them. I simply send them an email at customer.service@airgas.com and tell them my location. The next day, one of their sales manager routed my ticket directly to their district office where the transaction was followed up. See if you have better luck with email.

Dzhou... I was wondering if you are still able to get the same deal from Airgas? They said that I have to either buy a full case or the pail at $141 for the case of 3lb bags or $137 for a 5gal bucket.

[dzhuo]

I haven't use up my 5g bucket yet. There are still at least 70% left. $137 for 5g bucket is double what I had to pay. I was able to get a deal of $65 for 5g (cheapest you will find anywhere; that's less then $2 per lb). I have a few emails from their manager where I negotiate the quote and I am happy to share that with you guys.

Feel free to PM if you are interested and I will give out the email. Or I can cc: you (you would have to give me your email) on the email where I receive the quote so you can talk to them directly.

[azcatsfan]

http://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag/anesthesia-products

[hkgar]

Here is where I bought mine.

$2.08 per pound before shipping.

http://www.wayfair.com/Molecular-Products-Gallon-Pail-Sodalime-120020-00-AMW1000.html?refid=ER&mmid=59905639&csnid=F7860E61-3B15-4405-975B-ECDDAA05BA76#specs

[on the spot]

Here is where I bought mine.

$2.08 per pound before shipping.

http://www.wayfair.com/Molecular-Products-Gallon-Pail-Sodalime-120020-00-AMW1000.html?refid=ER&mmid=59905639&csnid=F7860E61-3B15-4405-975B-ECDDAA05BA76#specs

As long as we are keeping this thread alive, I also bought a pail from Wayfair. I also got a 20% coupon towards one purchase, and a 6 dollar credit for posting a review of the bucket I purchased. The second bucket was really cheap. :)

[somethingphishy]

Gonna purchase my second bucket from wayfair today...$6 off for a review? I'm in...

[trcap8]

i use a air damper to return on unit!ph 7.8 to 8.4 in 3 days !!!!!!!!air damper lets out side air mix with the air that come in!!! lowing c02 in home , one timefix

[bertoni]

I agree that an air exchanger can work very well.

[delmo]

I got some soda lime from the medical place that's linked here, and it is pretty cheap. Seems to work well. got my pH from 8.05 to 8.2 all the while with a consistent 11 alk.
What air exchanger are you referring to?
That unit that mounts with dryer ducts and is about $450?
I wonder if running some 1/2" poly to the outside, connected to my skimmer would bypass the need of any of this.
Thanks for sharing.

[DRThompson]

Havnt been able to find the wayfair sodalime in a while; I think they stopped selling it.

For those still interested, it's still available on shopmedvet in the 3lb bags.

I also found some available on amazon - Jorvet J0553B Soda Lime Bucket. It's a 5 gallon bucket for $84 with free shipping.

[hkgar]

I found the Wayfair product at Ebay a couple of days ago.

This link may get you there.


http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0&_nkw=Molecular+Products+Gallon+Pail+Sodalime&_sacat=0

Free shipping and $93 for 37 lbs

[delmo]

I have attempted to kill 2 birds with 1 stone, and wondered if anyone has some intellectual insight on this. I have always had a co2 problem suppressing my pH. I have been using an Avast ozone reactor and this helps keep my pH up a little, along with keeping the water nice. Some time ago I came across this thread and have been using soda lime media on the air intake of my skimmer. I wanted to kick it up a notch and started using soda media in between my ozonator ad ozone reactor, so it goes: Air pump into dryer, into ozonator, into soda lime, into ozone reactor. Anyone see a problem with this?

[bertoni]

That should work. I don't know of a cheap soda lime source, though.

[delmo]

http://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag/anesthesia-products
This is what I use.

[DRThompson]

This is what I use.

Same here

Have also found Sodalime on:
Amazon
Ebay
Overstock
AIRGAS has a regonal branch here in Fort Lauderdale but I havnt tried dealing with them direct

[NeverlosT]

Here is a link to Soda Lime under the name of Sodasorb HP works out to $2.14 a pound before shipping.
Sodasorb HP (http://www.diverssupplyinc.net/browse.cfm/4,1386.html)

The Sodasorb is a good price but darn shipping is like $60! that is almost as expensive as the media

[tklb]

My house has a gas stove, furnace, and water heater. I have a home CO2 monitor that tracks the CO2 levels in my house. Anytime the Water Heater or Stove is used the CO2 Levels go from around 500/600 to up around 1000 or higher. This always kept my PH changing. I thought about running CO2 media, but ended up running my skimmer air intake outside. Other than the cost of some tubing & PVC to run it outside, it is free.

Am I missing something? Is this not doing the same thing the CO2 Media would (to a lesser degree)? Either way, the overall CO2 is lowered in the tank, because the skimmer is not pulling as much CO2 into the tank, but the surface agitation will still allow the higher home CO2 to work it's way into the tank, right? I think I will always have an issue unless I address my home's CO2 Issue.

[delmo]

Are you confusing Carbon Monoxide (CO, poisonous) for Carbon Dioxide (CO2)? A CO2 detector is rather unorthodox and costly, (but at 1000ppm you'd be sick, so maybe?)a CO detector is common and needed around some natural gas/lp appliances. (I work for a natural gas utility)
But yes, running your skimmer air intake from a line outside would probably eliminate the need for a CO2 scrubber. But in my case, I would have to run a line through my living room 20ft. to pipe in outside air. (Concrete walls and celing, the Misses would not approve )

Sent from my SM-N915T using Tapatalk

[DRThompson]

Any clean combustion of gas (blue flame) should emit mostly CO2>CO I believe. Not only will burning those fuels create additional CO2 in the house but they will also use up available oxygen.

Here's the simplified equation: burning one unit of methane (CH4) uses up 2 oxygen to produce one CO2.

CH4 + 2(O2) ----> CO2 + 2(H2O) + energy/heat

Moving the skimmer intake to outside fresh air is a good idea in general. For many of us it's just not practical.

[delmo]

Yep. (If you starve the appliance for O2, then you get CO instead of CO2)

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[tklb]

No, I am not confusing CO and CO2. It is a $90 CO2 Monitor

http://www.co2meter.com/products/co2mini-co2-indoor-air-quality-monitor

And no you don't get sick from 1000 PPM of CO2
https://www.kane.co.uk/knowledge-centre/what-are-safe-levels-of-co-and-co2-in-rooms

I run my Skimmer Intake up into the attic, then out through the side of the house. Once I get into the wall, I go up in airline size, then once in the attic, I go up to 1-1/4 in PVC. That way I get good airflow through the long tube.

[tmz]

I've used the airgas and medvet products. The airgas uses smaller granules with more surface area and lasts bit longer. Both are reasonably priced .Both are used in CO2 control in antesthia use for humans and animals respectively.

[delmo]

No, I am not confusing CO and CO2. It is a $90 CO2 Monitor

http://www.co2meter.com/products/co2mini-co2-indoor-air-quality-monitor

And no you don't get sick from 1000 PPM of CO2
https://www.kane.co.uk/knowledge-centre/what-are-safe-levels-of-co-and-co2-in-rooms

I run my Skimmer Intake up into the attic, then out through the side of the house. Once I get into the wall, I go up in airline size, then once in the attic, I go up to 1-1/4 in PVC. That way I get good airflow through the long tube.
I never said you can get sick from CO2. I was referring that you would be sick if you had 1,000ppm of CO however.
That is an unorthodox monitor, but a good tool.
Sounds like you have no need for soda lime.

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[hkgar]

I never said you can get sick from CO2. I was referring that you would be sick if you had 1,000ppm of CO however.
That is an unorthodox monitor, but a good tool.
Sounds like you have no need for soda lime.

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Well, you can get sick, but it takes a lot:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16499405

[delmo]

I got curious and found the same CO2 monitor on Amazon for $62. I found I have about 400ppm CO2 with windows open, and about 1200ppm with windows closed after a day. 2 people and a cat... geez. No wonder I have pH issues.

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[tmz]

Athmospheric CO2 levels are around 399ppm,IIRC. You probably need to run an airline to the skimmer, use a scrubber and/or dose some calcium hyrdoxide( kalk) in lieu of other alk calcium supplements or stop breathing.

What is the pH at 400ppm room air vs 1200 btw?

[delmo]

Yeah I stated before an airline isn't quite feasible. And I use a scrubber. At 400ish my pH is 8.1 to 8.2 and at 1200 it's about 7.9 to 8.05 when the soda lime is depleated, it's 7.7 to 7.9
Dkh between 9 and 10

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[tmz]

Thanks for the data points.

[Jamesmost]

Hmmmm very interesting...
My ph won't go over 7.89
Open tank
Closed windows....
Was looking of local sodalime to make a scrubber,,,
Gonna order a c02 meter
Crack a window
Run a tube for intake
And monitor......

[robbous]

Following I'll be using a scrubber soon and looking for good deals on co2. Scrubber media

[DRThompson]

http://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag/anesthesia-products

This is still the cheapest source i've found for the sodalime

[robbous]

http://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag/anesthesia-products

This is still the cheapest source i've found for the sodalime

Just purchased a 5 Gallon bucket

[hkgar]

Just purchased a 5 Gallon bucket

Any idea how much it weighs?

[robbous]

Any idea how much it weighs?

according to my UPS tracking number its 41.9 LBS that is for a 5 gallon bucket

[hkgar]

according to my UPS tracking number its 41.9 LBS that is for a 5 gallon bucket

Thanks

[Jamesmost]

Been running scrubber with brs media , not much difference,
Gonna change media and monitor
Maybe drill a hole in the wall for air line intake

[delmo]

I have found an interesting phenomenon when a low pressure system is nearing or plowing over like a hurricane or tropical storm, I've found that atmospheric co2 levels go from about 390ppm to 300ppm. Just a south Florida observation I meant to share a while back.

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[bertoni]

That's quite a change. What kind of device are you using to do the measurements?

[djray77]

Any updates on the best place to purchase sodalime? I mean it is almost 2020 now LOL!.

[CVReefer]

I get mine here. Each one has lasted about 8 mo

https://www.google.com/shopping/product/10562476190064647924?q=soda+lime&prds=epd:1203566395730356040,prmr:3,tpim:CMC4_NSb1cTLcRCUl76MicPlpXoYsO-ZLyIDVVNEKKCx9-4FMJPTSg,pdprs:5,cs:1&utm_medium=tu_cu&utm_source=tu&utm_content=eid-lsjeuxoeqt&utm_campaign=1223059&gclid=Cj0KCQiAtrnuBRDXARIsABiN-7ANg-JJVWx6RdiTTmyJhGioIN8xHHhMzTtiiEbIeDpcR9nc4TpE6GoaAuypEALw_wcB

Reef Geek 3D Printing

[hkgar]

Best I have found
https://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag?r=GSS17&p=GSS17&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkIiCi8Pq5QIVisVkCh1apANREAQYASABEgIPy_D_BwE

[DRThompson]

Best I have found
https://www.shopmedvet.com/product/soda-lime-3-lb-bag?r=GSS17&p=GSS17&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkIiCi8Pq5QIVisVkCh1apANREAQYASABEgIPy_D_BwE

agreed, I've never found it cheaper.

[Lavoisier]

agreed, I've never found it cheaper.

Ditto that. I ordered the 5lb bucket.